#st 5 analysis

[whispering-goat]

If the Duffer Brothers genuinely had used ChatGPT to write their scripts, they wouldn't have allowed the documentary to show their 3 ChatGPT tabs, because that's more than reputation ruining. Any self-respecting artist would not willingly participate in their own character assassination. Unless...

It's satire.

This is satire. Come on guys, let's rub our brain cells together one last time. What's happening? This is classic rage bait and y'all are falling for it.

I don't even like the guys or their methods, but it's clear as day.

Edit: so many likes and some great responses, my faith in humanity is restored a bit.

[violetjellybeans]

I don't know if any one else noticed this, but in ep 7, The Bridge, when the kids are talking to Henry about wanting to bring Holly "back to the light", her friends mention her having a "crush" on Josh, and Holly's other friends even add emphasis to it. By using words like hard, totally when one of the other boys (whom I'm assuming to be this Josh) says "no she doesn't".

When I watched that scene for the first time, it was kind of funny, but I didn't pay much attention, and it got lost in the moment eventually. I was also kind of confused on the intention behind adding that whole ordeal when they are clearly talking about something so serious,

but now on my second my rewatch, I am connecting some dots.

• First of all, whom else do we consider an exact copy of Holly in behavior and mannerisms?

Mike.

•Whom do we know is known to be in love or "crushing hard" on Mike (connecting to Josh here)?

Will.

•Whom do we know to deny the idea of his love/crush ever loving him back other than Josh?

Will.

In the show, Holly is said to be exactly like her brother on multiple occasions. So we can say she directly parallels to Mike.

Holly has a crush on Josh, who denied it by saying that Holly doesn't. But I am assuming that in this case scenario, Josh does like Holly too, and is just denying it due to being flustered or something along the lines of it.

Will is in love with Mike, but worded out his feelings as a "crush", and denied in his monologue any instances of Mike liking him back because "he is not like him".

Will in this case scenario directly parallels to Josh.

Are you with me in on where I am going with this?

Also, Holly's best friend's parallel to s2 Mike:

Well, not exactly the dialogues, but mostly the tone of voice used. Both Mike and the girl (whose name I don't remember) have a certaincy in their tone, which is very protective and sure to hear.

Mike is talking about not letting The Shadow Monster know about Will spying back on him, and the girl is talking about bringing Holly back to the light since they won't fail (in defeating the monster, or the "black thing" as Henry calls it) once Holly is back to light.

Which brings me back to paralleling Holly with Mike:

Vecna will fail once Mike is back to the light. Our boy Mikey is still lost in the dark, and the only way to truly defeat Vecna is to bring him back to the light and make him come to terms with what he really feels.

Also, I think making Henry say the line "Perhaps I have failed, and the Black Thing (the shadow monster) has won." is actually a very clever choice since we know that in the The First Shadow, Henry in fact did fail against Brenner and the The Shadow monster and was caught by it once he lost his trust in love.

There is an emphasis on the word "have" for the way Henry says it, like he really has already failed against the black thing when he battled against it before.

[thy-lovelylionheart]

Ik people are upset about El’s costuming in s5 being emblematic of a superhero, but here’s the thing:

The thing about Wonder Woman, Superman, Spider-Man — it’s that they’re both. They’re both. They’re a superhero and a normal person. They’re Diana Prince and Wonder Woman. Clark Kent and Superman. Spider-Man and Peter Parker.

She is Eleven and Jane Hopper. She’s both. She’s a superhero and a normal girl. But in s5, she’s a fugitive, essentially a vigilante, having to train to fight Vecna — she can’t be just Jane Hopper right now because unlike the other teens, she can’t safely go to school or be out and about in public. That’s her current reality right now; she has to don the cape and likely won’t be able to drop it until after the final battle.

That’s not reducing El to only a superhero. That’s acknowledging the reality of the situation they are in. It’s acknowledging that she has a goal and a mission and people to fight for and protect, and that she wants to get stronger in order to do her utmost in this final showdown in order to protect her loved ones and to secure her own future as Jane Hopper or whoever she becomes. She is fighting for herself as well.

Part of El determining in s4 that she’s not the monster is finding personal internal validation with who she is, her powers, her strength, her identity. That doesn’t include rejecting her powers, or rejecting the idea that she can be a superhero. She is the literal definition of a superhero — “a benevolent fictional character with superpowers.”

But she also rejects the idea that this is all she is. And that’s what the core issue she had with Mike was in s4. He was only ever able to see her as a superhero even when she was Jane Hopper in Lenora, California. He claims he romantically loves her with or without her powers during his monologue, and yet he was unable to say he loves her when she was standing in front of him as Jane Hopper and has only said it when she was Eleven, Superhero.

Imagine Lois Lane only telling Superman she loves him and not Clark Kent, despite knowing they’re one and the same. People would understand that she doesn’t actually love the person who is both Superman and Clark Kent, but just the superhero.

So in s5, I think the reason they’re putting El in these clothes is to show us her at peace with herself and her powers, confident and proud, while also showing us the Apparent Ideal™ from Mike’s monologue, the exact El he claims to be in love with, and then showing us that even when she is everything Mike claims to want and love, the Ultimate Superhero Girlfriend™ — he’s not in love with her. It would show to the audience that their “issues” could be as “fixed” as possible (Mike finally saying he loves El, El not viewing herself as a monster & achieving self-love) and they still don’t work.

[whispering-goat]

One Last Adventure: Not the mockumentary we wanted, but the one we got (Part 1/?)

My friend @milllllllk and I have decided to watch this doc, so other people are spared. We're not going to deeply analyze every scene (famous last words), but just pick the funniest or memorable moments. You guys are allowed to analyze and ridicule, whatever you want.

We got into the first 40 minutes today, because we are super confused and had to pause multiple times. We'll give some spark notes and highlight what's really odd.

First 15 minutes:

- They immediately talk about how endings should feel satisfying for the fans (lol, lmao even)

- A very out of pocket conversation about El dying or not dying, it's been shared around already. It's filmed like The Office, with eye rolls and a stifled laugh from one of the writers included.

- The doc goes back and forth between actually moving and inspiring stories by/about the production team (set and costumes designers, camera people, etc) and the cast, and then back to the Duffers not making sense, fumbling and stumbling about. Some of those Duffer exchanges are definitely scripted. It gets worse over time. The tonal dissonance is very noticeable throughout.

15 min in:

- paraphrased "We had lovely, safe childhoods, we lived in a bubble" NO WAY might explain the lack of empathy from you guys \lh

- some circle jerking about their first movie, didn't expect the John Woo mention as one of their inspirations

- BTS of S5E1

- Aww all the actors are calling each other found family. Millie's sweet.

- paraphrased "Will is the heart and soul of S5" After vol 1, where?

- They're also constantly showing the actors and all the other staff having to direct the Duffers

- The core kids were so cute argh

- One of the Dufffers was just taking a random picture with his phone of Mike and Holly interfering in the middle of filming a scene. My friend's comment: [comes across like they're] just assholes doing nothing but gettin all the money and accolades

30 min in:

- BTS of S5E2

- The amazing acting skills of Holly and Karen's actresses are shown. Nancy and Max's actresses love that their characters turned out to be good role models for girls

- "It's the kind of thing no-one's gonna think about but it's gonna have an effect. AUDIENCES ARE GETTING INCREASINGLY SAVVY TO LOTS OF CUTS" my friend capslocked, because the Duffers said that, while they made obvious amateur-ish cuts in the entirety of Vol 2 and 3

- Okay this made my friend and I pause we don't know what this means at all. I'll share a video of this tomorrow. A veryyy weirddd scripted exchange. In the middle of filming Karen's fight with the demo, a costume designer comes out to ask about Kali's costume. The Duffers spoil that she's going to get shot, describing the blood spatters in gory details, the costume designer is visibly shocked. Then, right after that we get a shot of a bunch of producers standing in a circle around one of the Duffers, who is complaining about having no time to write the plot and having to fill it out some with fluff, because he is so busy with his kids. The producers commiserate, but also look a bit befuddled.

- We got tired after this bullshit, but we did catch that the Duffers were talking with a lot of care and passion about choreographing the Demogorgons in the Mac-Z fight, so "Demogorgon Fatigue" feels very contradictory to this.

We are super intrigued, we don't know what we're watching. Until next time!

[whispering-goat]

Hello! I absolutely love reading your analyses. I was thinking about new ST5 content and when it could potentially come out. Do you think there's any possibility of it coming out on March 22? It's the only date other than November 6 that has significance in the show that I can think of. It's also a Sunday this year, so probably better for Netflix than a random weekday, right?

I do think that it's still pretty far away and if there is new content, I hope they will release it soon, because from what I've seen, interest is decreasing, especially among the GA.

Thank you :D I really can't believe that my thoughts somehow are entertaining people, but here we are!

One of the hardest problems in math is creating an accurate future prediction model. One of the main reasons my field still exists lol.

So, I can't give you an exact date. However, I can give you a range that I am fairly confident about. This range, the confidence interval, likely contains the mean. The mean is not quite the same as the true date, it's more like the middle of the interval around which the true date probably lies. I can't guarantee it as much as the inconsistencies not being coincidences. That one I am very sure about, because that is based on analysis of data from the past that isn't subject to change.

Before I start:

PSA: stop waiting for episodes to drop on specific dates. You are setting yourself up for disappointment. Just feel assured it will happen eventually.

With that out of the way, let's assume that the writers and Netflix have already decided on a date. What aspects have played the biggest role in deciding the date? (Which parameters hold the most weight?). I'll give the parameters stars from one to five (least to most) on how likely they have played a role in determining and influencing the date.

1. Important dates in Stranger Things universe

⭐

This idea that the release of the final volume somehow is tied to dates, like 22nd of March or 6th of November, could probably be written off completely. Considering that all the other seasons and volumes didn't come out on dates with significant in-universe connections, it doesn't make sense for them to start doing it now. Not setting it to zero stars, because "they felt like it" is... a possibility. These dates I would call outliers, from a statistical point of view.

2. Numerology

⭐⭐

This one is really popular here. Yes, there are a lot of fun numbers associated with the Stranger Things universe, like 7, 8, 11, 12, etc, but they're just that... numbers. That's why most predictions on this website have been wrong, you can add and subtract numbers in endless combinations to your hearts content, doesn't make it mean anything.

You could argue that the documentary was released on the 12th for a reason. Or, that Vecna's actor doing a Jimmy Fallon sketch saying "the countdown starts tomorrow" on the 6th, and counting down to 12 has some significance. I know that this, coming from Mr. "No Coincidences", might be a little upsetting, but they might just be teasing us or throwing us off.

I will still take the countdown into account though, because the ST social media team wanted us to notice it and include it in our puzzling. I set the 19th of January as a lower boundary of the range for now.

3. Promotion

⭐⭐⭐

This includes everything from keeping the social experiment running to celebrity appearances.

Finn Wolfhard's appearance on SNL shifts my lower boundary of the range to the 17th of January, considering it was scheduled after the release date had already been set. However, we all know he could just be giving more hints for an alternate finale to drop, so don't get your hopes up.

As it comes to the social experiment, a lot of resources had to be spent by Netflix and the ST team to keep it up for so long. The bulk of their promotion started 3 months ago and they're still going strong. Now, I am not an expert on how much advertisements cost and how much of their budget was allocated to it, but I take a guess that it's running out. I'll give it another month at most. Based on this, I'll set the upper boundary of the range to the 15th of February.

4. Attention Span

⭐⭐⭐⭐

When setting up the social experiment, the ST team had to make future predictions themselves. How quickly will people catch on? Will people even catch on? When will people lose interest? Seeing how they scheduled the documentary release on the 12th of January, it tells me that they thought people would lose interest in Stranger Things and theorizing about the finale in 12 days and needed new content to work with. That's less than two weeks. I honestly think they did an excellent job at predicting the fandom's behavior here.

I'll use their reasoning for my own prediction. We can go so far with little clues on social media, we need major content to drop to keep us engaged for longer. I set the 24th as a strong contender for the mean inside the range for now. It works, because it falls in the largest range we have so far, the 17th of January - 15th of February.

4. Netflix Scheduling

⭐⭐⭐⭐

Netflix has the release of Vol 1 and Vol 2 of Bridgerton, their other major flagship show, scheduled on the 29th of January and the 26th of February, respectively. I doubt they would want to interfere with that show, so I am inclined to shift my upper boundary of the range to the 29th of January.

Contrary to popular belief, Netflix doesn't have a preference for the weekend or Sundays. However, following the pattern of Vol 1 and Vol 2 of Season 5 release dates, I argue that Sunday, the 25th of January, is another strong contender for the mean of the confidence interval. It lies suspiciously close to the earlier 24th of January prediction. So I am fairly confident: we found the mean of the interval to be between or close to the 24th and 25th of January.

Final remarks

We have found our range! The biggest possible interval would be between the 17th of January and the 15th of February. The more refined interval is between the 19th of January and the 29th of January. The mean is between or close to the 24th and the 25th of January.

Edit: I have updated my upper bound to account for a margin of error: 15th of February ±2 days.

I hope that sufficiently answers the question. At the end of the day, regardless if I'm correct about the range for possible releases, the alternate finale has had to have been scheduled. The couple of reasons we wouldn't get an alternate ending is if:

- The Duffers don't intend to finish the story and the meta narrative they have been setting up for months (really?)

- Netflix interferes last minute (why?)

- Zeus strikes down all Netflix servers with his lightning and erases all content (ah shit Zeus why would you do that man?!)

⚡⚡⚡

[whispering-goat]

I'm giving a friendly hug to all the bylers who are on the conformitygate bus! There are a lot of moments where extra content can be dropped this month, not just today. Please remain calm and patient, and remember to have fun, even if it doesn't happen. A link to my master document on date and time speculations below. Edit: I wake up and see the exact scenario that I was expecting. 🥹

Personal additional theories:

- The Golden Globes end at 11PM EST on Jan 11th, the documentary is available at 3AM EST on Jan 12th. Plenty of time in between to release an episode! (what about.. 00:00 AM EST on Jan 12th, for example ✨, 12 o'clock on the 12th 👀)

- The doc might start as a mockumentary and turn into a new episode OR it's going to contain more hints, clues, plot holes, inconsistencies and meta commentary. Don't be disappointed if the latter happens, it's a real possibility.

- The WSQK has radio broadcasts planned for the 17th of January (as seen in my linked post). This means that there is a chance the extra content can be uploaded between 17th and 31st of January. Let's say, 25th of January for now (Vol1: 25th of November, Vol2: 25th of December). After January 31st conformitygate is bones, but I will check on March 22nd for shits and giggles.

Remember, only ride on the bus if you feel joy and whimsy while analyzing and brainstorming together, and if you are going to be fine regardless of the outcome. If it's affecting your mental health, it's better to disengage and come back when you feel better :)

Signing off, going to sleep!

Linked post is outdated now, but it contains the schedule for the WSQK.

Post by @whispering-goat · 10 links

💬 4  🔁 5  ❤️ 38 · Post by @justcallmedom31 · 1 video · I have seen compelling evidence for both the 11th and 12th of January (MAJOR EDIT: so

[whispering-goat]

I'm happy my thoughts and analyses have been resonating with so many people! BUT, even though I am one of the few driving the conformitygate bus, this is just a hypothesis at the end of the day:

"The finale of Stranger Things, the documentary and other press surrounding it are all part of a larger meta narrative and social experiment."

I'm trying to find blind spots, actually solid points that could potentially disprove this. As a mathematician, I am used to looking at counterarguments, to stress-test a theory. Please, share the ones you have found with me. I might not respond to all, but I will ponder about them and so should you! Let's not create an echo chamber.

This process has taught me that I am not immune to manipulation, gaslighting and propaganda. Yes, maybe we are close to seeing the truth in this particular case. What about all the other topics in the world we are not as invested in? I know for a fact I have believed stuff at face value before. Food for thought.

P.S.

I reject #divorcegate, it's misogynistic, Leigh Janiak is an accomplished writer and has put her name proudly on her own work, stop patronizing her and using her against her ex-husband (I'm a hypocrite, I regret reblogging #divorcegate posts, even if it was meant in jest)

P.P.S.

One point that has made me hesitate multiple times before, is Noah Schnapp. He seems like a kind sensitive soul that isn't really good at lying, and he actually seems disappointed with the outcome. But, I am biased and he reminds me of myself and my queer neurodivergent friends lol don't come for me.

Update:

Post by @whispering-goat

💬 4  🔁 3  ❤️ 27 · "The finale of Stranger Things, the documentary and other press surrounding it are all part of a larger meta narrative and

[whispering-goat]

I already had a suspicion the documentary would be a nothing burger (at first glance). I'm personally not going to watch it, but I would love to know from people if they've seen any clues, plot holes and inconsistencies in it! I'm convinced the writers of the show didn't suspect bylers and especially the GA to figure out what was wrong with the finale (Vecna winning and pulling the strings), so they had a doc planned with further hints. What do you guys think? I understand if you're tired of the game they're playing, same same.

There are still radio broadcasts scheduled from the Squawk, throughout the day on the 12th AND 17th. I wonder what will happen on the 17th? Edit: a couple of hours after I and other people on Tumblr posted about the Squawk's additional broadcasts, WSQK got wiped from the app, which could mean nothing.

I had another prediction that new content could potentially be released on the 25th of January, following the pattern of Vol 1 (November 25th) and Vol 2 (December 25th). BUT, honestly, that's as much as I am willing to play along. If nothing is released by then, I am cutting my losses!

Conformitygate is 100% real! What we found as a community are NOT coincidences. So, either the ending is supposed to be an extremely bitter pill to swallow or there will be a more satisfying resolution in the future.

I'm linking a wonderful post below by @considermeadream12 that shows the very intentional way the press around Stranger Things has been operating. I think the doc is just another part of it. I'll conclude with a screenshot from that post that spoke to me the most. I'm choosing the blue side :)

Post by @considermeadream12 · 10 images

💬 26  🔁 92  ❤️ 316 · The ENTIRETY of S5 is a play within a play - and the audience has been part of it for months (meta theory post) · Ok, I