just a practice sketch for drawing fuller figures
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just a practice sketch for drawing fuller figures
Description by @whats-the-word-again
Offerings for Hades
Hades is the Greek god of the dead and wealth, and the King of the Underworld. He is associated with the cornucopia, cypress, narcissus, keys, serpents, mint, white poplar, dog, pomegranate, sheep, cattle, screech owls, horses and chariots.
Offerings
- Bread and Cakes
- Black Coffee or Tea
- Pomegranates
- Apples
- Cerberus or Dog Imagery
- Mint/Peppermint
- Poppy Seeds
- Rosemary
- Thyme
- Coins
- Black Crystals
- Fossils/Bones
- Keys
- Snake Skin
- Dog Fur
- Dark Chocolate
Some Apollo and Hyacinthus because I remembered Hyacinthus is a Spartan Prince, and thusly shouldn't be a twink.
this hot version of hades lives in my head rent free
Honouring the Demigods before exercises.
Alexandra Nikaios, head-member of the Brazilian Hellenic Reconstructionism elaborated a prayer a few years ago to the demigods before doing physical exercises. It has been helping me out to use the exercises as a votice act to some of the Theoi and hemitheoi alike.
I sing to the Heroes, demigods of noble doings
Who wandered the world tirelessly
Performing their exploits in exemplary way
Give me strenght and virtue to continue!
(Portuguese)
Eu canto aos heróis, semideuses de nobre afazer,
Que vagavam pelo mundo sem esmorecer,
Realizando suas façanhas de forma exemplar:
Dêem-me força e virtude para continuar.
Sometimes I also say "Khairete Hemitheoi!" after I finish and pour a simple libation of water to them. The demigods and heroes can be quite good exemples of endurance, physical strength and wisdom.
Anyways, let's get physical, friends!
Errosthe! (Be strong!)
hey adrian !!! after seeing your posts about hero worship and looking into it im IN LOVE ! i wanna start worshipping achilles and patroclus so badly!!!! my friends studying with me and they want to look into worshipping helen of troy. just wanted to ask if you have any tips / advice for beginners, or if you could go a bit on details about how to contact the heroes to introduce yourself to them and start your practice; as im a beginner when it comes to paganism ive been kind of nervouse about it dkjdkd anways, thanks for all the help with your lovely posts so far, have a great day / night ! (sorry if this is too long im just reallt excited fkfkkd)
Hey!! And don’t feel bad, I’m happy to see someone so excited and passionate!! I’m happy to help anytime! Also, I literally adore Helene and feel free to hmu for Helene pdfs!
So, for beginning — take your time and care for yourself. I struggle with worship sometimes and I have to remember I am indeed mortal and need my needs met. I would begin just by giving small offerings from time to time and whispering your prayers towards the darkened earth. The heroes are below.
To contact heroes — go to a Liminal spot for easiest communication. You may also beat upon the earth to catch their attention as they did back then. Say a prayer and give an offering. If needed, build up your relationship with the likes of Hermes Chthonios, Haides, Persephone, etc. Some call upon them to allow easy communication with heroes.
Your biggest ally will be research. I’ve provided some information on my blog, so I hope it helps. For the eternal lovers, Achilles and Patroclus, rely upon the Iliad to reveal more. You can pull information from there to further build your praxis — that is where I got the idea to dedicate cooking to Patroclus, for example.
Most of all, you will do great. Trust yourself and the heroes, research and study, go at your own pace, etc. You’ll be fine and the heroes will adore you.
I hope you have a lovely day and enjoy your time with the heroes!
Prayer to Patroclus
"To courageous and loyal Patroclus, I pray
Beloved of mighty Achilles, best of the Greeks
You donned his armor and fearlessly charged into battle, never once losing faith
Your name is forever etched into history, alongside his
The two lovers who can never be separated, not on Earth nor in the Halls of Haides
Mighty Patroclus, may your loyalty and strong heart be eternally honored and praised
And may you help me find my own inner strength and passion, so that I may fight for myself and those I love
Khaire, great hero!"
Written by me, feel free to use
thinking about how orpheus turning to look back at eurydice isn’t a sign of mortal frailness but a sign of love
“Eurydice, dying now a second time, uttered no complaint against her husband. What was there to complain of, but that she had been loved?” ― Ovid, Metamorphoses
This is true no matter the version you're reading.
1. Eurydice trips and Orpheus turns to help her because he loves her.
2. Orpheus cannot hear Eurydice behind him, and fearing that he's been tricked, turns to make sure she's there.
3. Orpheus makes it out of the Underworld, and so full of love and excitement to be with Eurydice, turns to embrace her, forgetting that they both need to be out of the Underworld.
No matter what happens in the story, Orpheus loses Eurydice because his love for her compels him to look.
The current vibe.
a break between the battles
Hero worship is totally a thing! Many heroes were worshipped back in the day and modern pagans do as well, although it's certainly less common. Glad to see you enjoyed Song of Achilles, I picked it up recently and will eventually start actually reading aha.
Oh it's so good. Anyone who's gay as hell and loves greek myths will love it ❤️ It definitely tore my head out even though I was already familiar with the Iliad but damn was it good.
I'm so glad hero worship is a thing cause... 👉👈 Patroclus I'm lookin at you
👏 Stop👏Romanticizing👏Persephone 👏And 👏 Hades 👏 Relationship 👏
The older versions of the myth actually suggest she went to the Underworld willingly and chose to stay to get away from her mother. Some of the oldest myths don’t even include Hades in the story but rather have Persephone go down to tend to the miserable souls she heard in the ground without Hades even interacting with her.
There is no “pre-patriarchal” version of the Persephone myth where she rules the Underworld on her own and Hades isn’t present.
There is no “pre-patriarchal” version of the Persephone myth where she rules the Underworld on her own and Hades isn’t present.
There is no “pre-patriarchal” version of the Persephone myth where she rules the Underworld on her own and Hades isn’t present.
Please stop spreading this crap and misinforming people.
Persephone was however, empowered by her marriage to Hades. Placing her in a pre-patriarchal context, devoid of her greatest challenges and triumphs REDUCES her agency as a goddess and a feminist figure.
Who said pre-patriarchal? Because I sure didn’t. I’m just saying there are older versions of the myth such as the ones listed on this site:
http://tehomet.net/persephone.html
I’m not trying to misinform people. I’m trying to inform people of older versions of the myth they, much like yourself, might be unaware of. And seriously, pre-patriarchal? I literally never said that, nor have I ever used that term before now. But yeah, sure, go ahead and use that word all you like. Not like a version of the story where she became the badass queen of the Underworld all on her own without needing a man behind her makes her even more of a feminist figure as opposed to someone who was empowered BY her relationship to a MAN.
*Facepalms*
Oh wow, you read a website.
Now can you tell me the ancient sources that this story is referring to. Or at least some sources that are peer-reviewed and written by Classics PhDs.
The only source that states a “Persephone wonders down to the Underworld” tale is written by Charlene Spretnak in 1992 who, by her own admission, rewrote the myths so that her four year old daughter could read them and gain an interest in mythology. The tale is in itself a beautiful tale, but is a modern invention.
The actual tale of “Hades and Persephone” is found in Hesiod’s Theogony and The Homeric Hymn To Demeter.
Persephone’s empowerment came from the fact that her husband loved her so much that, despite living in a patriarchal society, he ensured that the would be his equal in everything. Besides this, the tale was written for women as it details the struggles that women faced then.
Persephone was quite often the goddess that many would call upon for aid. The tale of Orpheus is an excellent example of how they ruled together and made decisions together, with Persephone being able to persuade him to change his mind.
Hades and Persephone’s marriage was the ideal for the time and were often portrayed on the vases given to newlyweds. The were always portrayed as having loving, supportive marriage and he was the only major god that never had an affair (don’t believe that Roman bullshit).
Alright well, what I was talking about was the versions where Hades kidnaps his niece, bribes Zeus to not do anything, and Persephone is sad and depressed and only gets to see her mother, who she loves dearly, for half the year every year.
I wasn’t aware of the actual marriage they’re said to have had, which gave them happiness. It still makes me salty that people assumes she LOVES him though. She doesn’t feel towards him romantically, but their marriage is strong from m their partnership.
Zeus was not, quote, “bribed” not to do anything. In fact, everything that Hades did in the myth was legal.
Ancient Athenian wedding preparations began under cover of night with the bride being ‘abducted’ to the groom’s house in a chariot. The groom would give the bride gifts, and the families would feast together. During the ceremony, the bride would eat a piece of fruit given to her by her husband, typically an apple or pomegranate, to signify that her needs were now going to be provided for by her husband. Later, after the ceremony, the marriage was consummated.
In the myths, Zeus had earlier promised Hades his choice of wife since he was given the Underworld as his lot. Hades desired Persephone as his bride and arranges the marriage with Persephone’s father.
He presents a gift to her (the narcissus flower in the field of Nysa) and after Persephone accepts it by pulling it from the earth, he takes her into his chariot to bring her with him to her new home.
He gives her further honours once she gets to the Underworld to show his commitment and love for her Persephone eats pomegranate seeds given to her by Hades, signifying that she is bound to Hades as his wife.
Scholars believe that it was after the seeds, that Hades and Persephone consummated the marriage before Persephone went to see Demeter to assure her that she was all right.
The stretch of time between Kore’s transformation into Persephone is anywhere from a couple months to a year in the hymn— nine days between Demeter’s search and finding out from Hecate and Helios that Aidoneus had carried away her daughter, and the few months to a year she spends in Eleusis at her newly-built temple the Telesterion refusing to speak with the Olympians.
Even when Persephone is recounting her stay to her mother, she says nothing about ravishment, or rape, or seduction. Not a single word, whereas the writers would have made that abundantly clear in other texts about the abductions of other women. Basically there is no real evidence that she was ill-treated, abused, raped or in general badly treated by Hades; in fact, the HHTD directly mentions that Persephone was a guest of honour in Hades’ household.
Hades gets the bad rap in modern society even though he was the only Greek god who remained faithful to his wife because he became a Satan analogue after the rise of Christian monotheism and trinitarianism.
The original myth was a warning parable and morality tale of sorts, meant for its ancient audience… a morality parable that no longer resonates with modern society because women are no longer the property of their father or husband.
The moral of the story is this: you should respect and consult with your wife and speak with your daughter before marrying her off, otherwise life at home will be a living hell, not just for the father, but also the new husband.
Demeter makes Zeus’ life very difficult because he did not consult her in his choice of husband for Persephone. She sends a blight on all of Zeus’ worshippers until he fixes what he did without her consent.
Likewise, Persephone unwittingly accepted the marriage proposal of Hades without knowing that she had been given to him and resisted being taken away to be his wife. However, once she realizes how genuine Hades’ love is for her, as seen when he gives her the gift of equality in both rulership and marriage, as well as a portion of his own timai (honor) the honor bestowed upon him by mortals, she comes to the decision to accept the pomegranate seeds, thereby accepting his offer as a husband. The acceptance of the seeds in myth is a code for sexual intercourse since this was the last gift offering by the groom before consummating his marriage with the bride.
Once Persephone is with Demeter again, she lies about the pomegranate seeds, telling her mother that Hades ‘forced’ her to eat them, though we already know that all he did was slip her the pomegranate and she accepted in secret before she was about to be taken away.
This is despite the fact that Hades gave her the chance to leave and never have to see her again and well, she had plenty of reasons to accept his marriage.
Intriguingly enough, there are Ancient sources that support Persephone loving Hades.
Virgil, Georgics 1. 36 ff (trans. Fairclough) (Roman bucolic C1st B.C.)
“Tartarus hopes not for you [Caesar in the guise of Hades] as king, and may such monstrous lust of empire never seize you, though Greece is enchanted by the Elysian fields, and Proserpine reclaimed cares not to follow her mother.”
–> Persephone prefers to stay with Hades than returning to her mother.
Ovid, Metamorphoses, X:
Orpheus singing to Hades and Persephone:
“If able, I would bear it, I do not deny my effort—but the god of Love has conquered me—a god so kindly known in all the upper world. We are not sure he can be known so well in this deep world, but have good reason to conjecture he is not unknown here, and if old report almost forgotten, that you stole your wife is not a fiction, Love united you the same as others.”
–> Just like in Metamorphoses V, love is shown as something that unites two persons. More specifically, it is directly mentioned by Orpheus that Hades and Persephone are united in love.
Lucan, Pharsalia, VI:
The witch Erichtho calls upon the Underworld deities to allow her to bring back a dead person.
“…to Persephone who shuns her mother in heaven…”
“… I shall tell the world the nature of that food which confines Persephone beneath the huge weight of earth, the bond of love that unites her to the gloomy king of night, and the defilement she suffered, such that her mother would not call her back.”
–> Persephone is directly mentioned to have a dislike towards her mother, Demeter, and is specifially mentioned to have a bond of love with Hades. The so-called ‘defilement’ is a direct reference to the pomegrante and the loss of her virginity (In that time period, a virgin having sex was referred to as “defilement”).
Claudian, Rape of Proserpina
The brief summary of this is that while Hades is taking Persephone to the Underworld, a terrified Persephone cries and laments her fate. But Hades feels genuine remorse for the fact that he had to abduct her and comforts Persephone by wiping away her tears and swearing to her a good marriage. Immediately after this happens, Hades is no longer a gloomy and frightening figure to Persephone but is instead a cheerful and kind god. Persephone immediately perks up once she is aware of her situation (she is simply getting married), and a beautiful and joyful wedding is held at the underworld.
It’s a shame that Claudian never managed to finish his tale because it’s a beautiful take and directly hints at the fact that Hades and Persephone had children as this theme is brought up several times.
Lucian’s Dialogues of the dead
A man asks Hades permission to go back to life and he refuses constantly until Persephone gives a suggestion. Persephone addresses Hades as “my husband” and he says “Since it’s Persephone’s pleasure (I grant the favor)” or “I cannot refuse a lady”.
–> Despite the short dialogue, we can easily see that Hades and Persephone are depicted as possessing a peaceful marriage and are presented as a couple who rule with equal power, unlike the dialogues of Zeus and Hera where she actually cries for the things Zeus does to her (cheating).
And we can see generally, from the vase paintings or other texts (like Aristophanes Frogs) that the Greeks were in the belief that Hades and Persephone marriage was ideal. And in several religious cults, and in some cities, they would be the divine parallel of what an ideal marriage should be.
In the depictions (literary, artistic, etc.) where Hades and Persephone are shown together, they are always shown to be happy. Persephone is never portrayed as a miserable wife and Hades is never portrayed as a cruel husband. Hades and Persephone were idealized by ancient Greek women themselves.
It’s Hades and Persephone, not Zeus and Hera, who were depicted on pottery given to newlyweds. The fact that Persephone was much more prominent as a happily married queen, rather than the actual goddess of marriage, speaks volumes to how this story was thought about and regarded by the culture that owned it.
i know apollo is the god of healing, but do you think that extends to mental illness too?
Yes, it definitely does! Unlike Asclepius who is a physician concerned with only physical illness, Apollo is a healer who is in charge of both physical and mental well being. There are literary evidences too. For example, Olympiodorus says.
"These two, Asclepius and Plato, did Apollo beget; one that he may heal bodies, the other to heal souls."
– Olympiodorus, In Alcib. 2.165-167
This was apparently inscirbed on Plato's tomb. This indicates that Apollo healed not only human bodies, but also the psyche (mind/soul).
Now I'm not sure how mental illness was perceived and how far it was acknowledged in ancient greece. My first thought was that the madness (mania) sent to mortals as a punishment was seen as a form of mental illness. Wikipedia says I'm right. And Apollo is the god in charge of purification that will rid the mortals of that madness, the famous example being Orestes. He has himself undergone such purification on multiple occasions. So if such madness was seen as a mental disorder, and Apollo was the one to relieve it, that essentially makes him the psychotherapist. Another instance from mythology where, at least for me, Apollo acts as a therapist is when Aristaeus loses his son Actaeon and asks Apollo to help him cope with the grief.
"After the death of Aktaion (Actaeon), we are told, he [Aristaios (Aristaeus)] went to the oracle of his father, Apollon, who prophesied to him that he was to change his home to the island of Keos (Ceos) and told him likewise of the honours which would be his among the Keans."
- Diodorus Siculus, Library of History 4. 81. 1 (trans. Oldfather) (Greek historian C1st B.C.)
This reads to me as a depressed person being suggested to move to a different place so that he can feel better and recover.
Along with being the god of healing, Apollo is also the god of music, which is a very effective therapeutic agent. Callimachus states that Thetis is no more grieving for the loss of her son Achilles after listening to paeans, a type of song characteristic in cults of Apollo.
"Neither doth Thetis his mother wail her dirge for Achilles, when she hears Hië Paeëon, Hië Paeëon."
- Callimachus, Hymn to Apollo.
Apollo's role as a mind healer is also seen in Orphism. The fact that Orpheus shunned all other gods and worshipped only Apollo after his return from underworld (a distressing place for mortals + he lost his wife again there) shows the prominent role of Apollo as the god who soothes heart and mind. In Orphism, Apollo is “the cause of unity and that which reassembles the Many into One". Apollo signified the unification of the dismembered soul, as opposed to Dionysus who represented the dismemberment of soul. (hence we see him collecting the shredded parts of Zagreus and burying them or putting them back together).
“For everywhere Apollo unifies the multitude and gathers it into one: he uniformly prepossesses every kind of purification, cleansing the whole heavens and the birth, and all intramundane forms of life. He separates individual souls from the crass layers of matter."
- Proclus, on Plato Cratylus.
Apollo puts back together that what is broken or destroyed, and helps to separate the soul from sorrow. He is called Katharsios, the god of catharsis; Sotir, the one who soothes; Psychodotir, the giver of souls. He is the god of all healing arts. So yes his skills very much extend to mental well being as well. You probably hadn't expected this long ass answer but that's just how I am XD I hope this answered your doubt.
for uhm personal reasons I need to know all about feminine apollo so please tell me more
Aha, that's something I love to talk about. I was about to make a post about this anyway so: There's a lot of ancient greek vase paintings that show Apollo wearing feminine robes and accessories that were usually worn by women. For example,
a veil
(Heracles ascending to Olympus)
Multi pinned sleeve
(Apollo helping Hector in the Trojan war)
Cross sash
(The musical contest between Apollo and Marsyas)
Periskelis (the thigh band)
(Orestes seeking shelter at Delphi)
Here, he is wearing the chiton in a way that girls wore
And these lithographs of ancient art have him wear such pretty dresses
Since he is an eternal youth, 99% of the times he has long hair and youthful face - those are the very important physical traits of Apollo. There are many paintings where you will confuse Apollo for a girl.
Apart from these, I have found quite a few statues and marble reliefs too. Many of these are from Hellenistic Greece and Roman era:
As you can notice, most of these present Apollo as a musician, so maybe music played a part in Apollo being effeminte? Did the Muses have a lot of influence on him?Idk, food for thought I guess. Oh and there are a number of headless statues identified as Apollo Patroos (fatherly), where again Apollo is wearing long robes.
Lastly, some quotes from literary sources (FYI I have not included the hundreds of quotes describing Apollo's long hair and smooth chin):
"And ever beautiful is he and ever young: never on the girl cheeks of Apollo hath come so much as the down of manhood."
- Callimachus, Hymn to Artemis (trans. Mair) (Greek poet C3rd B.C.)
"Apollo puts his hair in order by shaping his flowing locks with soft foliage and braiding it with a golden diadem."
- Virgil, Aeneid 4.147 (trans. Ingo Gildenhard) (Latin poet C1st B.C.)
"These children Niobe placed above those of Latona [Leto], and spoke rather contemptuously against Apollo and Diana [Artemis] because Diana was girt in man's attire, and Apollo wore long hair and a woman's gown."
- Hyginus, Fabulae 9 (trans. Grant) (Roman mythographer C2nd A.D.)
[describing an effeminate man]: giving himself excessive airs of daintiness and indulging in all sorts of effeminacy; sometimes darting his eyes about; sometimes throwing his hands hither and thither...sometimes personating Aphrodite, sometimes Apollo"
- Tatian, Address to the Greeks 22 (trans. Pratten) (Assyrian Theologist C2nd A.D)
"[in the fragments of Lucilius' satires (C2nd B.C)]: Taking issue with Apollo, whom Romulus mocks as a pretty boy (pulcher) with a fondness for effete dance, Romulus rants against foreign luxuries"
- The Cambridge Companion to Seneca (ed. Shadi Bartsch, Alessandro Schiesaro)
fair number of Renaissance paintings continued this tradition by making Apollo look feminine and beautiful. But for some reason most of the modern adaptations make him macho, the typical Manly Man 🙄 (just like they make Dionysus either old or obese, or both). Come on people, you're throwing away the potential here! I wanna see an Apollo who can rock a suit and a pretty dress. Give me more of Apollo and Dionysus hanging out together at drag parties.
I binge read the song of Achilles in less than 12 hours and my heart feels so many things. I didn't know much about Achilles and Patroclus besides what I learned in OSP's video on the Illiad tbh, and I didn't expect to get so attached to them so fast but damn I did. The whole book was a breeze til the Trojan war started and i was filled with so much Anxiety because I KNOW what happens and I wish it didn't but it still did and I anxiously stimmed from the moment Patroclus begged to wear Achilles' armor on the battle field to the moment Achilles died. I got my heart ripped out but also the ending very gently applied a bandaid over it.
Anyways it was very good and I know it's not 100% accurate (though a lot of it from the trojan war seems to be!) But damn does it make me love Achilles and Patroclus. expect some art about them soon.
hades' throne is uncomfortable so Persephone surprised him with some cushions