Cinnamon rolls @thecinnamonr0ll - Tumblr Blog

lovingly holding onto my stupid yet hilarious headcanon that Ra's al Ghul called the Lazarus Pit(s) something important and hoity-toity (the "Sacred Waters" or the "Green Life" etc) but Gotham born and bred Bruce Wayne saw them for .01 seconds during his League of Assassins training, scoffed, and was like "...yeah, that's a pit in the ground, Ra's" and it caught on like wildfire.

deelovesbooks

^ op's tags ^ Res u continue to hide gold in these and it gets me every time 😂

dukeofgotham

hi i just wanna say how much i LOVE your reverse robins!au &how much i wanna hear soooooooo much more about it????? rrs has never drawn me in, in fact i activefly avoid it, but rn im SO interested in your idea and concept!?

[The Original Post]

Aww, thank you so much! I really really appreciate it. I definitely feel you in not liking Reverse Robins -- Personally, it is one of those AUs that I have always liked the potential of, but never found many fics that spoke to me. Especially recently, as my fanfiction tastes have gotten far pickier over the years (which is a completely separate post/rant about fanon and DC comics fandom).

I'm currently outlining the AU -- I have the whole timeline worked out, and now I'm working on each individual installment (currently vibing with the idea of a series so that I can go back and toss in one shots, rather than one long fic. But I'm not 100% settled). If you'd like, I'd be happy to tag you when I start publishing the story! Or anytime I talk about the AU on Tumblr (Honestly convinced I'm gonna be babbling about it for a while on this here blog). In the meantime, though, have some semi-random thoughts from me about the general premise! If you want to hear more about any specific aspect, feel free to ask and I'll happily answer!

~~~~

One of my biggest issues with Reverse Robins is that they tend to place Damian first, and then instead of actually working through the implications of having a traumatized assassin ten year old with no concept of a loving family place with an early brooding Bruce who does not have the maturity that comes from raising multiple kids, nor the support of Dick (who, let's be honest, is the major catalyst for Damian's development). Instead, it gets hand-waved away that "well, it just works out here, they're all chill" and Damian matures by himself into being a good big brother to all his siblings. Sure, I like Damian as a good big brother, but show me how you get there, you know?

I think that is at least somewhat solved with Duke being first, rather than coming in second. Actually, I hold that Duke makes way more sense to be the oldest in this type of AU for the following reasons:

The way he comes to live with Bruce, i.e. his parents being Jokerized in an attempt to recreate the Waynes' murder, is way more poetic of an opening for Bruce to adopt his first kid. It mimics Dick's origin well, and, like in my original post, imagine a 24 year old Bruce seeing a kid just like him?? Good Soup.

Lark. If you didn't know, that's the name Duke was originally considering before Bruce said it was "too soft" (Batman & The Signal #1). In RR!AUs, either they come up with some convoluted reason why the kids are called "Robin" that reads as forced or they choose an alternative name, such as "Shadowbat", "Batboy/girl", "Shrike", or some such. No hate to people who choose to do either, but… meh. I'm certainly not a fan. Lark, though? Now that's a nice bird theme that sounds pretty good, and is actually tied to the first person who holds the Mantle. So by the time Dick comes along, he can choose to be "Robin" and not stray far from either of his families' legacies.

As previously mentioned, I think it works better than Damian being first. For one, Duke's personality lends more to being an older brother (yes, I am thinking of that scene in We Are Robin when he takes Damian to the movies). For another, he'd certainly be able to mellow out Damian in a way just solo Bruce couldn't (not that I don't think Damian absolutely wouldn't try to stab Duke. He totally would try.).

Duke definitely sets up "Batman's partner as his Hope/Light" better than Damian. He really is, in a way, the spiritual successor to Dick as Robin (In this AU). A lot of RR!AUs tend to feel darker, and I think part of the issue stems from there not being the same philosophy/themes behind the "Robin" characters.

I've always thought of Fanfiction as a game of chess – all the pieces can only move in certain ways, and yet there are an infinite number of ways to win the game. Likewise, Characters only behave in ways true to their characterizations, and the stories come from seeing how they move within different situations.

The fun is figuring out a Reverse Robins AU that is actually accurate to the characters -- not just copying and pasting their traumas onto each other -- while still emulating of the original canon. The second big reason that I get turned off so easily by these is that they just transpose the characterization as needed. Damian becomes the solid older brother who is always there for his siblings. Tim (or sometimes Steph) just becomes the tragic Red Hood, angry at Bruce and a lone wolf who purposefully stays distant from the family. If Steph is in it and not Red Hood, then she gets slapped with the Oracle role and personality, despite not actually fitting her. Jason becomes… well, usually he doesn't have much since no one knows what to do with him if he isn't Red Hood. Though he does tend to feel like a slightly less depressed Tim. That leave Dick, who is just a classic cheerful Robin. Very rarely will Cass appear, but usually people just keep her as a silent, personality-less cardboard cutout more reminiscent of a movie extra (or her Post-New 52 characterization). I have read I believe one RR!AU with Duke, and while he didn't appear all that much, he felt more like a watered down Dick than himself.

This is what I'm hoping to avoid, by focusing on how each individual character would actually act in this situation, and not just what would make a good story that readers can point at and go "look, that references the original!"

For instance, Stephanie taking up a Red Hood role. In my AU, she's the Third Lark, and dies amidst a gang war at the hand of Black Mask (she's not replacing anyone in this AU, and Bruce willingly took her in, so it varies from War Games in a few places). Sure, I'm taking inspiration from the comics in that she's actually going to die, come back to life, and spend some time in the League, but here's where we split. Her death happened for a different reason than Jason's -- Black Mask is a different kind of villain from Joker -- Stephanie is a different character than The Red Hood. So she's not going to go on a murder spree trying to prove Bruce's philosophy wrong, and get vengeance for Bruce not killing Black Mask. I think something more true to her character is to focus on her insecurity -- she dies, and she thinks she failed. She comes back and takes over Black Mask's operation, shutting him down, brutally managing the criminal underbelly, all in an attempt to prove herself to Bruce. All the areas where she failed before, she now has iron-clad control of. Sure, the Lazarus Pit twists her to an extent, but how it does so differs from Jason because the underlying themes of each of their stories are different.

(Jason becomes the Red Hood because he thinks it is necessary, because he thinks Bruce doesn't do enough for the city, and his own death was proof of that. Steph becomes the Spoiler because she feels she was a failure who wasn't good enough and wants to prove that she is worthy of Bruce. That she can handle Gotham and all her criminals. But she's unable to see that the only one who blames her for dying is herself -- she never had to prove herself, she just had to come home. I might not be the most clear with this, and for that I apologize -- it will make more sense in the actual story than my unedited ramblings).

So… yeah.

I have a profound passion for every single member of the Batfamily, and seeing how they'd all interact in this universe gets me so freaking excited. Thank you again for getting excited with me! I hope this post wasn't too awful to read, and that you stick around. I can wait to share more (and once agian, please feel free to ask any other questions you might have. I currently only have my sister and my google doc to rant to about this)

mikakuna

babygirl jason todd they could never make me hate you. no one will ever convince me that jason todd is ugly. that's willis' little prince, you know he inherited his dad's good looks, and we know willis was pulling badass stunning women.

I just imagine a scenario where jason is with the bats, could be a gala or some civilian something, and they are all joking about looks and who can flirt and get more numbers and what not, and they're gonna make jason the butt of the joke as per usual, except a devastingly handsome, slightly older man approaches and is very VERY clearly interested in jason and ONLY jason. he isn't creepy or pushy, just earnest and whole heartedly smitten with jason.

and maybe they expect the man to receive a mean quip or a swift rejection. but instead, to their utter suprise, jason just blushes, really soft and gentle and takes the number handed to him on a slip of paper, batting his eyelashes and tucking a little curl behind his ear.

and all the bats are shocked, thats not at all what they were expected. And the thing is, IT KEEPS HAPPENING.

a middle aged woman, a young new CEO, a silver fox with a smooth accent, keep approaching jason throughout the night, with either hungry or starstruck eyes.

roaming over inky, bouncing curls, high cheekbones and clear skin, broad shoulders, supple chest, tiny waist, stunning ass and legs. just jason being devastingly attractive and people wanting him, and making it known. and jason just being overwhelmed and flattered but soaking it in.

YEAAAAA DEVASTATINGLY ATTRACTIVE JASON TODD

i think about this jason A LOT. he is the baby girl. willis calling him his prince was so stinking cute 😭 and YES. there is no way jason isn't canonically attractive considering willis' play.

I LOVEEEE YOUR DESCRIPTIONS

i always enjoy thinking about jason getting suitors and nobody expecting it (he doesn't either). and they're always so hot and so much older. jason strictly going for older people has to be my fav hc even tho it's also pretty canon LOL he loves him some pseudo parental figures that remind him of his mommy daddy issues

jason's reactions <3 he most definitely blushes all sweet and timid when someone earnestly compliments/flirts with him. thank you so much for this anon but now i want more :/

I love when people make Robin Dick the equivalent of the middle schooler that was adopted into a high school friend group and somehow is the scariest one

You have Batman, and his fully grown rogue gallery,

and then there’s just 8-year old Human traffic light Dick standing off to the side

I think I’d be funny if the villains were more scared of Robin Dick than Batman, because Dick is both trained as an acrobat and a crime fighter, and that boy can put the fear of god into the rogues

I want Dick to learn exactly how to harness his acrobatic skills to make it hurt, doing a handspring into a kick to add more power, using pipes as bare to swing off,

also I want to make this little child far too good at fighting, I want him to be like teen titans Robin I want him to tackle full grown men to the floor, I want him to be able to fist fight 12 goons at once and win

#Rogue hearing Dickbin’s signature laugh: OH GOD NOT HIM PLEASE-#Thanks for coming to my Tedtalk #dickbin #dick grayson #bruce wayne #gotham #dc robin #dc universe #dcu #dc comics #batman rogues

So I just saw your thing to batsandbirdbrains (I hope that’s the correct name) and am so happy someone else who follows them also knows about bats-and-the-birds since I think their ideas aren’t the exact same there is a lot of common themes.

While I love the idea of the younger boys just completely misinterpreting when Bruce talks about the first two robins based on their assumptions after knowing the adult versions. But sometimes I like to think through what would happen if the slant Bruce puts on the stories comes from his own pov and the flaws of memory.

Like so with Dick as he ages and matures and chills (externally at least) Bruce doesn’t remember the difficult times as well, partly due to nostalgia partly due to that thing that happens to parents where they forget how difficult kids are and just remember the cute parts. So while young dick has that anger to him there was also joy and when Bruce thinks back he thinks of that joy first.

Then with Jason while he was I really pretty happy there is an aggression/rough edge to him that he developed from crime alley, and while Bruce and dick by raising had to be performers and can hide that edge, Jason doesn’t know how to hide it. To him being defensive isn’t rude it’s how he knows to keep himself safe. But for the most part he’s just happy to have shelter and food and books. Then he does in the way he does and it devastates Bruce. And Bruce keeps thinking about how things could have been different is Jason just listened (even though he normally did) and Bruce hyperfixates on that to the point it masks any of the good memories.

And then of course Jason comes back as hood and it just validates everything Bruce has been thinking about him (aggressive, violent, out of control)

Then you can add what this does to Jason, to wake up from the Lazarus out severely traumatized and just so incredibly angry. But sometimes he gets the flashes of being happy and laughing with Bruce. But Jason can’t tell if those memories are really real or he just wants to believe in them and it’s just a fantasy cooked up in his very messed up head. Then he goes to Gotham and sees how everyone reacts to him after the reveal and it just reinforces to him that he’s always been this way and yeah. U think there’s just a lot of angst potential there.

Either way hopefully my semi insane rambling makes sense. I know both headcanons don’t really work together, but I think they are both just interesting and someone could tell very intesting stories with both. Just different vibes for different moods.

Either way, hope you have a good morning/day/evening/night. And that I don’t bother you to much by sending this

OH MY GOD YOU ABSOLUTE GENIUS

I love how these scenario works like a Mandela effect, bruce remembering more of the memories similar to his newer memories ( talking about Jason running away, instead of him helping uplift the people around him) and saying those first, talking about Jason’s disobedience and defensiveness, and only talking about that, because maybe if he warns the other kids, he won’t lose them and thinking back to Dick’s Joy first because that’s how he is of him nowadays (also his ignorance of Jaybin’s typical demeanor, in favor of the bad apples in his memories, is so intriguing to imagine)

also, Jason thinking that his Happiness is just a fantasy, a dream he could never have, is so good, he thinks that he was always this angry kid, who would provoke and fight those around him, that he never had happiness, that his whole life he only had grief, pain, and anger. (The Lazarus twisting his mind to only remember the worst is an additional interesting idea, that I might just have to write)

idea for Dick to think of Jaybin in a ‘bad’ light, we know he has hallucinations, so what if the two began to blend together in his thoughts, he begins to think of the boy hi would follow him around with stars in his eyes as the shadow blaming him for the death of his baby brother

Another idea, it could be added to a fic ‘past goes to the future fic’

so basically, in that fic, Jason might’ve been cursed by some magician/villain to ‘regain his inner child’ and the Batfamily meets this boy who spends most of his time reading, doing homework, or chatting with Alfred. I want Jason to look at this boy and realize that those flashes of happiness are real. I want him to look at this boy who giggles while running around in his Traffic light costume and realize that he was that boy.

also slightly different tangent, let’s say this is one of those Vaguely bad brother Dick, (more so angry at Bruce and pushing it onto Jason) Pre-Jason’s death, it’s be interesting to see if Jason thinks that the pit tainted his memories of Dick, and though he was the same he is now, (I think this could be an interesting especially if Dick blames himself for not being there for Jason, for not being able to save him)

I love your ideas, the thought of the Batfamily (Bruce) ignoring how the robins actually were in favor of the idea he creates in his head is so interesting!!!

I love when people ramble to me, you could have sent me a whole scientific research paper sized ask and I’d be bowing down and thanking you!