E is for Eidolon

For fandom stuff, such as when I just can't shut up about Supernatural.

[heller-meta-of-the-day]

July 18th, 2026

I think it's FUNNIER when people ship Cass and Dean "Don't you dare think that there is anything, past or present, that I would put in front of SAM" Winchester.

[catnipster69]

Yeah, being mad about sastiel because it’s not destiel—when wincest is right there? The emperor has no clothes.

[jinkieswouldyoulookatthis]

Also...

#like no one is ever doing a three way ship where both brothers are loving on castiel

My brother in Chuck, let me introduce you to Wincestiel!

[eisforeidolon]

Yeah, pointedly setting aside the typical malarkey of characterizing Dean and Castiel's interactions as 'constant homoeroticism', purposefully sidestepping basically everything about Sam and Dean's relationship, and that there are obvious scenes between Sam and Castiel someone could build a ship off of should they find such a thing appealing (e.g. the whole grace extraction interlude)? It's always funny to me when anyone makes this type of claim: that pairing doesn't have a ship name, no one ever is doing that, etc.

This is the SPN fandom. I guarantee there is and someone does - you just haven't looked hard enough. Case in point.

[walkergirlsposts]

Cas gets in the way of no ship. When did he ever???

Also you are allowed to dislike cas because of his actions and just for being an asshole plain and simple. Just because destiel is your main ship doesn't make it the fandoms. You're not the majority.

[beanjp]

It pisses me off SO MUCH that these weirdos insist everyone who watched this show was into romantic shipping. No assholes non shippers exist and in fact that describes the vast majority of the actual audience!!! Only the chronically online fan fiction readers even think about shipping on a show where virtually NO ROMANCE existed. 🤦‍♀️

[markofcandycain]

The idea that you must ship characters or you can't enjoy a show or didn't watch it properly is so exhausting. As is the idea that if you don't ship D€$ti€£ then you automatically ship Wincest.

No, I watched a show about brothers hunting monsters (with the friends that made along the way). I watched a show for a bit of gore, guns and gallantry. And I got that for 327 episodes.

I have plenty of reasons to hate Cas for the way he treated both Sam and Dean. Angels are dicks and no matter what holy tax accountant he was wearing, Cas was an angel.

The "main ship" only applies to those who are shipping at all. Most of us? We watched a show about saving people and hunting things. Not some teen drama romance shit.

[herefordeanspn]

WTF??? Literally not one single sentence in that tweet made any fucking sense. They didnt even answer the fucking question!!

"...their relationship doesn't have that factor that makes it click..."

>> So you're saying they don't click well together? Cuz they were best friends. Or are you trying to say their relationship didnt have an incest factor? Cuz that's true but completely unrelated to question you're supposedly replying to.

"...Cas gets in the way of their ships..."

>> The one and only time Cas ever kinda cock-blocked anyone was when he and Dean got kicked out of the club after he told the girl her dad left cuz he didnt like his job at the post office. But even that is just derailing a hookup not a ship. Unless you blame Cas for erasing Lisa's memory, but that ship was doomed for so many other reasons anyway. Although I would've loved to see Cas flat out refuse to do what Dean asked that time, you know like all the other times he straight up said NO when Dean begged him for something (not to work with Crowley, not to open purgatory, not to trust Metatron, to expel Lucifer, not to torture Donatello, etc) but "Cas only listens when it aligns with what he wants cause he's a dick" would've been a better response to the actual question.

I'm not even gonna touch the destial main ship bullshit cuz my rant would be too long and that ignorant child is never gonna see this anyway.

Chuck Almighty please zap away all the stupid people cuz I just can't handle this nonsense🙏

...and this is why I dont have twitter...

[eisforeidolon]

The thing is, it's not an inherently bad thing some people in fandom are really just in it for the shipping. Fandom is about taking the canon and running with it in whatever direction you want. The problem is myopic weirdos like this one who think since the only thing that matters to them is shipping, that's the only thing that matters, period. That's how they bring up the question without actually addressing it at all and think they've said something - all that matters is ships, so anyone hating Castiel can only be about shipping, not anything the character has actually done! Even less cult-y D/C shippers would understand the characters have importance and interest for fans outside of the potential to be smushed together, but awareness level 0% here.

Of course there's the typical equating the ship with the largest number of fanfics and spammy posts to being "The Main" ship - Supernatural is a fucking massive fandom where even comparative rarepairs are bigger than any ships in some smaller fandoms and there is a massive amount of genfic and other gen content for non-shippers. Who *gasp* exist - and typically feel a less urgent need to create fan content when they actually like are satisfied with the canon, so content =/= numbers. As well as an implied equating of the hardcore fandom with the entire audience which is mostly non-shippers and magnitudes larger - just because fandom is more mainstream these days does not make the loudest parts of it representative of the majority of the engagement for a canon.

To naturally end with the hilarity of typical heller-type bleating that Castiel gets in the way of other ships, so as to imply everyone else is just, like, jealous man. Which... fucking LOL. That's not how normal shipping that isn't obsessed with canonization works - shippers will happily full on ignore the existence of actual romantic partners to ship any other two characters they like better, up to and including ones who never even fucking meet in the canon. Even before you get to the part where it's clear they're they're talking about wincest from the 'not related' bit and it's a particular joke to think people shipping Sam & Dean, who spend basically the entire canon living in each others' pockets? Would be threatened by a guy who shows up during mere fractions of the run times of notably less than half the episodes - despite all their negative space meta, Castiel is very easy to just omit without comment and still arrive at canon-typical. Furthermore, remind me, who was it screaming/crying/throwing up thinking the Winchesters were actually gonna kiss in the finale? Being 'in the way' only even matters if you're trying to insist your ship has to be canon and the claim is fundamentally laughable on top of it (I swear half their arguments in any context are just NO U!!! about shit they do/think where it is painfully obviously not actually reversible).

So of course they have no awareness the nonsense they're spouting is nowhere near the same zip code as the deep well of answers to the actual question of what Castiel has done in the canon to make anyone hate him. Starting with threatening to throw Dean back into hell, continuing with a notable mile marker at breaking Sam's mental wall as a distraction, and ending the final seasons being an idiot ball-carrying sad washed out ghost of that original character pouting and whining about not being considered enough of a hero compared to the Winchesters as they continually have to fix his messes.

[heller-meta-of-the-day]

July 13th, 2026

Oh heller, if Dean was going to strangle ANY actor, I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be Jensen. 🤨

[jinkieswouldyoulookatthis]

#the homophobes in this fandom are almost all wincesties

And how does that work, exactly? Oh right! It's because we don't think Dean was in big romantic love with Castiel. Right, right, uh huh, yeah. See, I keep forgetting that the definition of "homophobe" is, apparently, "doesn't think Destiel was the real story of Supernatural."

[nancylou444]

Exactly, hellers should google "what does it mean to be homophobic" and NO WHERE will there be a mention of "disliking a m/m ship"

[eisforeidolon]

They really do genuinely think if they just scream ~*homophobia*~ at everyone and everything Jensen/the show/the larger audience will HAVE TO say their ship is real to "prove them wrong". You're not an evil bigot, ARE YOU?!? Except anyone with more than one working brain cell can see saying a specific m/m ship was not an intended part of a canon is not homophobic just because they interpreted the wallpaper to write fanfic instead of paying attention to the actual characters and plot.

Furthermore, I have rarely seen anything in this fandom as remotely homophobic as hellers themselves. Distill most of their "proofs" down to their fundamentals, mix them in a hat with shit proudly dyed in the wool homophobes say and try to differentiate. No one straight would sit like that. No heterosexual man would cry over a friend dying. That shirt is so gay. Did you see the way that guy made eye contact with the other one while talking, fucking gay. Men can't enthusiastically be fans of other dudes unless they want to fuck them. He's too pretty not to be into sex with men. No matter what they themselves say, I can tell someone's sexuality from how they speak/dress/act. And so on.

[wincestendgame]

barn scene reactions

more finale reactions because they are great

I would really love to see their reactions when they learned Jensen was the one who suggested all the touching lol

I'm cleaning my pc so I'll keep posting stuff like this, I think everybody deserves to enjoy these aushaus

[durinsbride]

This is food for my soul.

Stay mad, Hellers.

[walkergirlsposts]

Ever since what happened at Purcon, Helles/Destiews/Cockles have been on a rampage against Jensen, discrediting everything he has to say about his own character and the show to which he dedicated fifteen years of his life. They've been making threats against him and inciting hatred and harassment. They've doubled their efforts to hypersexualize his image to the point of tagging him in posts about him having erections or saying his only purpose is to be a "botton" for other men. They've been mocking his work and his physical appearance, as well as launching a new campaign to label him homophobic and repressed.

Do we really have to explain to these people why Jensen would prefer to be miles away from them and Mishit? Their level of self-awareness is about as low as a rock.

These are the most disgusting people in the fandom, the things they say and do. They shouldn't be allowed at conventions at all. CE should know by now which congoers are hellers.

[eisforeidolon]

One of the weirdest things to me about that side of the fandom, especially given there are supposed Jensen fans that feel right at home there? Is how they talk about Jared like a person and Jensen like a sex object. Sure, it's the All Jared Hate, All The Time Show but even when they talk about him as some kind of evil mastermind who deserves terrible things? He's a person with agency knowingly making decisions they hate.

Meanwhile, although they supposedly like Jensen, whenever he does or says something that reminds them their batshit fetish headcanons don't real outside the loony tunes bubble? He's a malfunctioning subhuman object they're pissed off they can't reprogram - he's too stupid to understand acting and his own or Dean's sexuality, he must not have meant what he said or only been saying it to appease someone else, he needs to just shut up and bend over because he's obviously only good for one thing looking the way he does, etc.

Obviously the vitriol and death threats Jared gets are disgusting, but the level of dehumanization and dismissal of Jensen's right to have any opinions or boundaries is it's own special kind of creepy.

[walkergirlsposts]

Yes. It's his and your fault for shoving it down his throat all these years. You know he doesn't like to be harassed about a ship, yet you do it over and over and over again.

[hippychick006]

Actually, Jensen is being completely “normal” in not wanting to be subjected to questions about ass babies and other fetish shit that you destiel shippers constantly try to force on him - aided and abetted by M who gave the ass baby answer at a previous con. He’s absolutely normal for setting boundaries and only wanting to talk about show canon and not the show fanon you made up (once again aided by M who has only ever been interested in money, “popularity” and fucking over J2)

[eisforeidolon]

Exactly. Jensen IS consistently perfectly normal about D/C questions. Which involves patiently explaining his knowledge as one of the stars of the show - the ship was not something he ever played into, never part of canon Dean's story, and being firm that he's not interested in discussing their fucking weird OOC fanfic instead. There is nothing at all strange about him being terse with disrespectful supposed fans who attempt to verbally trap him with trick questions or argue about his answers.

It is also accurate to say Jensen could have a much more consistently comfortable experience at cons if Misha hadn't spent years shamelessly egging on the least normal people in the fandom to feel entitled to be even weirder and more boundary-crossing. Who, as usual, are desperately trying to redefine words to claim not pathetically bending over to validate their every whim is somehow abnormal.

[walkergirlsposts]

Had kids together??? Ewwwwww.

[nancylou444]

This sounds like bad fanfic, not what actually happened in the show. 🤨

[eisforeidolon]

literally had cas confess his love

For a certain value of ambiguous, unspecified type of love as he was being killed off so Misha could sell merch - while Dean looked at him with a blank-faced expression and even the script explicitly indicated he could not reciprocate.

had kids together

We're talking about the show, absurd meta and OOC fanfic doesn't count.

had misha say he played cas in love

Misha being a shameless grifter is not a flex. Also, he is not only pathetically inconsistent depending on who else is in the room, he's been known from the beginning as the cast troll who intentionally says outrageous shit to get a reaction and stir the pot.

writers admit to subtext

Did they really, or did they tell you they intended nothing but pandered by saying they could see how you see it? Also, how many writers out of the total was that again? And how many showrunners? Right.

ripped through time & space to save eachother

We're talking about the show, absurd meta and OOC fanfic doesn't count.

fell apart w/out eachother

We're talking about the show, absurd meta and OOC fanfic doesn't count.

eye fucked 24/7

Not only less so than Sam and Dean, but Castiel literally wasn't even there remotely close to 24/7, lol.

dean flirted

We're talking about the show, absurd meta and OOC fanfic doesn't count. Nor do cringe-y gay jokes that obviously weren't meant seriously.

but we're insane for shipping them

For shipping them? No, if they were literally from different canons and never met it wouldn't be insane to ship them. But for insisting it was actually in the show because you read a bunch of meta interpreting the wallpaper instead of paying attention to what actually happened and its context? For screaming about supposed homophobia at anyone who doesn't agree your shipping is the center of the universe show, including the two lead actors in every episode? For only hearing what you want to hear? For trying to pretend you're on some kind of moral crusade instead of just being an entitled brat over a fucking CW show? Yeah, that shit IS bugfuck insane.

[walkergirlsposts]

https://www.tumblr.com/walkergirlsposts/819967082874716160/heller-king-well-it-sure-aint

One thing I will point out is that, in the clip that heller posted, Berens is repeatedly saying any queer subtext fans saw in this episode was not intentional in any way. He can easily see why people view it that way, but he keeps reaffirming that it was not intentional. So there’s that at least

So not intentional means canon. Yup. LMAO

[eisforeidolon]

Wait, wait, wait! Are you telling me a heller only half listened to something, heard only what they wanted to, and then started spreading pointedly out of context nonsense? Say it ain't so! Next thing you know, you're gonna tell me the sky is blue, too.

Still, even if Berens had said D/C was totes for real intentionally put in there with no caveats whatsoever on his part? Which would be a hilariously stupid and transparently baiting thing to say about an episode where he wrote Castiel thinking he was going on a date with his female boss? He's still one individual from a large stable of writers cycling through SPN's writers' room - one who only solo wrote 22 out of 327 episodes (~7%) where none of those were prior to season 9. He's still one of the pointedly worst offenders when it came to writing cringe-y out of character nonsense and I don't even mean any supposed romance, I mean writing Dean as a flat caricature of an angry bully and Castiel as a forgot-he's-fundamentally-not-human pathetic helpless sad woobie. He's still the only writer I would say genuinely and intentionally queerbaited anyone through what was put in the show, via that half-assed ambiguous clusterfuck of a speech by Castiel. He's still the one who was notoriously so pathetically butthurt he wasn't handed a spinoff he admitted he only stuck around for the final season to commit more character assassination write said scene for the hellers blowing smoke up his ass in the hopes it would give him a career boost [sad trombone]. In short, fuck that incompetent spiteful nobody and his pandering anyway.

[walkergirlsposts]

I mean, you at least have to SEE some romance??? And yes, it does have to be intentional from both parties? Otherwise it's just a one sided crush???

[eisforeidolon]

First of all, media literacy involves understanding what is literally in the media that actually exists and what is not. Yes, there does have to be some kind of actual explicit romance for it to genuinely be a romance.

Second of all, the fuck? For a romance to exist, it does, in fact, need to be fully intentional from all parties! I mean, I know we've said before that they pointedly don't understand consent, but holy shit, they don't understand consent. There are words for someone who tries to involve you in a romance that you do not 'fully intend' to be part of - and none of them are nice.

[eisforeidolon]

Prev anon here: maybe that's the post I was thinking of 🤔 Anyway, thank you, I appreciate it!

I can't be sure, since I don't see everything, but that's the one I remember seeing. Did you happen to find it? I had some extra time and tried to rustle up a link this afternoon but haven't had any luck. And no problem, wish I could have been more directly helpful.

[walkergirlsposts]

https://x.com/i/status/2067307170899632571

Its giving something like

"I like blue..

But most of the women I know doesn't even like the color blue. Its pink they prefer. Why are you lying. Its literally a lie. Pink is the way to go. I know your favorite color is pink".

😒

Well, Jensen says he didn't play Dean that way, not just the real fans. How can you be so stupid and claim he didn't even know how he was playing him?

[eisforeidolon]

God, they're fucking stupid.

The reason actors in avengers movies didn't know what they were playing/doing when shooting was because they weren't given full scripts or advance notice of certain events for fear of spoilers getting leaked. Not because actors generally just don't know wtf is going on, FFS.

That's entirely, obviously, embarrassingly different than Supernatural - or most acting, for that matter. [X][X]

[eisforeidolon]

Hi! This is a long shot, but there was a compilation post a while ago about scenes where Jensen removed the references to Cas in the scripts. Is there any chance you'd have an idea where I might find that post? Thank you! 🙏

The only one that I even remember was specifically just in regards to the original script for the finale, where two references to Castiel were removed. If there was a more general compilation I'm not sure I ever saw it.

Either way, I don't have it to hand, unfortunately, so I'm going to toss this out to anybody who sees this post, asking if anybody has a link or more details that might help in tracking it down.

[beanjp]

Is this not an incredibly homophobic thing to say? Hellers really are a mess of contradictions. Let’s just lean into homophobia and stereotypes. That’ll really get people to agree with us. 🤦‍♀️

[markofcandycain]

Extremely homophobic.

They absolutely aren't allies and don't care at all about representation. They harm the LGBTQ+ community far more than they could ever help. Not least because they are entirely motivated by fetishising queer people, and apparently relying on two straight men playing a straight human and a genderless celestial being for their "representation".

They're speaking like this, proudly displaying their homophobia more than ever, during pride month.

[eisforeidolon]

This is exactly why we say they don't even know what homophobia is let alone care about it - they just scream it over and over at everyone in the hopes it will get them what they want. Meanwhile, they spout harmful shit like this, claiming every bullshit stereotype about 'gay behavior' from the toxic masculinity playbook is valid and proof of their ship.

The thing is, in some ways, Dean Winchester actually is a progressive character. Because he is based out of that manly man stereotype of car gun dude womanizer. Except he cries and emotes all over the place instead of being endlessly stoic. Except he has deep emotional friendships, including with other men. Except he isn't disdainful of the women he sleeps or works with. Except he isn't homophobic or judgemental when dealing with non-straight characters they meet (even if he's sometimes surprised by his default assumptions at first). Oh, he's got his issues on various fronts for sure, but overall? He turns a fair few of those stereotypes of what a macho straight guy has to be on their heads. Hellers look at that and go LOL GAY!!! Like...

[spntea]

Destiel is not a canon show event you absolute moron.

[walkergirlsposts]

Feel safe?? Why? Is someone physically attacking you? What is wrong with these people? LMAO

[nancylou444]

Oh, but doesn't JENSEN deserve to feel safe from being called a 'homophobe' if he gives the wrong (anti destiel) answer?

Hellers you don't DESERVE respect if you don't respect others.

[eisforeidolon]

The thing is that they're right, but they're not saying what they actually mean.

If you are a D/C fan who paid to attend a con you absolutely should be able to go, feel safe, and ask reasonable questions, especially about canon events (as in, things that actually happened in the canon, not your elaborate fanfic about it).

What you are not fucking entitled to is making other people feel uncomfortable or unsafe as you scream everyone who doesn't see things your way is a homophobe oppressing you, phrase your repetitive and previously answered 'questions' as statements trying to demand the actors agree with you this time and get belligerent when they still don't, and generally be inconsiderate flaming assholes because you feel entitled to your cringe-y homophobic stereotype laden meta nonsense being validated. In short, make it clear over and over again you give zero shits about actual canon Supernatural - unlike the majority of the other people there.

[eisforeidolon]

Even if you take Dean saying he doesn’t “swing that” as him just being a sarcastic smartass to cops. He tells the vampire Boris, whom he thinks is hitting on him that he doesn’t “play for his team”. Which anyone that was around in the ‘90s understands the reference and what that means. He’s not being a smartass he’s genuinely telling someone he’s straight. Not something vague like “your not my type”.

Right. The thing is, this wasn't something he said once and was contradicted later. He said he didn't swing that way. He said he didn't play for that team. We saw his dating profile said seeking women. The explicitly romantic/sexual interactions and fantasies we saw him have were all with women (or things shaped like women he didn't know were monsters at the time). Cassie, Tara, Anna, Lisa, the amazon, Anne Marie, Daphne, etc.

Meanwhile they insist that doesn't matter because when he stands next to, smiles at, or looks at men he's talking to, it's sexual interest because because. That sexual encounters mentioned as happening off-screen must have involved direct m/m interaction because because. That the ONLY reason the show would focus less on him having flirtations or sexual encounters with women in the latter seasons was because he'd surely decided he wanted them with men instead because because.

I've said this before, but when it comes to Dean, specifically, they insist he must say some kind of specific magical Words of Straightness™ or it doesn't count and he's actually bi and just doesn't know it. Just compare that to how they treat Charlie's sexuality - or Sam's. It could not possibly be more transparently just about their personal shipper fantasies rather than the actual canon.

[walkergirlsposts]

Again - Jensen's not "headcanoning" Dean as straight. He's telling you he is. Learn the difference between headcanon and canon.

[nancylou444]

Further proof that hellers pay no attention to what Dean says since he said numerous times that he isn't interested in men THAT way. He IS canonically straight.

[eisforeidolon]

Exactly.

No, Jensen isn't 'headcanoning' or 'interpreting' anything in regards to his character's sexuality. Sure, Dean isn't straight just because Jensen says so - he's straight because Jensen is giving answers about his and the writers' intentions while making the show and the canon does, in fact, establish him as a straight character. Dean only showing explicitly sexual/romantic interest in women, seeking only women in dating apps, and directly saying he doesn't swing that way are canon. Their very colorful reinterpretations of how he looks at people, what he wears, the wallpaper, and loudly going NUH UH! ? Are not.

Furthermore, describing Jensen literally saying no, that's not in the show as being way over the top is just as disingenuous. He does not care about fanfic fans clearly know is fanfic or get hostile when asked about 'canon shit that happened in the goddamn show'. He speaks definitively when hostile fans ask him quote unquote questions by asserting bad meta as fact to try to make/trick him into agreeing with them. Being told no is not attacking you, you fucking weirdos.

[heller-meta-of-the-day]

June 9th, 2026

#and what do you think is the BIGGEST question MOST FANS will have after the end of the series????#regardless if you ship it or not like if you were watching this shit blind and that was the end wouldn’t you want to know??? Hellers really have NO idea what the show is about, do they? They are so focused on a fanon ship, they truly believe EVERYONE else is as well.

[catnipster69]

You mean this end of the show?

Agree. I also want to talk about how Sam and Dean were the loves of each other’s lives.

[jinkieswouldyoulookatthis]

And we can talk about that with Jared and Jensen without making them uncomfortable. Because not only was the show about "The Epic Love Story of Sam and Dean" (as Sera Gamble and Eric Kripke have referred to it) but we also know where the line is between the brothers' relationship in the show vs. the fanon ship.

If shippers of Destiel want to ask questions about Dean and Castiel's actual relationship in the show (friends and brothers-in-arms, and all the ups and downs they had) they are welcome to do so. The problems arise when it becomes apparent that the questioner doesn't know where the line between canon and fanon is.

Canon is fair game for asking the cast about.

Fanon should stay in fan only spaces, unless a cast member has made it clear that they are okay with discussing fanon. A few of them are, Jensen is not one of them.

As Mark Sheppard is so fond of saying, "Write your own fan fiction."

[eisforeidolon]

This.

The biggest questions most actual fans of the show are going to have upon finishing it are going to be about Sam and Dean and actual major storylines, not a side character's ambiguous awkward dying word vomit that's very similar to a previous almost-death scene (just with a smaller audience). Especially because they haven't spent years marinating in bad meta insisting a handful of throwaway jokes and interpretations of random colors, wardrobe, and wallpaper are a building storyline convincing them that scene was something more than throwing shippers a bone to fanfic about and sending off Castiel as a long-standing supporting character (to make him unavailable as a convenient healing machine for the big finale).

Even if general audience fans had some kind of burning questions about that scene? They're not going to approach it in a confrontational way, stating their demand it be somehow inherently seen as a reciprocal canon romantic relationship as a quote unquote question. They're going to actually want to ask a question and hear an answer about what's actually in the canon, not try to badger the actors into telling them what they want to hear about a ship.