Unbetitelt

[hopeiochi]

Another day, another occasion to remind you that Cassian is a bad partner, and it's because SJM isn't doing her research.

So there's the scene where he rage-baits Nesta to eat porridge (unsweetened).

“If you don’t eat that, you’re going to regret it in about thirty minutes.” “It’s either that or nothing.”

“I’ll eat toast.”

[bla bla bla Cassian gym bro talk but memories: “You’ll burn through that in ten minutes and be tired.”]

“Are there any other areas of my daily life that you’re going to be presiding over?”

“Don’t give me a reason to add any more to the list.”

Nesta sat down, grabbed the bowl of porridge, shoved a lumpy spoonful into her mouth, and nearly gagged at the taste. But she forced it down. Then another spoonful. Another. Until the bowl was clean and she started on the eggs

Cassian monitored each bite.

So, what we need to take from this scene is that Cassian was in control of Nesta. He wasn't just a good friend trying to help her. She was his job, and he had authority. He used this scene to fight for control and show Nesta who was boss (we know it's Rhys, so no need to try so hard).

The second thing: Nesta was malnourished, and we have a lot of hints before this scene that she has some sort of ED.

Took cold baths some days. Forgot to eat on others.

Her beautiful face was pale, far thinner than it had been before the war with Hybern, her lips bloodless

Her appetite had been the first thing to go after that battle. Only instinct and the occasional social requirement to appear like she gave a shit about anything kept her eating.

So, if you do the most basic research, you'll know that it is unhealthy to force a malnourished person to eat too much food. You'll also see that you should encourage a person with an eating disorder to start eating anything; the important thing is that they rebuild a healthy attitude towards food. Forcing someone to eat disgusting food just because of the idea it's healthy will add more disgust (speaking from experience). The entire scene is icky, and like everything SJM tried to show as help from the IC side, it was more harm than good. Read more about refeeding syndrome.

And the third thing, remember the phrase "how toast won't give energy":

Cassian stood above her, a plate of what looked like mushrooms and toast in one hand. “Eat. We’ve got a long day ahead.” “We’ll be hiking from dawn until dusk, only two stops throughout the day. So eat.”

What do we have here. Apparently it's enough energy for a "healing" (healing you hear this!!!!) hike. Wow, no wonder she fainted from so much care -_-.

You can defend whatever you want about Cassian, but you can't ignore that his actions were harmful to Nesta. And hey, who doesn't make some mistakes? But these harmful actions are presented as love, care, and help. All because SJM didn't do her research. Good thing she peeked online enough to read about lactic acid provoking muscle pain, but too bad she didn't read enough to see this myth debunked. And worse, she didn't stop to think how extra misogynistic a world looks where there is enough research and science to know about nutrition principles and lactic acid, but not enough to ensure a safe cesarean.

And when you see another person online bashing Cassian, before coming with "SJM loves Nessian and confirmed they are mates picked right by nature," don't forget to ask SJM why she wrote so many moments where Cassian looks like a POS, mainly because she didn't bother to research mental healing in a book presumably about mental healing.

[maladattata]

The beginning of acowar wants to portray tamlin as bad and stupid for believing feyre would or could love him, but it accidentally makes him the only one to not doubt her. Feyre has told everyone that she was abused, but alis says, no, I heard you were smiling in summer, so I won't believe you and doubt you were abused. Tamlin is criticised for believing feyre was abused despite having gained weight and looking healthier. And it is to me a disgusting implication that abuse is always outwardly visible, that the right and good characters doubt feyre's story of abuse, while only evil tamlin believes her unconditionally. Feyre even uses this idea of outward visibility by herself abusing tamlin (bc yes the provocation into a breakdown and then consciously choosing to get hurt to portray yourself as a victim is reactive abuse, feyre is following the darvo pattern). But bc she bears the physical appearance of abuse it must be her that's the victim, there can be nothing psychological going on.

It also fits with Rhysand's powers as a mind manipulator, his abuse never leaves physical marks and is invisible and therefore not real. It is a pretty harmful view on abuse imo, to only view it as physical manifestation, be it malnutrition or wounds. It is repeated over and over again: lucien is abused bc he is seen wounded even though we never see how it happened, nesta is healed bc she is eating again, tamlin only registers as hurt in the narrative once he is physically thinner and unkempt.

The book cannot conceive that nesta and feyre are in abusive relationships as long as they are eating well. This could be an interesting comment on these girls being thankful for incredibly psychologically isolating and controlling situations bc they were starving for so long, the simple fact of not suffering malnutrition is enough for them. But I know for sjm abuse is only men punching and not men sweet talking and keeping information from you and controlling your food, your body, your location, your sexual behaviour, etc etc.

[keinnamegewollt]

Can I put in my two cents? You made such good points on the theme of only physically visible abuse being considered “real” abuse and how both Feyre and Nesta are considered “healed” because they gained weight. There is something so screwed up about the portrayal of weight in the books.

Rhysand implying Feyre looks starved in Spring Court is so strange to me. She had been starving in the cabin, after all. Then, under the mountain, she had already started vomiting every day after what he did to her. Yet he has the gall to look shocked because she still has these problems a few months later living in the Spring Court? On the other hand, she’s portrayed as having no strength at all and basically being a walking skeleton, which surely couldn’t have happened that quickly – at least not if she then heals just as quickly.

None of the women ever gain weight while being depressed, it’s all a very aesthetic sort of trauma, almost like 19th century artists with tuberculosis patients. And the solution is always the male love interest monitoring their eating and ordering them to eat/controlling what they eat. From what I recall about eating disorders, the constant harping about their weight/eating habits is actually very harmful. What’s more, Nesta’s Cassian-ordered diet is a very “fitness” sort of diet, more concerned with getting muscles rather than a healthy layer of fat. Yet SJM, who uses the thinness as a marker of trauma/abuse apparently can’t be bothered to put in the least amount of research on this. It’s just infuriating anyone believes the books have anything to say on mental health.

Also, she writes all these characters lingering on the thinness of the female character and then criticizing her for it. Even if I can’t put it in words, it feels very male gaze to me. All “you paint a naked woman, put a mirror in her hand and call it vanity”.

[sunflowersand-bees]

people don’t enjoy shipping anymore. the point of shipping isn’t the catharsis of watching them kiss onscreen, it’s grabbing the characters and mashing their faces together like you’re five years old playing Barbie in your room again. it’s to take one moment of eye contact in canon and read that over and over and over again with twenty different writers’ interpretations of the characters internal monologues if they were in love. it’s to see the characters interact and cheer because you know that’s another moment to add to your list of canon compliant fic ideas. you’re stressing yourself out, this is supposed to be fun!

[extremely-judgemental]

Cassian being mean to Nesta for Feyre's shitty childhood will never not be funny to me.

He spent his entire childhood beating the shit out of other kids, including Rhysand, and stealing their supplies. He abused and mocked Azriel for learning to fly on his own knowing his past as well as the others did. He slept with Mor because he couldn't handle his brother having feelings for a girl.

Five centuries later, he's still no better.

My dude, look in the mirror.

[vidalinav]

I have a hard time believing that the IC would have actually used Elain when they asked her about searching for the dread trove. If only for the fact that if Elain had already agreed why did they have to ask Nesta at all? Nesta didn’t even have to know about it, really, and if they did ask and she wasn’t following through then they could have asked Elain then and just went on their merry way and I’m sure Nesta would have been pissed, but Elain would have done it... probably. They didn’t have to involve Nesta at all really, because Elain would have been the most convenient if they also didn’t feel she wasn’t incapable. Elain, I’d argue, would have been the better option if only for the fact that they think she’s fine, and Nesta for sure was not. So I don’t see how that whole scene was not a manipulation on Nesta’s part for this very reason. Especially because we get that scene separate from Amren being like there are many ways to convince her.

But we also get these small instances where Elain is brought up to be an option and then quickly shut down but not just by Nesta. Which I think is very interesting thing, because Nesta’s overprotectiveness is her being deeply afraid of the cauldron and what the cauldron did the last time which for some reason, is misunderstood. But also it’s her personality as we’ve seen from her lying her body on Cassian, her sacrificing her power for Feyre, her “coddling” Elain, her “I don’t care about me” speech. Her sticking up for Gwyn. She’s very protective. That’s her love.

But, why do the IC do it? This is the question... that haunts me. And makes me often wonder if more problems are caused just by the dynamic of this group of people, not necessarily individually themselves. Because individually they all need healing arcs. But as a group they need group therapy and less moral responsibility, because there is no reason they need to be involved in so many things outside of the Night Court and Prythrian now and again.

[torchwood-99]

Nessian and the Mating Bond

I think the major difference between Nesta and Cassian is that Nesta loves Cassian irrespective of the mating bond. Cassian being her mate doesn't dictate how she feels about him or drives her love for him. Cassian being her mate is more an add on, like a stamp of approval from the Mother/Cauldron. It's not the point of her relationship, Cassian is the point.

For Cassian it's the reverse. Nesta being his mate is the very foundation of his feelings for her. The instinctive desire and urge to be with her, given to him by the mating bond dominates his feelings for her. Any attraction he might feel for her separate from the mating bond is dwarfed by the instinctual attraction and passion the bond creates for him.

If the bond didn't exist, Nesta's feelings for Cassian would be unchanged, whereas Cassian's would be significantly diminished. By the same logic, if the mating bond did turn out to be false, or they discovered they had different mates, Nesta as she is would resist the bond, whereas Cassian mostly like would say "Sorry Nes, turned out we got that one wrong", and ditch her for his true mate. He might feel a little sad, a little guilty, he invested all this time and energy into her on the grounds she was his mate and got somewhat attached to her through that, the sunk cost fallacy might hit hard, but ultimately, his feelings for her would not overcome the call of the mating bond.

I think that's why Cassian lashes out so much when Nesta is hesitant about accepting they're mates. She makes it clear that it's not a reflection on him or her feelings for him, but about her fear of losing the last of her humanity. Cassian cannot conceptualise Nesta wanting him but not wanting the mating bond because to him, they have always been one in the same. Cassian cannot envision Nesta wanting him without the mating bond, because without the mating bond, he would never want her.

[daybreakmusings]

Elain telling Nesta “All you can think about is what my trauma has done to you” was incredibly ignorant and no one can convince me otherwise.

For some reason, Elain thinks the trauma that had resulted from that night belongs solely to her and Nesta is being selfish for trying to take any ownership of it.

Everything in Nesta’s life, has always been about Elain. She came first and she never stopped to think about how it could impact Nesta. Very rarely does Nesta have the time to face her own trauma and learn to heal from it because she was always in environments/situations that put her on guard to protect her sister. And Elain has always been comfortable allowing her to do so while she retreats to the background where it was safe. She has never thought twice about putting Nesta in these positions all her life. 

When the sisters first come to Pythian, Elain completely checks out from the weight of the loss and trauma she has experienced. Which is completely understandable. But she isn’t the only one to have lost so much. So had Nesta. But at a time where Nesta may have needed her support, she wasn’t there. 

All Elain could think about was what their shared trauma has done to her. But Nesta never cared.

Those first few weeks in Pythian? Nesta was there to check on her. To make sure she is eating. To ensure her wellbeing. To see to her needs. To make sure she is comfortable.

In ACOSF, for the first time in Nesta’s life, she isn’t capable of putting Elain first. But Elain is unwilling to confront the possibility that the trauma they both experienced that night may have affected her sister differently than it did her. As a result, she avoids putting herself in a position where she might have to face the full extent of that truth.

I’m not saying that Elain doesn’t have a right to feel greatly impacted by what had happened to her. She went through alot. But she doesn’t get to pick and choose whose trauma that night was greater and warrants more concern.

[moon--mama]

But I think that Elain has a very valid point. The entire series, Feyre observed that Nesta would do anything to protect Elain. By the time SF rolls around, and Nesta is describing Elain as a dog, it’s because Nesta has never viewed her as anything more valuable than a pet.

When the Night Court visits the human world in ACOMAF, Nesta has been given everything she felt that she lost. But she’s still angry, because she knows that her father didn’t take care of them and return their fortune. Once again, Feyre’s sacrifice is what kept their family going. Elain has to remind them “And as for Feyre’s hunting during those years, it was not Nesta’s neglect alone that is to blame. We were scared, and had received no training, and everything had been taken, and we failed her. Both of us.” Everyone, even Feyre, thought of Elain as part of Nesta until that point. Even Feyre directs all of her anger and frustration toward their oldest sister, never blaming Elain for anything.

Then. Nesta fails at protecting Elain. Everyone fails at protecting them as they’re Made, and Nesta is rightfully pissed about that as well. But watching Elain’s reaction to the event is all about Nesta—she knows that she failed, she’s unable to bully Elain into eating or living, and she resents that Feyre’s the one who saved her. She hovers over Elain in the House of Wind and hardly lets Feyre or anyone else near her. Nesta thinks that she failed again when Elain is kidnapped by Hybern, and she still doesn’t get the opportunity to rescue her. Then when Elain starts to recover at the River House…It’s like Feyre stole Elain away from her.

I’d also like to point out that Elain and Nesta kill Hybern together. “But as a black blade broke through the king’s throat, spraying blood, I realized someone else had. Elain stepped out of a shadow behind him, and rammed Truth-Teller to the hilt through the back of the king’s neck as she snarled in his ear, “Don’t you touch my sister.” Until that point in the series, they’re a unit. This is the first time that Elain has any sort of agency, and it’s simply to lash out at the person threatening Nesta. As a dog would defend its master.

So in SF when Nesta is self-destructing, it’s because she’s lost her purpose. She doesn’t need to take care of Elain any more. Because of the Cauldron, she can’t take care of Elain even when she wants to.

Elain’s comment just tells Nesta that she knows about the way Nesta thinks of her as a pet. Instead of being happy that Elain is somewhat adjusting, it just makes Nesta destruct even more. Because for Nesta, Elain’s trauma IS something that happened to her as well. SHE failed her sister, many times, and then Feyre stole her away.

For the first time in the series, Nesta acknowledges that Elain is capable of taking care of herself. And that is killing her. “Elain could make her own choices. And had chosen to thoroughly shut the door on Nesta. Even as she fully embraced Feyre and her world. Nesta’s chest tightened, but she refused to think of it, acknowledge it. Elain was like a dog, loyal to whatever master kept her fed and in comfort.”

Elain’s comment that Nesta’s fixated on Elain’s trauma too personally is perfectly valid—because Nesta doesn’t see her as a capable individual most of the series and resents her once she becomes one. Her Making was something that happened to Nesta’s pet, until the pet pointed out that she was traumatized personally as well. It’s the first time Elain stands up to Nesta, and it changes their relationship in a huge way.

And perhaps Elain’s new relationship with Feyre says more about her acknowledging the way her trauma effected others than anything else. She’s supportive, does things to take care of Feyre and her family for once, and blossoms as an independent person. At last, someone in the family is taking care of Feyre.

[daybreakmusings]

I am so confused about the point you are trying to make, since you are talking about events that don’t even correlate to what I referenced in my original post. But I’ll try to break down what I think you’re saying.

But watching Elain’s reaction to the event is all about Nesta—she knows that she failed, she’s unable to bully Elain into eating or living, and she resents that Feyre’s the one who saved her. She hovers over Elain in the House of Wind and hardly lets Feyre or anyone else near her. 

First and foremost. Nesta never failed Elain. 

Secondly, throughout the series, Nesta puts Elain first. Whether it be her safety, her wants and needs. Elain always had Nesta looking out for her and helping her. You referenced briefly the initial meeting between the sisters and a newly-turned Feyre with her court. Remember that it was Elain’s decision not only to help Feyre with her war, but also stay back in the human lands instead of seeking safety in Pythian. And Nesta? She goes along with what Elain wants then and throughout the series:

“It is your choice, ladies, whether you wish to remain here, or come with us. Elain thumbed the iron ring on her finger. “It is your choice,” Nesta said with unusual gentleness. For her, Nesta would go to Prythian.

So to claim that Nesta would even think of “bullying Elain into doing anything” is a blatant lie. She never even swears at her. And at the same time, you purposefully misread Nesta’s concern for her sister as Nesta “making the event all about herself.” It’s as if you have read an entirely different book than everyone else because how can you draw such conclusions? And to say that she resents that Feyre is the one who saved Elain when this exists in canon:

“She let out a sob at the sight of Elain, still in Azriel’s arms. I’d never heard a sound like that from her. Not once. […] I swallowed my shout of pain as Nesta’s arms went around my neck and she embraced me so hard it snatched my breath away. Her body shook—shook as she sobbed and said over and over and over, “Thank you.”

But yeah…if you want to misunderstand what is clearly black and white, that’s on you. The obvious gratefulness and joy at her sisters being alive seems to escape you. But what really makes me laugh is your comment about not letting Feyre or anyone near her:

“Nesta only shook her head, turning toward the chair and her book. “I don’t care. Do what you want.” A stinging dismissal, if not admission that she still trusted me enough to consider Elain’s needs first”

Nesta is furious that Feyre and her court failed to protect them from Hybern and is raging at the loss she and Elain suffered. She doesn’t fully trust them (which is fair because she doesn’t know them) but she doesn’t prevent Elain from interacting with them either. And Nesta never stopped Feyre from being around Elain. 

Weiterlesen

[nestaswhore]

‘Everything in her life, from the moment she was born, had been controlled by other people. Things happened to her; anytime she tried to exert control, she’d been thwarted at every turn—and she hated that even more than the King of Hybern.’

so sjm is gonna write this paragraph. and then have nesta end up in an environment where her life is under constant control. end up around people who do nothing but control her. end up with a man who feels more than comfortable controlling her.

she doesn’t have a job. she doesn’t get paid. sjm never gave her financial independence even though i (personally) believe it’s one of the MOST important things nesta needed in her life. she’s been controlled through finances her entire life. she’s depended on others for finances her entire life. you’re telling me she’s just okay with depending on c*ssian for it now? i just don’t understand how silver flames was a book dedicated to healing and nesta finding herself. i really don’t.

she can’t even leave her house easily? she needs to either ask someone to get her out or TAKE 10,000 STEPS! how does nesta not despise living there. how does she not despise having her weapons taken from her and controlled by others. how does she not despise waking up every morning to train just because c*ssian told her to! when she was literally threatened into it!

how are you supposed to take nesta’s ‘healing arc’ seriously when she’s ended up in a position that old her would’ve despised. every time i reread this nightmare i find more quotes that make no sense even being in the book when you know how it ends and it makes me just as mad as i was when this book was released.

[moon--mama]

The 10,000 stairs was symbolic though. When the intervention happens, Nesta is in a bad place—she’s depressed, alcoholic, and pushing away all of her friends and family. She loses control of her life because she’s unable to provide for herself, financially or emotionally. Feyre and Elain gave her space to process and heal emotionally, but they realized that she didn’t need space—Nesta had always pushed others away and locked them out, with disastrous results. Here’s my analysis of Nesta’s development in Silver Flame that no one asked for…

Feyre says earlier in the series that Nesta seems uncaring but she thinks it’s a mask to hide the fact that Nesta cares more deeply than most. SF is where we see that idea play out. When Feyre confronts her about her behavior earlier in the series, Nesta points out that there’s no reason for her to change because she’s always been able to manipulate others into doing what she needs them to do.

There’s some romantic tension between Nesta and Cassian from the moment they meet, but Nesta doesn’t know how to handle genuinely liking someone. She was raised by her mother to look at relationships as a business transaction, and she was SA in the human world when she attempted to marry for safety. After she’s in Velaris, she starts taking people home for casual sex—because she’s terrified. She’s terrified of being assaulted, she’s terrified of falling in love and finding pleasure, she’s terrified of changing. Her random hookups are a coping mechanism for her unresolved romantic trauma. If she chooses her partners and throws them away, it means she has power over them. It also helps her feel less terrified of intimacy—which she craves, given her favorite genre for reading. Her “healing arc” with Cassian is about Nesta allowing herself to choose her partner. Her mother raised her to make an advantageous political match, so she’s been brainwashed not to fall in love. We know that she truly took this duty to heart because she was prepared to marry an abusive human in ACOTAR for a little protection. Nesta has the opportunity to carry out her warped views of marriage with Eris, but she chooses Cassian for herself. There’s no moment where the mating bond “snaps” in place like it did for other characters. It doesn’t happen until Nesta permits it to happen. She doesn’t lose her autonomy, she gains the power to choose. The fact that she ends up choosing the person she was fated to be with is poetic, confirming for Nesta that she made the right choice.

In ACOTAR, Nesta is introduced by demanding that Feyre spend some of the money from her hunt to buy her new boots. Elain also asks for a new cloak. At that time, it’s supposed to make them seem selfish. When Feyre confronts her about it later in the series, Nesta says that she knew Feyre could always go hunting again and find more money. She never admits or considers that she was valuing herself and her needs over the life of her youngest sister. Feyre is literally risking her life to go hunting, and Nesta admits that she expected Feyre to do it constantly to keep the family fed and clothed. She was very bitter when their father stopped providing for them—so bitter that she was willing to let the whole family starve to prove a point about his faults. Her gambling at the beginning of SF is a continuation of that flawed line of thought. That’s why Feyre breaks down and cries—it has nothing to do with the actual money (and we know from FS that Feyre is still anxious about spending, even though she and Rhys are very wealthy). Feyre sees the bar tab as proof that Nesta still isn’t able to see how her actions effect others—or clearly doesn’t care.

She’s still struggling with that mentality at the beginning of SF. Nesta is very hurt by their father’s death—because the moment that he returned to help them in their war again Hybern, it proved that he’d finally done what she wanted him to do all along. He’d gone out of his way to protect his daughters…and it got him killed. That’s why she’s so traumatized by the fire crackling. She’s not directly responsible for his actions, of course, but she feels responsible because she wanted him to step up for so long. Nesta’s expectations of others have always been too high. She knows Feyre will keep risking her life for their family because it’s what Nesta would have done (they’re “two sides of the same coin,” and that’s why Nesta goes after Feyre when Tamlin takes her to Prythian). She expects the priestesses to sign up for training because she knows Cassian can help them recover some of their strength. That’s the moment that she realizes she’s expecting too much of others—she becomes aware that the priestesses don’t trust Cassian like she does, so she stages the demonstration. It’s a personal breakthrough on so many levels, because she realizes that she has to help people reach the potential she expects of them. That’s something she never did for their father. What if Nesta, Elain, and Feyre had all come together to protect their father when thugs broke his knees? One child crying wasn’t going to do anything, but potentially three? And especially when Nesta’s death point even rattled the King of Hybern… she has always had the capacity to help others, but she’s chosen not to. Her mother raised her to remain aloof. Cassian continually reaching out to her helped her to make the important realization that she’s able to intervene and improve things for other people. He becomes an example of the positive effect that intervention can have, as Nesta sees herself growing and recognizes that he might be able to help some of the priestesses too.

The intervention of placing her in the House and ordering it not to provide her with wine is exactly what it sounds like…an intervention. Anyone struggling with unresolved trauma or depression knows how tempting it is to reach for some substances that will take your mind off things for a while. Nesta’s drinking reaches a new level in SF, as her apartment reeks and she doesn’t remember details about the person she just hooked up with. Cassian, Feyre, and Amren see that she is self-destructing. Amren tries some tough love and tells Nesta off, withholding her friendship, which has a profound impact on Nesta but doesn’t spur her into changing. When she hits some low points in the House, her mind turns to drinking. Being unable to get down the stairs is a symbol of her depression—she’s unable to literally get herself out of the house. Ultimately this issue is resolved when Nesta invites her friends over for a sleepover. Instead of trying to leave and get some wine, she has fun with her friends and makes homing beacon bracelets. AND, the one time that she does get herself out of the house, she immediately runs to her sister and emotionally wounds her. Nesta realizes then that she’s gone too far, and she runs back to the House. It’s all metaphorical for her social life. Alone, she’s self-destructive and causes pain to the people around her. With friends, she’s able to find fulfillment and doesn’t need alcohol to do it.

Her loss of autonomy when she went into the cauldron explains the whole Valkyrie storyline. Nesta says several times in SF that she’s weak. She learned how weak she was when Elain was kidnapped by Hybern, and that truly traumatized her. As they hunt for the Dread Trove items, she realizes that she wants to be stronger. To protect Elain, to protect Cassian, and to protect herself. She offers to scry for the Dread Trove to protect Elain, who snaps that she doesn’t need protection. Nesta’s issues with Elain are still unresolved by the end of SF, but I think that’s a setup for the next book. Cassian is supposed to be this super warrior, but Nesta has seen him practically defeated twice now (when she went into the cauldron and when they faced off with Hybern). Nesta decides that she wants to be stronger for herself. After seeing what her expectations of others did to her father, she’s realizing that she needs to take action. She pushes that very far on Ramiel during the Blood Rite, resolving her trauma at being unable to protect her loved ones. Nesta immediately goes to help Emerie and Gwyn, rather than assuming that they will be able to protect themselves. The old Nesta, who pushed Feyre to take extra risks, is gone. Nesta even sacrifices herself by remaining at the pass as Emerie and Gwyn finish the Rite. It’s an act of selflessness and demonstrates everything she’s realized about teamwork.

As far as the money goes, Rhys and Feyre offer Nesta jobs. They say at the beginning of SF that she refuses all of them. She doesn’t have financial independence because she hasn’t earned it. As a member of their family, Nesta is given access to the High Lord/Lady’s credit around town and she’s able to bill things to their accounts. Nesta says at the beginning of SF that she does this because there’s no reason for her to work. She ultimately does a lot of things in SF that prove her value—finding the Dread Trove, saving Feyre, etc. But Feyre always found Nesta valuable, which is why she was recognized as part of their family and provided for initially. Nesta’s “job” after the intervention is shelving library books. In a magical house. That moves books all the time. Clearly, she’s given this task so that she has something to do. Her job in the library leads to her forming some important relationships and friendships. It’s another metaphor for overcoming depression—just forming a routine and getting “out” helps Nesta begin her process of recovery.

Now, if Nesta fulfilled a role in the court where she was leading the Valkyries, she would be carrying out a more lucrative job. If she got named as an advisor, like Amren or Mor, she’d be carrying out a more lucrative job. There are many ways that Nesta can have financial independence by the conclusion of SF, and all it would take is a sentence or two. I don’t think this was intentionally left out. The ending suggests that Nesta has adjusted and she’s looking for ways to help others. She rejected working initially because she felt like there was no point, and she had nothing to give to others. By the end of SF, she’s got a new perspective of herself and she’s able to make more meaningful connections. Also, before leaving the topic of financial independence, Nesta likely won’t achieve that for a long time. Feyre and Rhysand are essentially royalty. Cassian, Amren, Azriel, and Morrigan all receive a paycheck for their roles in the court. They’re all several hundred years old at least, so they’ve had plenty of time to save. Even once Nesta starts receiving a salary after SF, it will take her time to gain enough wealth to be financially independent of her sister. Rhysand paid Feyre a salary when she arrived in the Night Court and agreed to work with them against Hybern. The implication is that Nesta never got paid because she spent everything she would have been paid in taverns. When he’s showering her with gifts at the end of the novel, it seems likely that he would re-establish a salary and account for her. I strongly doubt that Nesta is expected to start spending Cassian’s money, when Feyre and Rhys have been financing her all along.

Hell, even the dancing is a resolution of Nesta’s trauma. Her grandmother physically abused her when she was little, and her mother emotionally abused her by training her to use others for her benefit (and likewise using Nesta for herself). Dancing was the one thing that she enjoyed, and in SF she regains the ability to enjoy dancing for herself. Feyre and Rhys ask her to dance with Eris because of a political maneuver. Cassian had just noted that Nesta was making progress, but she needed to find something that brought her joy. Beyond the whole mate thing, he sees her dancing and he realizes that it’s a passion she’s never shared. It’s her thing, like Feyre’s painting or Elain’s gardening. Cassian’s solstice gift helps her resolve this issue because she can now dance any time she wants. Yet again, it’s another big tip on recovering from depression. Finding a hobby that brings joy can help to relieve some of those negative thoughts, especially when one is avoiding substance abuse.

Every trauma and unresolved issue that Nesta had is addressed by the end of the book. Her issues with her parents are issues that Elain and Feyre struggle with too, and now that both parents are dead they won’t get any further closure. But that’s life, and perhaps they can now find some support in each other.

Nesta at the end of the book would look back at the way she was previously and cringe. Nesta was:

Traumatized emotionally and sexually, unable to find fulfillment in intimate relationships

Using people for her benefit regardless of their cost or risk

Only willing to help Elain

An alcoholic who refused to participate in family gatherings and lashed out to hurt others emotionally

Unable to protect herself or anyone she cared about

Alone, feeling like she failed her father, failed Elain, and failed herself

Unwilling to do any sort of work or contribute to the goals of the Night Court, while benefiting from their protection and funding

Unhappy

She’s still a powerful woman who doesn’t take any shit. But Nesta now:

Has allowed herself to fall in love and enjoy it

Values others and supports them

Helps people when they need her

Has recovered from alcoholism and depression

Is no longer “weak” in any way

Values herself

Is able to do meaningful work

Finds joy in life

The ending scene where she visits her father’s grave takes it full circle. Nesta finally allows herself to admit the truth and stops punishing herself for his death.

What’s the message here? People are social. We’re pack animals—that’s why solitary confinement is so inhumane, and has such terrible effects on people. Nesta is independent and allowed to live her own life, but her friends and family can see that she’s hurting. Instead of turning their backs on her and letting her continue to self-destruct, they stage an intervention. It’s important that Nesta finds healing by reforming the Valkyries. She doesn’t suddenly become best friends with Feyre, or recover her relationship with Elain. Things are still rocky with Amren. Nesta chooses her own people on her journey. This doesn’t necessarily mean that she’s forgiven the Night Court, but it does mean that she’s better able to coexist with them. Since they’re all immortal now, it makes sense that the Night Court tries so hard to help her. They can’t just let Nesta wander off like a loose cannon, not when her powers could potentially threaten them. This isn’t just about the relationship between Nesta and her sisters, it’s also a matter of keeping Velaris safe. If anything, it’s more realistic that it takes a lot of time for Nesta to find a reason to connect with Velaris and keep it safe. Feyre takes a walk for 10 minutes and decides that she wants to live there forever. Nesta takes several months to make friends with a few people and find some value in staying in the city.

When we’re depressed and traumatized, we tend to pull away from others. Nesta’s journey in this book follows some pretty standard recommendations for recovery: establishing a routine, avoiding substance abuse, resolving financial issues, addressing emotional trauma, forming meaningful relationships, etc. Even her motto “I am the rock” is pretty standard meditation/recovery fare. The nature hike with Cassian is another big cheesy nod to recovery in real life—fresh air, exercise, and a connection with nature. Nesta’s healing arc is believable for her character and necessary for the progress of the series. If anything, it’s a little cliche. Don’t forget that by the end of the book, Nesta is in control of three items in the Dread Trove. Despite the wards, she summons them to save Feyre. She knows that she could summon them at any time. The Mother allows her to keep some of the power she stole, so Nesta certainly isn’t powerless. Individually, she’s powerful—and with the harp, mask, and crown she’s almost a god. Nesta ends the book more powerful than she was before.

There’s also strong implications that she’s going to become even more powerful as she explores the idea of being a “witch.” Witches exist in other SJM books, but they’re hardly explored in ACOTAR. Since it’s all part of the same big universe, I anticipate that we can expect this to come into play in some way for Nesta. Cryptically, the only thing anyone has to say about witches in ACOTAR is that they live in the Middle and feast on innocents to fill the void that magic left within them. Metaphorically, that’s exactly what Nesta was doing at the start of SF. So perhaps she’s a witch after all.

[nestaswhore]

i don’t know where to even start replying to you, honestly.

the 10,000 steps were symbolic to nesta’s journey. they were not symbolic enough that she needs to remain living there. she’s locked away from society, it’s extremely difficult for her to leave the house. you said that all her traumas were addressed and resolved. i completely disagree. this is a quote from nesta around 85% through the book.

‘Having him kiss her and realizing that soon she’d have to return to this world humming around them, and leave the House, and she didn’t know what she would do then. What it would mean for them. If she would plunge back into that dark place she’d occupied before. Drag him down with her.’

her fears are never addressed and resolved. nesta remaining in that house isn’t having her trauma resolved. nesta staying in that house isn’t a positive thing, she’s afraid to leave her house and rejoin actual society. in her current mental state she’d rather lock herself away than actually go face the world again. i can’t say where she’ll be in the next book, but imo it doesn’t matter because we won’t know her thoughts and feelings. this is how her book ends, and as far as we know it’s the only book she’s getting. i know it takes a while to overcome such fears, but it’s also a fantasy book and it should’ve been resolved by the end. especially if the main theme of this book is healing.

and about the financial independence, it’s not a satisfying ending to hear that rhys will probably continue to finance her. financial dependence on others has controlled her life, it’s the reason why people were even able to lock her up in a house in the first place. she’s not going to be training or running the valkyries any time soon as she has just began training herself, she’s clearly not going to go into any type of political job either as sjm has made it quite clear she wants nesta to be a warrior. so i disagree that it’s something that can be addressed in the next book in a sentence or two. and i completely disagree that her financial issues have been in any way resolved.

i don’t have much to say on nesta finding her strength because i don’t agree w the approach sjm took, or better the direction sjm took. nesta lost her autonomy in the cauldron, and then throughout the next few books realised that she was completely helpless to help or save anyone. it’s great that she’s now physically stronger thanks to her training but imo it was the wrong way for nesta to find her strength. it doesn’t really make any sense to me. nesta is smart, she’s seen cassian (who is widely thought to be one of the strongest warriors ever) be taken down to almost death MULTIPLE times. so i can’t understand why sjm would write that nesta would feel comforted knowing she can fight. it’s great that she can now, every woman should be able to defend themselves, but it doesn’t make sense when she has seen that fighting isn’t all that effective. and it makes no sense to me when she had all that power at her fingertips. every single instance in the books where nesta is doing something positive, or saving herself—she’s using her powers. she saved cassian in acowar thanks to her powers, she uses her powers to distract the king, uses her powers to save herself in the bog, uses her powers fo save herself and cassian from lanthys, uses her powers to kill briallyn and then uses her powers to save feyre. majority of the positive things she’s done has been because of her powers. and i know she hates them because they’re cauldron given, and the cauldron is a source of serious trauma to her. but she eventually came around to accept the mating bond, which is cauldron given. and if you remember she initially hated the idea of training too, and she came around to that. it’s amazing she can fight now, but to me personally it wasn’t the most satisfying way for nesta to be able to defend herself and those she loves.

in regards to the bullet points showing the differences in old nesta and new nesta, i agree with some. she’s definitely addressed her emotional trauma. and her sexual trauma, to an extent. she’s allowed herself to love cassian now. but i disagree that she was only willing to help elain, and i disagree that she wasn’t willing to do work for the inner circle. in book 1, she goes to try save feyre from prythian. in book 2, she helps feyre with the human queens. in book 3, she accepts a job as emissary, trains w amren to help rebuild the wall, helps by telling her story to the high lords, helps hurt soldiers in the war and eventually is ready to sacrifice herself to by feysand time to rebuild the cauldron. so imo she’s always been willing to help others, she might not have always been enthusiastic about it but she helped when was asked.

you also said she values herself now. which i agree with, again to an extent. her self worth has definitely improved but she still has a lot of unhealthy feelings. a lot of nesta’s healing arc falls extremely flat. and nesta’s self worth is another thing that just falls flat to me. this is one of the very last paragraphs in the book

‘Her father had died for her, with love in his heart, and though she might not have deserved it then … She would do all she could now to earn it. To deserve not just his love, but that of those around her. Of Cassian.’

her self worth and value is still pretty low. nesta never becomes objective with herself. she never actually understands that sometimes she’s just too hard on herself, and her failings aren’t actually completely her fault. she doesn’t realise that her father showing up for once doesn’t excuse how neglectful and borderline abusive he was in her life. nesta thinking that she wasn’t deserving of her neglectful fathers love but being determined to do all she can to be worthy of it now is honestly just disturbing to me. why is nesta still carrying his failings on her shoulders. and i also don’t agree with the message that you need to work to be worthy of anyone’s love, especially when those around nesta are not perfect saints by any means. she still feels unworthy, still has cassian on a pedestal where she can’t see any of HIS mistakes and just blames herself for everything. which leads into a whole other topic of whether or not nesta even should be in a relationship right now.

also i don’t agree that there are a lot of implications that nesta will be even more powerful the next book or explore being a witch. i feel like the only thing clear is that she’s going to be a general like cassian.

maybe my expectations were too high for this book, maybe i’m applying too much reality to a fantasy book but i think if sjm wants to write books about mental health then i think it’s reasonable to be discussing whether or not nesta’s healing fell flat, which to me it did. some of the approaches to situations and messages sjm wants to send just don’t sit right w me.

not everything about acosf was bad. the friendships nesta found were honestly so beautiful and meaningful, some of nesta’s inner thoughts on her trauma were so beautifully written too. but since plot was basically non existent, all the loose threads and very very rushed writing falls flat. because there isn’t much else to the book. ie the sisters relationship being rushed towards the end, no meaningful conversations between the three of them, nesta and rhysands relationship being rushed at the end, nesta and mor being undeveloped and then rushed, nesta and amrens relationship not being touched upon much as well. if there was some intricate plot, it would be ok. but since there isn’t, and all these relationships were not well written, a lot of nesta’s own issues not being properly resolved and even nessian not having proper development, nesta’s healing arc, again, just falls flat to me. obviously you clearly have a completely different opinion which i respect, but this is just my take on it.

there’s a lot of other points you made but if i responded to each one i’d be writing for days. anyways i love hearing other people’s opinions on this stuff so i really appreciate the analysis on nesta!

[acotar-rants]

The Valkyries: A Brief Analysis

I like the Valkyries as a concept - as an all female warrior group who fights for no one but justice.

But this is about the execution - which I don't like.

The Lost History

Really, this is just an excuse to build the Valkyries the way SJM wants them to be for ACOSF. A clean slate. Aside from the mind stilling and them being all women, there's nothing particularly unique about them.

You couldn't have taken inspiration from any other band of warriors, all women or not? The Fianna, an ancient Gaelic group of warriors, memorized books of poetry as part of their training.

These women work in a library - a repository of knowledge at their fingertips. They have the power and weapon of knowledge. Let me see them dive into the lore of Prythian, have opinions on politics, enact strategy to help those in need. They're from different parts of Prythian, or at least the Night Court, right? Let them compare their stories, what life was like before coming to the Library.

Of course, there's the inspiration from the Hunters or Artemis and Amazons in Greek mythology. From what I gather, they didn't have a purpose to anyone but themselves, as an alternative for women who didn't want to live in society or wanted another option than marriage.

There's the Norse Valkyrie, who guide souls to the afterlife, but there's not a lot of guiding souls to anywhere in ACOTAR.

All to say, aside from the fighting and the mind stilling, I wished the Valkyries in ACOTAR/ACOSF had made their own purpose. But I fear that it will be to fight for the Night Court, more than anything.

The Mind Stilling

So, you're telling me there's not a single other band of warriors or soldiers who use a form of meditation? No one else? Meditation doesn't exist in any other context, either?

This was a big point in ACOSF because it was meant to help Nesta heal her trauma, but as most other readers critical of SJM's work point out, there were literally hundreds of other options that could have happened, it's just the book takes the worst path for the sake of this plot.

Becoming the Valkyries

Half of forming the Valkyries is mostly just getting the women in the Library to learn to fight - and it's Cassian and Azriel who are doing it.

On the one hand, I get that this new version of the Valkyries will be somewhat Illyrian derived (the leathers, the fighting, etc.), but it would also have been cool if they could have somehow learned other fighting techniques. Especially since all the Illyrian warriors are men and the Valkyries are women. The way they move, the center of balance, the weapons they might use, will likely be different from the Illyrians.

And there's gotta be at least one Valkyrie who has actual magic, right? Nothing about honing magic to help them?

Also, since I'm confessing: I hate the fan art of the Valkyries. Not because they're not good. There's so much fan art where the lines are clean, the lighting is exquisite, the colors are gorgeous, and the forms are impeccable. The skills of fan artists are not the problem.

My problem is the general concept of female warriors in form fitting to tight looking all black leather with a white ribbon around their foreheads. To me, they look like slightly upgraded ninjas.

I get that in context, they're borrowing a lot from Illyrian warriors, because it's Cassian and Azriel who are teaching them to fight, but I feel like after hundreds of pages (757 according to Goodreads), they should have been able to form their own identity.

Why are we basing their abilities on whether or not they can manage an obstacle course as a qualifier for the Blood Rite? Sure, there's the whole, ribbon cutting thing, but I need more than this.

I know we're still early in the formation of the Valkyries as a group, but it's not like we haven't read a handful of books where we still don't know much about several characters. I fear the Valkyries will just be another plot device in the ACOTAR world rather than its own unique entity.

[keinnamegewollt]

Compared Cassian to Rhysand in my head (they're both terrible partners, obviously, but in different ways) and I wondered: If Nesta had gotten pregnant instead of Feyre, do you think Cassian would have told Nesta about the risk? I feel like the need for absolute control and the paternalism is more Rhysand's flaw than his. On the other hand, we know he'd keep it secret if Rhysand ordered him... Oh, do you think Feyre would order them to keep it a secret from Nesta? That would be sick, but I could see it happening.

[hopeiochi]

Some of my thoughts regarding Elain's character

In my opinion, Elain is an interesting character with a lot of potential. Based on some observations, I associate her a lot with the mediator type. Unlike Nesta and Feyre, who are usually blunt, she manages to find a middle ground. I think both approaches have their advantages and disadvantages, but that's life. People have different behaviours, and they deal with conflict in ways that are specific to them.

Feyre usually relies on her bravery, and this often leads to her ending up in dangerous situations. Nesta tends to overanalyse everything, and that can result in a paralysing sense of anxiety, which is pretty destructive. Elain, on the other hand, is excellent at finding the middle ground. This allows her to blend in the environment, and I suspect this can lead to an identity crisis, to not being taken seriously and being seen as a people-pleaser.

Now, these are only my interpretations, and with Elain they're still based on vague moments. Everything can change once we get her POV. However, based on what we've seen so far, I really liked that she was able to be friends with both Nesta and Feyre at the cabin, and later at the manor too. I also think the manor chapters from TAR are very important because they show the sisters' dynamic outside of poverty and struggle. Elain is there helping Feyre acclimatise, preparing her to enter society, and even before that they had their gift exchange. This relationship, did not get out of thin air in FAS/SF as many insinuate by saying she just chooses the better hand to fed her.

In MAF, she was pretty good at managing that dinner situation, keeping her calm despite being terrified, being friendly with Fae, despite who her fiancé is and by being reasonable in general. Nesta too was valid in her fear and reluctance, but as I said, I appreciate having character with different type of thinking on the page.

Elain was also kind to their father, and I think it's a great achievement to find the strength to be kind to someone who failed you while you're living in miserable conditions. She also managed to preserve her personality despite being raised by Mama Archeron, who was far from a good or healthy role model.

She has this ability to see, understand, and accept. If you reread the scene at the market in FAS, it's a good example of how she adapts to the gift-giving tradition while Feyre is still questioning it.

If I had to choose which Archeron sister I resemble the most, I would probably say Elain. But maybe it's just easier to project onto her because of how little we actually get of her.

Though she's largely absent throughout WAR, I don't have a problem with that. It makes sense that she's traumatised and in shock, and that's simply her way of coping. Reading those scenes from Feyre's perspective may make them seem boring, but if we were in Elain's POV, I think the emotional weight and atmosphere would be much more powerful: the confusion, the hurt, it’s something I would like to read.

I must admit that I don't understand her behaviour in SF, nor do I agree with it. It felt quite hypocritical, and I have to assume it's a side effect of SJM wanting to intensify Nesta's inner turmoil and create additional conflict. The result felt cheap, and, to be honest, it's an often-seen flaw in her writing.

I still think she has potential, and if SJM plays her cards right, hopefully she doesn’t destroy this potential too much. And, my interpretation lefts me confused with some opinions about Elain and I have some thoughts regarding this.

Firstly, inability to accept nuance. ACOTAR is known for destroying nuance instead of capitalising on it. Readers who had no problem prior with this, have a certain type of thinking which also is the reason why they apply archetypes to characters and simplify all their personality from the text.

E.g. Tamlin became the toxic ex who did everything wrong, Rhys – the perfect book boyfriend, shadow daddy MMC, who can not do wrong, Feyre – the saviour, the hero, the mother, the best, Nesta – the rude bitch, Elain – the soft, feminine, dainty heroine.

This substitution of actual characterisation with concepts leads to a situation where actions are no longer judged individually but through the lens of the role each character has been assigned. That's why Tamlin is condemned for locking Feyre inside the manor, while Rhys is just a poor guy when he locked her in the bubble, or when he locked Velaris for 50 years. Similarly, Feyre is just a concerned sister when she imprisons Nesta.

If someone decides from the start that Nesta is a bitch, then all of her kind or compassionate moments become outliers and are ignored during an analysis of her character. The same happens with Elain. Once she's labelled as the poor, infantilised girl, every moment that exists outside that framework is dismissed as an exception rather than recognised as part of her character.

Secondly, the ship wars contribute to a similar problem. People assign couples certain archetypes—enemies to lovers, forbidden love, and so on—and then sometimes interpret the characters in whatever way is necessary to make them fit that narrative. I've previously written a post about Nessian being labelled as enemies to lovers, where I argued that the interpretation of their relationship is manipulated to fit the trope instead of simply choosing more suitable tropes for their dynamic.

Especially in these shipping wars related to the expected release characters are presented to fit narratives. Unlike regular shipping where this is just an extension based on the canon, here is the fight for the great prize of ‘becoming canon’, and this means that the interpretation of characters should also be canon to warrant their claim.

If I ship Rhysta, I’m just loosely taking canon as a recommendation, every variation of shipping them doesn’t need to prove that the canon also supported their couple, their archetypes are compatible and are a base for some great dynamics. And that’s what shipping should be about.

Lastly, projection. I mentioned that my version of Elain can be just a projection from my side and that can be true for everyone who try to analyse her character. Not in the ‘self-insert’ way, but rather as I identify X, Y, Z actions as T personality type and that’s why I love/hate Elain. It’s not bad, it’s not good, it’s just a bias factor which will always be. That also added with how SJM writes, we never know where her vision takes her and how she develops a character.

To end this post, I’ll affirm that each ACOTAR character deserves more nuance than they often receive from the fandom. Elain especially, with how her character is often moulded to fit a certain narrative. And in my opinion, her ships outside of Lucien and Azriel may be more useful in getting to know her who she is outside of canon expectations.

Make her Beron’s mistress (both meanings are good), imagine her life with Graysen, ship her with OC’s, let her enjoy a sapphic experience with Gwyn or Mor, think about what other characters from Maasverse would fit her. Maybe this won’t help you know the Elain SJM planned, but it’ll be easier to see how you see Elain outside of ship and narrative expectations.

@torchwood-99 this was supposed to be a comment to your post about Elain seen as the victim, but the word count and the meaning extended too much, to the point it became a general analysis of Elain and some thoughts I've had about her, since long. Thanks for helping me to have a start 🫶

[fairiesandanxiety]

Stupidest thing I’ve ever seen in my life. All Cassian deserves is to be punched in the face.

[keinnamegewollt]

with gritted teeth: must.. not.. fall for it and argue with these people..

[vidalinav]

I hate that Nesta’s protectiveness, the one quality in the narrative that even Feyre saw as Nesta showing her love for Elain, and the part of her that was again shown when she chose to die with Cassian, that was honored as she stood at Enalius’s passing, because she wholeheartedly wanted her friends to live, which can even be passed to the act of her wanting to tell her story and help the fae, because she wanted to protect the humans—to give them a chance, that part of her that started scrying because she wanted Nyx to be born in a better world, that sacrificed her powers for her sister and her nephew, because she wholeheartedly did not care about herself, she cared about other people’s well-being, that quality I never found bad or awful towards Nesta, that one quality I actually thought highlighted how good Nesta was, and how caring, is used by Elain as Nesta’s character flaw even though Nesta is only protective of Elain during three instances: one when they were human, which Nesta conceded on letting Feyre and the IC use the house after Elain says they should, one when Elain was lifeless for a bit and deeply traumatized, and once in ACOSF about scrying when the last time she scryed Elain was taken by the cauldron and Hybern.

This is why I can’t sympathize with Elain as a victim to Nesta’s ways as it’s portrayed in three instances: when she cries in the library knowing full well the current state of affairs, when she accuses Nesta of only thinking of how her trauma affects her and saying that she remembers Feyre rescuing her, and when she talks of the duke situation and says that she hopes Nesta channels all of “that” into something more productive. And then when Feyre agrees that they ALL coddle her, when Amren says that they shouldn’t underestimate her, and when Rhys again says that perhaps they haven’t seen what Elain is made of, and when Azriel is like we shouldn’t subject her to that darkness. Some of this I would understand Elain getting mad, but not for Nesta coddling, because Nesta at this point hasn’t even seen Elain for a WHILE, which makes all the difference, because how can she coddle someone she has pushed away? I can see her being angry for what Nesta says, the dog comment (actually that was never said out loud) or the father comment or what the IC do because they don’t give her tasks and kind of just let her be, but the context of the situation DOES matter, because these situations in which Nesta is saying something mean is a situation where Elain is really oblivious and not reading the context of the situation, and it comes at the end of the scene when it’s already been taken too far. She’s not mean for sport lol. I would even understand the anger based on feeling left out, but that’s not what she gets angry about. It’s directly and only at Nesta and for that one quality, and it has made this notion both in the book and the fandom that Elain is “coddled” specifically by Nesta as opposed to giving Nesta the validation that she is deeply afraid and her MO entirely is that she protects the people she loves. She has not told Elain she has no free will, she has not taken it away. That has NEVER happened. Elain consistently thrived for almost all of the book series, until she turned fae. There was no forever under Nesta’s thumb. 

It reminds me a little of when Elain says that her father could never say no to Nesta as if this grown ass man had no control and all of the control/responsibility was on this 14 year old girl. What? It’s also why I think Elain has much of the same skewed, problematic perspective as Nesta had in the beginning of ACOSF where she thought people sided with Feyre. I have such a problem that people in this fandom use that dialogue as a way that Elain is the rational one, or the one whose finally and rightfully sticking up for herself, or who is a victim of other people. Like no I’m sorry. I do agree that she is neglected in some sense, but there is more evidence that that is her choice than it is because of other people. She literally says that Nesta can’t hate her choice to live a simple life but also hate her getting involved. She locks herself away when Nesta is there. She pretends to garden for other people or whatever as Cassian notes it might have been a lie. She avoids Lucien. She is the one who though Feyre thinks she’s pleasant, they’re not extremely close, and that happened without Nesta involved at all. 

The mere act of saying it’s because of other people makes her a victim which is her whole character arc from the beginning, of her not helping even when she could just as much as Nesta. Nesta is both held accountable for her healing as in everyone pretty much pushes her to do it faster, and then also for that situation. Elain isn’t held accountable for either. Neither her own healing, Bc they didn’t push her at all even now. And also for that hunting situation.

We’ve seen literal evidence of Elain in ACOMAF where Elain is like softly being like Nesta we need to help and Nesta concedes. We’ve seen Elain stab the King of Hybern. We’ve seen her be pretty mean too in ACOSF, or at least biting back. She can help if she wants. That is not Nesta’s fault so I really really hope that that is her skewed narrative and it becomes an objective of character development as Feyre was to Nesta and it’s not used as another way that Nesta is criticized for something in the book as well as the fandom that is far more complex than “oh Nesta is mean. She hurts everyone. She’s an awful character. Blah blah blah.” But ultimately, I hope it’s used for Elain taking accountability of her own life. That it is not other people’s fault, she’s not happy or doing something or close with many people. Her narrative right now, even with the mate bond situation, is that she lacks control of her own life, but… uhh hate to break it to you. 

The evidence is there guys. Elain is having problems. Nesta is not THE problem, which for gods knows why I’ve seen on so many posts when they want to defend Elain. Defend Elain, she’s not a bad character. But not for this lol. This is one of her character flaws. 

[dontknow666]

And can I say that Nesta and Elain are isolated in Velaris?

Because they are. They never saw the world–Prythian–outside Velaris, they went to the Hewn city one time and Nesta went to a few meetings with Cassian when meeting with Eris. They do not have money of they own, we never even learn what happened to their inheritance from their father. As far as I know Nesta does not get paid for her work in the library or with the Valkyrie's. Quiet frankly they live on Rhysand and Feyre's money, and "kindness".

(Remember in acofas where Feyre made Nesta go to their solstice party using her rent money?)

Elain literally lives with them (how uncomfortable it must be to live with your little sister and her husband, and they famously like to solve their arguments with sex), and has nothing of her own. Her friends are their spies/maids that Feyre paid extra for befriending her and "helping" her.

They live in Velaris where Rhysand can tell any employer not to hire them, where Rhysand rules from.

But Nesta likes Velaris and Rhys offered her multiple jobs before locking her up!

Yes, he offered her jobs that most likely served him and where he would be her full-time boss. As a girl with a brother in law(that is like a brother to me no matter how much i shade him) I would not want him to be my boss, and do as he says.

If they wanted to escape the city they couldn't, because they do not know anyone outside of Velaris(someone they could trust). The reason they could lock Nesta up was because she had no other choice, had never saw the rest of Prythian or the Night Court.

The concept of it all is just wierd and uncomfortable for me. They live on Rhys and Feyre goodwill, and we all saw what happens when they do something they do not like.

And while we're here: WHAT THE FUCK IS SO SPECIAL ABOUT VELARIS?

[keinnamegewollt]

I fear I hate Cassian so much by now that even things his fans cite as positive now annoy me about his character. My dislike of him has grown too strong for me to leave anything he does without criticism.

For example, when he is “in awe how far she had come”. The reason he’s in awe is because she just saved “his High Lord and Lady and their son”. He prioritises her saving Feyre and Rhysand over her surviving the Blood Rite with her friends, which had also just happened. Not only that, but with the way it is framed, he also ignores that Nesta did it to save her own sister. She didn’t care about hierarchy. It almost seems as though part of what Cassian’s in awe of is her finally providing a service to her “betters”. What’s more, she had just also saved his own life - for the second time! – which he doesn’t even mention. It really seems as though he only sees good in her when it comes to things she can do for Rhysand.

Same with the scene about her Made weapons. Yes, he votes to tell her. But his first thought goes to how they can use Nesta to make the Night Court unstoppable, while Azriel is the one to warn that her abilities could put her in danger. No thoughts of that from her own mate. And while he votes for telling her, he still keeps it a secret from her.

The quote where he tells her all those wonderful things about how she can take her own time to heal, keep her sharp edges etc. sounds romantic without context. However, this happens right after the Hike from Hell he forced her on! His words are undermined by his own actions!

I’m probably letting my hate get away with me. I get why some of his words or actions can be taken in a more positive manner and I don’t want to act like I think it incomprehensible people dare to like him. For me though, the way he acts towards Nesta is too off-putting to enjoy those moments. So even when he says or does something nice, I’m side-eyeing him hard.

Like with the Symphonica gift: objectively a nice gift, yet I’m immediately reminded how he used to drag her out of taverns and refused to believe she actually loves music until Elain told him.

[silverflameataraxia]

It's the way Ruhn had nicer things to say about Lidia in a bonus chapter than Cassian said about Nesta in their entire romance novel.

Cassian

Cassian had heard enough. He wanted to return home - to the House, to Nesta. His fierce, beautiful mate, who had saved his High Lord and Lady and their son. He'd never stop being in awe of her, and all she had done. How far she'd come.

Ruhn

He couldn't get enough of her. Even living together these past several weeks, working together most days in the Aux...he couldn't stop wanting her, needing her. It wasn't just her body, though. It was Lidia herself - her wit, her dry humor, her bravery and selflessness and compassion.

He didn't care how much Flynn and Dec teased him. He was unabashedly, unrelentingly in love with this female. With his mate.

Lidia pulled away, and for a moment, Ruhn let himself admire her. His mate. His brave, lovely, brilliant mate.

And as Lidia slid a matching titanium ring onto Ruhn's finger, he wondered if they'd also need to invent a new word for love, to embody what overflowed from his heart.

What makes matters worse is that Cassian spent Nessian's book gushing over Mor and Feyre, but could only bring himself to be in awe of Nesta. He says he loves Feyre and Mor, but never says he loves Nesta. He spends all book trying to mold Nesta into a Feyre or a Mor rather than just falling in love with Nesta for who she is.

Ruhn doesn't care how much Flynn and Dec tease him because he's in love with Lidia. But Cassian cares so much what others think (mainly Mor) that it prevents him from fully seeing Nesta, let alone loving her. He spends all series long being embarrassed of Nesta where Mor is concerned. He wants to be with Nesta, but is embarrassed to tell Mor. He's intimate with Nesta, but is embarrassed to tell Mor. He's embarrassed to hold Nesta's hand in front of Mor. He's embarrassed to tell Mor that Nesta wants an ornate mating ceremony.

I can't tell if SJM just hates Nesta so much that she doesn't think that she deserves love. I mean, yeah, Nesta can be mean, but Lidia was literally a torturer for decades. Everyone deserves to find love, though.

Now I will say that the Ruhnlidia bonus chapter took place after Ruhn fell on his face a little bit, whereas Cassian's internal monologue took place before he fell flat on his face in HOFAS. So it could be that SJM is waiting for Cassian to gush over Nesta until next book, as some sort of redemption arc. Since Nesta's story isn't over yet, there's still time for some much needed Cassian character development.

Nesta deserves to be loved, cherished, valued, cared for, protected, gushed over, romanticized, and prioritized.

[pettyasshater]

"Nesta SELFISHLY stole her powers from the couldron so she didn't sacrifice them cause they weren't hers to begin with"

Not-so-friendly reminder that the Couldron is allegory for rape btw