LunaMiko

[thefourthfixed]

This is something I’ve wondered for a long time. Does anyone have any idea exactly why William doesn’t like Michael and doesn’t want to accept him as his son? Especially because he decided to have two more kids. What was it about Michael that was different? Does his similar appearance have something to do with it? As interesting as I find William I’ve always found it a bit hard to get inside his mind. But also we weren’t given an overwhelming amount of information about this relationship which I hate because it’s one of the most important relationships in the story lmao. Their similar appearance is emphasized over and over and over to a point where Michael ended up *literally* purple because Scott wanted to get that point across extra hard. But at the same time, the idea that William dislikes Michael came from The Immortal and the Restless (I think)? I was actually talking to someone about how Michael being so uniquely hated by him is unanimously agreed upon but was wondering where exactly that came from. Is there anything other than the Immortal and the Restless? I would love to know if there is.

Like most, I’m of the belief that William hated him enough to not even want to be associated with him (The Immortal and the Restless does make a good case for that) and considering William’s treatment of his other children throughout the franchise I think it’s basically canon that he’s an abuse victim. But I was thinking about it and I was just like, why? It’s not like William is a great father to Elizabeth and crying child but why is Michael singled out? Why does William wish Michael WASN’T his son? Williamheads I would love to hear your thoughts.

Even their voices are similar and P.J. Heywood (William and Michael’s voice actor is the same person which I’m sure was a deliberate decision) had this to say about that, and I have not been able to get this off of my mind:

“And in terms of playing the two, it does allow you to explore two sides of… what would otherwise be very similar people if it wasn’t for their characters. You know, William’s dead and shambling around. Michael’s dead and shambling around.”

I just want to know more about this relationship. I mean I’ve inferred based on what we know plus some logic how Michael was treated by William and how he feels about William, but I still haven’t quite figured out the reasons behind the way William feels about Michael. If there even is one.

P.J. Heywood also said that it sounds to him like Michael is trying to win William’s approval which I thought was worth putting here too since it counts as one of those crumbs of information.

I kind of understand what he means like, I feel like Michael might still want that deep down even if he hates William. But you know when I listen to the beginning of that speech it always reads to me as “I did what you asked me to and I succeeded, are you happy?” coming from someone who has never been able to do anything right for the person he’s speaking to. But I think there’s a tone shift, several actually, but specifically right at “There’s only one thing left for me to do. I’m going to come find you” that is threatening. It always sounded that way to me especially with the implication that Michael is the one who started the FNAF 3 fire (I think the “I’m going to come find you” is the warning and the scene we’re viewing is a flash forward to the aftermath) but I’ve seen other people say they don’t read it as threatening and I just. I like that we’ve all listened to that and tried to interpret emotions. My favorite one is after he says “they thought I was you” he makes this quiet noise and I still cannot decide if it’s a laugh at how ridiculous and unfortunate the situation is, or if it’s some sort of scoff from frustration at that fact.

Last thing I’ll put here, I’m not really a big fan of the new FNAF stuff but I did at least watch a playthrough of the new one. It didn’t resonate with me so I didn’t look very far into that Moon thing but this.

And in my mind, I’m immediately thinking of that toy phone in FNAF 4 and the question in the survival logbook asking Michael if his favorite toy was the phone. Maybe there’s another meaning for this line or something else it’s meant to represent that I don’t know due to not looking into it but it’s a question I’d been meaning to ask so it’s worth putting here.

[lunamikobrony2]

My guess would be two things:

1) Michael is A LOT like him

2) Michael has a mind of his own and he WILL stand his ground.

There might be a deeper story even before that, but it would be too much of a speculation: but these two points seem to be actually implied.

Their manner of speech, the "theatrics", are quite similar (look at William's voice lines in DBD and Mike's speech + constantly making jokes in survival book, for example) - they even look so alike.

And Mike is very proactive - he WILL take action and be bold with it, when sitiation calls for it.

What does it all make him? A rival.

He's so much like William, AND he goes against him, AND he's not going to just stay low - he's a threat to William. He could always become one, and with his actions William made him exactly that. If William wasn't so proud and stubborn - he could mold Michael into a second version of himself, but instead he chose to try and break him. And failed.

[kyri45]

HEY SO. do you think wukong would try to give mk one of his peaches of immortality? we know how scared he is of losing mk, showed both in the show and your recent update. but ive been thinking: maybe mk prizes his mortality. maybe mk doesnt want to live a life without mei, sandy, pigsy and tang, who from what i know are mortal as well, even though he would still be able to hang out with mac, wukong, the demon bull family etc. im not too sure if the monkey king would give him all that much time to think about that though, imo he might even force him to become immortal in one way or another just because he doesn't want to lose him too.

just wanted to share this. love your shadowpeach bio parent au and artstyle, ive said this before and ill say it many times again. also i hope youre doing well💙

Oh MK does prizes his mortality. For sure. I think Wukong definetly had the thoughts multiple times, especially when they first started to truly bond in the early seasons.

I think now he still has the thought, but in a way that is like a selfish wish. He want him to be immortal, but he hates himself for wanting that since he knows is not his choice to do so. That if he would force him to become immortal he would hate him forever for that, and that would be 100 times worse.

[lunamikobrony2]

Well, all this thing with Immortality...didn't MK try really-really hard to get an immortality peach in a race?...

I don't think MK wouldn't want immortality. What he WOULD want is to make his friends and family immortal too.

Him and Wukong share A LOT in common, and Wukong made as many monkeys immortal as he could, finding their names in the book of life. MK can be selfish, we saw it (though fandom seems to forget it sometimes), and that's something that mr. "I want things to never change" would find quite enticing. Spending his life happily, alongside his loved ones, for as long as possible - that's what Wukong wanted, and that's what I see MK wanting as well.

But he would ask them all first, that's FOR SURE.

[nightmarebunnyking]

I also dislike/hate when people say macaque is the better mentor for mk,when he only had one good life lesson,I also hate when people just call wukong a horrible mentor and ignore all his good lessons in s1/2 and rest of the seasons,that help mk grow and develop.

Those lessons help mk to learn how to control his powers and are great life lessons,wukong may not be the best mentor but you can't say macaque is better,when it only one example of a good lessons from s4

I hate seeing comments like

"Wukong sucks as a mentor,mk should choose macaque as his mentor then wukong"

"Wukong still terrible mentor,he sucks"

Wukong knows his student,he praised mk,when he tried his best,even helped him when he was struggling,wukong handles things,when mk can't.

Wukong has great mentor traits,I hate when people ignore that.People who say wukong a horrible mentor after s5 are ignorant.

Rant over

[lunamikobrony2]

Oh I FEEL ya.

We can see the huge progress MK made.

He didn't learn on his own, Wukong taught him. Sure, he learned SOME things by himself, like making clones (which went poorly), especially while Wukong was "on vacation" - but Wukong clearly gave him tasks and sent him scrolls to study.

Damn, Mei and Pigsy complain BECAUSE MK spends a lot of time training.

AND WUKONG PAYS SO MUCH ATTENTION to MK's needs, he encourages him (which he never got from HIS Masters), he mimics Tang's manner of telling stories, he owns up and apologizes when he makes mistakes, he doesn't push MK too far...

They really should give this two more screentime OUT of some big impending doom...

[royaltea000]

Me when I’m in a being coerced into parenthood competition and my opponent is sun wukong

[lunamikobrony2]

Welp, one of them also has a "daughter" now...

....STOP GIVING HIM KIDS, HE NEEDS A PARENT

[traumatournament]

Who's More Traumatized?

Valkyrie Cain (Skulduggery Pleasant)

Sun Wukong (Lego Monkie Kid)

Voting ended onSep 13, 2024

[n14-4cko]

This is late and I’ve only read skulduggery pleasant, so I will very haphazardly recite trauma inducing things, that I remember about Val from books 1-3

Grown man breaks into her house when she’s alone at the age of 12

Finds out her uncle was murdered

New detective skeleton friend, who wants to help with uncles murder, gets kidnapped by bad guy and is tortured. She’s also the one who had to convince others to help get him back

Other new friend helps save skeleton but gets turned into a statue and they cannot un statue him. He’ll do it by himself but it could take years

Bad guy helped kill the elders who could’ve helped stop bad guy (important gov type people)

Said bad guy is killed brutally in front of her (yay?)

Is attacked by another fully grown man (scapegrace) when she’s alone

Finds out a hitman and a mass murderer are trying to gain access to another reality (faceless ones. Old gods) and revive a monster (they need ancient blood. She has it) they have parts of a monster that originated from faceless ones reality and thus have a “connection” and that’s how they can open the portal

Kidnapped and blood is taken to try to revive monster

Has to fight said monster and barely escapes alive

Attacked by a vampire when with family

Though they beat the monster, the faceless ones (type of ancient that are BAD) have been alerted/summoned and could end the world

Statue friend is un statued but tells her his mum was a physic and saw a vision of her screaming in agony whilst dying

Attacked by a big f*ck off sea serpent called the sea hag

Whilst looking in caves for a special black crystal (in case they need to fight the faceless ones) that only ancient blooded people can touch, she’s captured by a sentient underground house to be his bride or something iirc

Kidnapped and put in jail by corrupt dude with some gov power

In said jail, shes with scapegrace who tried to kill her and is angry with her (despite her being 13/14 and there’s empty cells)

After breaking out she sees an attempted assassination on an ally and is powerless. Fights assassin and is nearly killed

Diablerie (new bad guy group) are attempting to use her new spiky haired teleporter friend to open a portal to the bad reality (faceless ones, there’s evil gods in there) and they have machine guns and explosives. They do not. Hitman is part of said group

Sword friend is badly injured (she’s vals new big sister role) and whilst trying to help her, sword friend is attacked again by hitman who is a much more skilled fighter than Val. She managed to cut him with sword friends sword though, but now hitman is very angry with her and comes back at some point.

Portal is opened by diablerie and some evil gods come through and possess people, they try to force them back through the portal the best they can but get injured and are in danger

They get the first two possessed through the portal, Skeleton friend pushes the last one through the portal and tells spiky teleporter friend to close the portal, but last minute gets dragged through and even though Val tried to save him, and skeleton reached out his hand for her, she wasn’t quick enough. And the portal closes.

This is roughly the first three books and I’ve absolutely missed some stuff 😭 Derek Landry did not hold back

[lunamikobrony2]

Ah, you know, just some 'lego piece" (who's a character from the book "journey to the west", btw) who was burning alive in a celestial furnace for 49 days, was trapped under a mountain for 500 years being "fed" molten copper, got "freed" only to protect some monk dude on a journey, being tricked into wearing a magical golden headband that crushes his skull as a punishment whenever his "master" recites a special sutra, travelled for more than a decade alongside his "brothers" who don't trust his judgement despite him literally having some magic eyesight that lets him see through demon disguises, which leads to him being punished for nothing when he tries to protect them...etc.

That's, like, a veeery surface level, lots of fun stuff, 100 book chapters of fun

[swkbiggestdefender]

I have to protect my beautiful kitty from mischaracterization you guys don't know him like I do >:[

-he never manipulated wukong he idolised wukong in unhealthy way putting him as this untouchable great being it's sucks but fighting the jade emperor was wukong plan/choice they were all in on it and responsible for it

-he's not a bad person he only wanted to help and save everyone like wukong and like wukong he went wrong about it but unlike him wukong later had someone to guide him (tang sanzang) on the right path azure didn't he truly believed that he was doing the right thing and when he finally found out that he was wrong he sacrificed his life to save everyone from his mistakes

-he never wanted to hurt anyone deep down and he made mistakes and redeemed himself with his life despite evreytime he loved his friends and they all loved him

[lunamikobrony2]

I wish Azure and Wukong got a chance to just sit down and talk to each other calmly, now that Azure probably realized most of his mistakes and Wukong got wiser after the journey (yes, he did, he just makes it hard to see by being a secretive ass and being so bad at relying on other people, and I can't really blame him for that, he was always the one to fix things and people doubt his judgement sooo often)

Azure, sweety, why did you have to fall appart so literally?

Guys, do you think we could...I dunno, gather his pieces and use some "magic" glue? Oof...

[vannilamango]

My thoughts on Mackie reposted here

If Macaque truly did abandon Wukong while he was under the mountain serving his I think 500 year punishment he a bad friend, i'm not saying he "needed" to be killed for pulling that but then coming back into Wukong's life?

Like hun no you left for 500 years. Left that man alone with nature to keep him company nobody to talk too and his guards feeding him pellets, leaving him to go mad, you can't just walk that back, like nothing happened, honestly, I'm surprised Wukong can even speak coherently.

Imagine your bestie you knew since ya'll were born, you two always been close, ones not seen without the other right, yall start stealing, it started small coins, old clothes then as the decades past suddenly now you're stealing a diamond, wait wtf how did we get here?!

How you got here was because you're an enabler honey, could've stopped at anytime, instead of saying "it's a bad idea, I won't go through with this", you still did it, went along with it, hell even enjoyed it, since it was thrilling and gave you a rush.

With all this stealing, you keep reminding yourself it's fine its asshole nobles and with your bestie you feel powerful, like you can take on anything, even though you knew the consequences were catching up to you both, you didn't stop just kept going.

Pretty much these to monkeys entire relationship, sorry for the whole stealing analogy this is how it made since in my squishy brain.

In conclusion Macaque was more of a yes man then a friend since a friend is going to tell you how stupid your being, but also not follow with what you're doing especially when what you two are doing will lead to awful things happening, to not just you two but everyone around you

[lunamikobrony2]

You know the scene where MK runs into flames to save Mei, saying things about not abandoning your friends? And Wukong and Mac look at each other?

I get so pissed when people say that "look" was about WUKONG abandoning Mac?

NO, people, Wukong WASN'T the one who abandoned his friend, he was CAPTURED and trapped.

MACAQUE left him, at his lowest point, alone, for 500 years. And came back to ruin his life when Wukong got a chance at redemption.

Just because Macaroni made a dramatic show to get his point across doesn't mean his point is right, he gives himself excuses and paints Wukong as "the bad guy" of his story to not feel bad about his own wrong doings

And because Wukong's secretive ass would rather loose one of his immortalities than speak up about HIS point of view - people are sooo quick to believe any nonsense THE VILLAINS say about him.

WE EVEN SAW IT ON SCREEN - MK CALLED OUT AZURE ON HIS BS AND PUTTING HIS OWN BLAME ON WUKONG (who, AGAIN, didn't say a word in his defence, just accepted all of it and we don't even know if he agrees)

And yet people still trust villains' words more than what is being shown. Damn it.

[starrclown]

(tw cannibalism just in case)

Also long post

Ok SO

I'm not sure if you would know but I remember at like the "start" of the book when they first met Lady Bone Demon and she turned into a pretty lady to trick Tripitaka into eating poisonous rice and while trying to convince Tripitaka that ,she is in fact a demon, Wukong said something about "also turning into a pretty lady when he was eating people" but here's the thing

I SINCERELY canNOT remember anything about him eating humans?

Maybe it's the translation that I'm reading but I couldn't find anything

Anyway TLDR

Did Wukong eat people or nah?

Your thoughts?

Honestly I am NOT the person to answer book stuff. The only stuff I know about Wukong is in LMK and what I personally learn. I've never read JTTW before, didn't know it was a thing till last year.

But I can see two explainations:

1. Translations. Jttw has been translated a few times, maybe your reading a translated text that leaves it out.

2. Other stories. Correct me if I'm wrong but Jttw isn't the only thing with Monkey King stories. So maybe he did eat people, but it wasn't in Jttw, it was in another tale.

Bonus: Maybe your just supposed to believe him. Do I believe this? No. But I think it's funny that he just says something and the book maybe may not have backed it up.

So did Wukong eat people? Maybeeeeeeee?

[lunamikobrony2]

Well, you see - later in the book, he managed to bring one dead dude back to live, and Sanzang said, that he was the best suited to do that, cause he DIDN'T eat any meat at all, unlike other his disciples.

So, irl explanation - those chapters were written by different people and contradict each other.

Lore-wise I'd say that Wukong lied in LBD chapter cause he wanted to sound more convincing, cause Sanzang didn't believe that she's a demon :D

[nightmarebunnyking]

The results of my poll,it seems that the majority are in agreement that wukong gets more punishment/consequences than macaque story wise and narrative wise,people that was part of the poll,please explain your reasons and why you think it that way in the comments and roblog

I am intrigued by the results

[lunamikobrony2]

Well, it's obvious not only if you compare Macaque to Wukong, but even more so if you compare him to Red Son

He's done LESS harmful things, didn't actively go after the main cast, just happened to stumble upon them from time to time. No manipulations and play-pretends, no "I will trap your friends in a lantern and make them fight you for no actual reason, but to just make you feel bad about yourself". He never claimed to be the good guy (quite the opposite, he reeeally wants to believe he's a villain)

And yet they did not trust him when they had a common goal. MK had to convince others to help. Mei, who had nothing personal with Red Son, was at him, accusing and not listening. Red son had to prove himself to be accepted, even though he wasn't that much of a threat in the first place.

And then there's THIS SIX-EARED GUY. Who went after MK BEFORE "LBD fooorced him" - no, she wasn't around in s1 e9, and wasn't quite in the picture yet in the second season - Mayor got his ass AFTER he was a menace to MK and kidnapped his friends. He threatened Mei on more than one occasion, pushed Tang down more than once, hurt Sandy, did all of those things to MK, for a lot of those he had NO REASON to act so "because LBD forced him" (no one forced him to attack a Dragon Palace, no one forced him to mess with Tang...) - and then...nothing? A few scoffs and sarcastic remarks in s3 special and that's all? We are all good now? Working alongside each other, hanging out on a beach and all?

And he has THE AUDACITY of telling Wukong things like "you should do better"???

Ta hell?

[lunar-wandering]

One(1) Silly shadowpeach / platonic ask:

Do you think that Macaque saved these self-sacrificial monkeys in s5 like. So many times because he wants to make up for what they did between the both of them and their friends? And that he feels guilty?

Can you imagine how weird that might be acknowledged in the future? Like, out of nowhere Macaque is being really, really kind and his troupe is just so confused. Like, Wukong never asked for peach turnovers? MK never asked for a new Monkey Mech game??? but here we are????

i love the concept of Macaque getting MK the newest Monkey Mech game because he one hundred percent stole that shit.

but ALSO THE WUKONG GETTING PEACH TURNOVERS AS GIFTS. HOLD ON. i have this hc that Macaque stress bakes whilst Wukong stress eats. they're literally perfect for each other like that- anyways quite frequently Macaque ends up with a lot of baked goods that he doesn't know what to do with so he just. gives them to Wukong.

but also yeah absolutely Macaque feels guilty and this is his way of trying to make up for it. to the point where it might even become detrimental to him. (we all talk about MK and Wukong being self-sacrificial, but I think we all overlook the fact that Macaque did things that damaged himself in order to help them. Getting trapped in the pagoda, and unleashing that burst of magic that incapacitated him- these are the same self-sacrificial tendencies that MK and Wukong display. oh gods, there's three of them. TBH the only reason Macaque didn't try to sacrifice himself to the pillar as well is because he didn't come from the stone that MK and Wukong did-).

(he didn't come from a stone at all most likely but that's a different playground of theories. i personally like the idea that he was formed in a tornado)

ANYWAYS. i've kinda been wondering recently if Macaque made... whatever deal he possibly made, in order to be able to protect people he cared about. it'd be interesting in that it'd make Wukong and Macaque's initial goals the same; protecting the other.

[lunamikobrony2]

Imagine if he made a deal to be a "proper warrior" for Wukong, cause he used to be a coward (Peng calling him that + "Cause you usually RUSH to my rescue" in sarcastic tone from Wukong)

But it ended up backfiring with this powers messing up his mind (his crazed laughter in Wukong's flashback) and with him using it against Wukong himself.

P.S.

Fic writers, here's a thought for you: "what if Wukong would've been less power-hungry and desperate for immortality, if I was strong enough to protect him to begin with?" - Mac (and then he comes to his aid again and again through seasons 3 to 5...)

P.P.S.

That's unlikely, but imagine if Mac made a deal trying to find a way to free Wukong, so that's where he was while not visiting Wukong for 500 years

[zephyrusswinds]

it is a crime how little the "you are such a gem line" (S1 Ep9) is utilized in fanfics, like hello??? the gayass interactions are writing themselves

[lunamikobrony2]

"Peaches" is overused

Make way for "gem", "gemstone", "sunstone", "treasure", "jewel" etc.

Wukong is A STONE, come ooon, guys

[itsabouttimex2]

“You need to do better.”

(This gets vitriolic, and is a full-blown criticism of Macaque’s portrayal in Season Four and Five. If criticism of a character/franchise you like upsets you, I do not recommend reading.)

Wow. I had no faith in his character writing, and I’m STILL disappointed.

And it only took one episode! How impressive!

Macaque, who has put in ZERO on-screen effort to become a better person or make amends to his victims, is criticizing Wukong for being a bad mentor! And does Wukong criticize him back? NOPE!

After getting screamed at and berated, does Wukong defend himself? NOPE!

Ooh, but there was a second long reference in a dual yelling match that mentioned that Macaque was a genuinely bad person who took glee in hurting innocent people! Oh, fucking delightful! Ooh, Wukong even points out in one episode that Macaque goes unpunished!

Pointing out a flaw in your writing does not make it less of a flaw.

Macaque will always be allowed to do whatever he wants to anyone he wants- power theft, attempted murder, insults, deceit, assault-

And the narrative and characters will never hold him accountable or force Macaque to look inwards or become a better person.

Macaque will always fall upwards into redemption without any obstacles or pushback.

There will never be a struggle to goodness with a satisfying conclusion. There will never be a moment where falters in his newfound goodness and questions going back to his old ways. There will never be explicit remorse or regret. He will never have deep introspections on his crimes and atrocities that provide a reason for him to want to change.

The sum of his “arc” will always be “you were a good guy all along”, and that lack of depth is where it will stay.

RIP Seasons 1-3 Macaque. You were fun and interesting and cool and lovable.

But the man they replaced you with was destined to be a boring and brooding “anti-hero” who has no real connection to the actions you selfishly and violently performed with your own two hands-

And you will always be a less interesting character for it.

The execution of the actual arc boils down to a single heroic (but ultimately self-serving) moment and then Macaque is immediately forgiven for all the crimes he’s committed and is a magically better person without any effort and nothing he’s done is ever brought up again.

It severely weakens any character’s arc to cut them off from their past actions. If MK forgot his traumas every season instead of carrying them forward- we’d all agree that doing so was a case of poor writing.

It was the reason that people disliked Mei’s portrayal in Season Four- she immediately moved on from the Samadhi Fire arc and “no longer wielded it” after spending a whole season gathering and learning to use it.

Why can’t we agree that it’s bad for Macaque, too?

You can’t “develop” a character by dropping an entire plotline and writing it off with one line.

You can’t “redeem” a character by pretending that they were a good person right from the start.

Sorry, bud.

I really did like you. I just wish I could like your writing.

——————

And, what is more clear to me now than ever?

People only defended Macaque’s shitty writing because they think he’s hot.

I know this now, because I’ve seen white-hot Li Jing arc hatred from fervent Macaque arc defenders.

So we all agree that an “I didn’t really mean it!” isn’t an excuse to abuse the people around you? That you don’t get to mistreat innocent people just because you’re stressed and upset?

Hmmm.

Hmmmmmmm.

I wonder why people despise Jing for his dogshit “one nice thing redeems all your bad actions” arc but love Macaque for his??

(Because they think the monkey is hot.)

The funny thing, though?

Li Jing apologizes to at least one of the victims of his actions. He expresses regret and remorse.

Macaque doesn’t even have that.

——————

Anyways here’s a line that I hate because Macaque has in no way developed enough to have the right to deliver it-

AND NO, SUDDENLY HAVING AN AFFINITY FOR PERFORMING KIND OR SACRIFICIAL ACTS IS NOT GOOD CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT

HIM MAGICALLY OFFSCREEN BECOMING A GOOD PERSON WHO CARES ABOUT INNOCENT LIFE IS NOT GOOD CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT

IF ALL IT TAKES TO “BE BETTER” IS ACTING LIKE A HERO, WUKONG IS LITERALLY A THOUSAND TIMES BETTER OF A PERSON THAN HE IS

THIS LINE IS DOGSHIT

“You need to do better.”

Really, Macaque? Maybe you should take your own damn advice- try apologizing to one of the people you tried to hurt and tried to murder in cold blood!

Like when you trapped MK under his staff after stealing his powers and tried to murder him when he was helpless?

Or when you kidnapped MK’s friends and tortured the kid by forcing him to fight them?

Or you led a violent assault against a palace full of innocent people?

Or violently beat his dear friends until they were screaming in pain?

Or assaulted Tang, who posed no threat to you?

Or threatened to murder an innocent girl if you didn’t get your way, then ran away (and encouraged MK to abandon her) first thing when it put her into a life-threatening meltdown of raw power?

(Isn’t it cool how NONE of these people have interesting or varied reactions to him doing this and ALL immediately forgive him like a gelatinous hivemind.)

(Oooh ONE mildly questioning line from Pigsy but no anger over his adoptive son nearly being killed multiple times over)

(Isn’t it cool that no one has complex or interesting thoughts on this.)

(Isn’t it cool that by robbing them of unique feelings on the matter they robbed Macaque and the Monkie Kids of compelling and interesting interactions that could’ve helped flesh out their personalities and strengthen their characterization.)

(Isn’t it cool that Macaque and the Monkie Kids are actively denied intriguing character dynamics so Macaque’s shitty “redemption arc” can happen faster.)

(Isn’t that cool.)

Why don’t YOU do better, Macaque?

(In a way that is more satisfying than “one naive and blatantly untrue speech from a kid that I tried to murder changed my mind and now I am a better person but all my character development happened offscreen and without personal introspection”, at least.)

Also what the fuck do you mean by “do better”?

Be heroic and put your life in danger? He already does that! He’s done it more than you have!

Just tell MK that he’s not alone? YOU COULD DO THAT YOURSELF, MACAQUE!

Help MK with his traumas and fears? MK doesn’t tell anyone about those! He keeps them bottled up, lock and key, and actively refuses attempts to help!

Wukong TRIED to reach out to him, and MK PUSHED HIM AWAY! Was he supposed to tie the fucking kid down and torture the information out of him?

He respected MK’s boundaries by not pushing any further and letting him leave!!

WHY IS THAT A BAD THING??

What the fuck, man

[rainandthoughts]

I want Pigsy's Noodles to be destroyed - a very angsty theory

(Spoilers)

I theorize this can happen, because if MK really does go apeshit, that would be the final trigger.

Because that little noodle shop, is the most comfortning place for MK.

Its the place he got a place to call home.

Its the place his dad is.

Its the place where he can seek comfort.

Therefore the best way to break MK, would be to take that away.

And then imagine if Pigsy was in the building when it got destroyed-

[lunamikobrony2]

Let Wukong (and maybe Macaque??) help with rebuilding it, so Wukong could say "that's what friends do" to MK

[lunar-wandering]

What’s an underrated shadowpeach hc of yours

....really hard question to answer cause idk how people rate my shadowpeach hcs in the first place hsdlfkjsldkfjs

uhhhhhh hm. i think. maybe i'll say. ...idk Wukong being the tsundere one???

like. Macaque is just shy. he'd stutter and stuff and maybe run away but he's not an outright denier. Wukong is the one that will say shit like "it's not like I care about you or anything" and all that.

[lunamikobrony2]

That's not a hc, it's canon-

Him being all "cool" and acting standoff-ish with MK in s1 and his friends in s3

Him being passive-agressive with Mac, even though it's obvious he's playing it up constantly...

Seems like he'll be either "cool" and "distant", or mocking and passive-agressive with anyone, untill something happens for him to get scared at the possibility of pushing people too far away (almost loosing MK in s1 e9, which changed his attitude with him, the whole samadhi fire thing, after which he finally got closer to MK's friends...), I'm more than sure it happened with him and pilgrims at some point too :D

I mean, understandable - Wukong was exiled by his Master (Subodhi), was not accepted by Celestials, then was abandoned by the whole Brotherhood - at some point one turns from attention-seeking kid into a bitter monkey, afraid of opening up and getting close to people (but he still can't help it and does get attached )

[fruitybowl]

Lol, I agree with ya. Technically speaking, the closest we've got to nicknames is Macaque calling Wukong "your majesty" sarcastically, and Wukong saying "you're a peach." So if ANYONE is calling anyone peaches, it's Wukong to Macaque lol. Which is like suuuuper funny, because you don't associate peaches with a black furred grumpy monkey.

I like to think Wukong would call Macaque peach/peaches because peaches are his favorite food, so in a way he would be call Macaque his favorite <3 but I also think it be hilarious if they just continued calling each other “BUD” after committing to one another.

[lunamikobrony2]

I mean...Macaque also called Wukong a gem ("you're such a gem", s1 e9)...which, sure, was sarcastic, but is actually fitting, cause Wukong is a stone :D

And considering moments like Mac calling MK "misery kid" and such - seems like out of two of them he's more prone to coming up with nicknames, cause Wukong just defaults to "bud" most of the time, though there are things like "Jangles" and "Nezhie" once he gets closer to people.

[everyfandomsprincess]

Monkie Kid season 5 spoilers:

So it’s revealed that Mk was awoken, I guess is the best word for it, eons earlier than intended.

Meaning he should still be ‘asleep’ in the stone rock. So all of MK’s fears/spiraling about how all the villains are because of him is kinda true.

I mean what would of happened if he was never there?

I mean Red Son did manage to release his father with his gauntlet. So would the DB family just be ruling the city?

Possibly, but most likely the LBD wouldn’t have been released?

And either way I doubt the Spider Queen would have been such a threat?

And what about Macaque? Would he still be here if there was no LBD? And if he was, what’s to stop Wukong from destroying him again (I mean Macaque called him out in that episode for holding back for MK)

I just keep thinking about what was ‘supposed to happen’ if MK was never awoken, but everything seems so tied together that I keep going in circles

[lunamikobrony2]

Well...

Wukong WAS PRESENT (the bird) when Red Son released DBK (he could actually be the one who ordered noodles to get MK there), he'd deal with the whole Bull Family right then and there.

Macaque would've either hide and plot, or be dealt with quickly, without holding back.

Spider Queen could actually be a problem, since LBD could be freed by Mayor, and DBK wouldn't be around if Wukong dealt with him before, so...yeah, there'd need to be another way to get out of her mech. On the other had - LBD wouldn't have the furnace, since there'd be no Red Son and MK with his group for anyone to go after it.

Wukong had to rush and get distracted cause he had MK waiting for him during his search for a weapon against LBD. And LBD got strong BECAUSE SHE STOLE POWERS AND THE STAFF FROM MK. So, if there's no furnace, and Mac is out of the picture - LBD could be dealt with sooner...though, if Mac wasn't dealt with before - he'd be quite a pain in the ass, since Wukong still could go after Samadhi fire and get hurt by Nezha's seal at it's map, leaving him vulnerable (WHILE BEING ALONE) for quite a while.

The scroll wouldn't be opened by MK, and if Azure couldn't get it in Wukong's treasury - no Brotherhood returning...though, Nine could've given it to Azure any other way - but would Nine even do this if MK's not around? Huh...

...so, yeeeeah, I guess Wukong could've dealt with pretty much all of those easier by himself, rather than with MK and his friends .-.

@cherllyio (yup, me tagging you again, dunno if you'll find it interesting, but maybe you'll have some thoughts as well? ^^")

[deliveryboysomewhatequaltoheaven]

The Macaque Problem

I would definitely say Macaque's character is an issue for the show. His redemption arc is not good, and it brings down the other characters and takes up their time and arcs.

When we first see him in S1 and 2, he is an old frenemy of Wukong's bitter over an unspecified falling out. He is angry and lashing out at MK and his friends, projecting this feud onto them. He claims MK didn't notice his friends were gone, but we see him trying to call Mei, and that the others were resentful, but we see tang looking upset being forced to attack MK. Seems like a clear enough villain concept with some room forward right? But S3 and 4 derail that.

Chronologically, we can talk about the Brotherhood, (which he was not a part of in JTTW, and he complained abt being left behind in S2 but here he was?? Eh) He claims that Wukong pushed ahead without thinking or listening and that's what got him trapped in the mountain. But what do we see before Wukong surrenders to the Jade Emperor?

The rest of the Brotherhood trapped by the Celestial Army. We don't see Wukong fight the Jade Emperor. He was an immortal shapeshifter, I have no doubt Wukong could have escaped. But he turned himself in to save his friends. Was he in a bad mood in the mountain? I mean, yeah, but Macaque doesn't seem to consider that he's free because Wukong is not.

We still don't know about the final falling out and Macaque's seeming death, though S5 implies that Macaque pushed the situation. Still, it's not good, because if they can't properly resolve it, than it's just going to remain between them and Macaque's grudge against Wukong can't be properly moved past, which hampers his arc.

But then S3 happens, and honestly I think Macaque's motives are dumb. Why is he trying to get in the way of them stopping LBD if he also wants to be free of her? It's a positive for you! But they also start trying to portray him as someone who 'calls Wukong out' because S3 and 4 really try to make Wukong out to be a jerk. He made mistakes but it was a desperate situation against the Lady Bone Demon. I love Mei and Pigsy but they also call him out when they said nothing about the Fourth Ring/visions.

'You will make things worse for MK when I personally attack and threaten him and his loved ones for my own gain' OK Macaque!

But the S3 special is the real kicker. Macaque apparently changes his mind and we don't know why. They show some mistrust at first until MK says he knows Macaque is not a bad guy deep down... but doing one or two helpful things after three seasons of stalking, threatening, and attacking the gang doesn't exactly convince me.

And then this bit from the S3 special finale:

Uh, how??? Wukong is right, Macaque was until very recently willing throw everyone under the bus so he could get away from LBD. It's pretty rich that he would call Wukong self centered. Whatever Wukong did was trying to stop her and protect MK from having to deal with it.

In the S4 special, they also have Macaque talk about Azure Lion, and again I'm not sure why we are listening to him on characters' morality

Says the guy who wrote a play about how 'Sun Wukong is a big old meany who hurt my precious little fee-fees' if I never see or hear the hero and warrior monologue again it will be too soon but I will say he at least seems to consider he might have been wrong, though they don't really dwell on it...

Even in S5, we get this bit.

Once again, Wukong is right!! After 3 seasons of attacking and harassing MK I don't think he really gets to give advice. Plus WUKONG WAS TRYING TO TALK TO MK ABOUT IT RIGHT BEFORE THIS! But MK was not doing well emotionally and Wukong was trying to be mindful and not push!

And honestly I think they all let Macaque off easy for the S3 events, he literally choked out Mei and threatened to kill her! (Sidenote: he can call MK and Tang by their names, but Mei was just 'the girl' throughout S3... urgh)

But when Wukong gets mad at him, Macaque says "I didn't do this!" Well you forced the gang to do something that you didn't know what the consequences of would be! But Tang intervenes saying he did it, even though he awkwardly admits Macaque forced him but that he felt he should because of the golden cicada. Macaque later decides to leave the situation he forced. He later does help some, but doesn't really get held accountable for his part in everything.

But I guess it's fine bc at the end of the special MK gives him this drawing. This is actually kind of really upsetting and again makes little sense considering how much he and Mei care about other otherwise. But nah Macaque is cool now it's fine...

And Ao Guang! This is a tougher one, but in S5 they had Macaque let himself get sent to the Pagoda to buy others time... well I just say that's karma!

And Macaque comes back, of course, but we never hear more about Ao Guang. Even when they send the power of the Stones out, we do in fact see the East Sea Palace and the attendant, but not him, so his fate is unclear.

So yeah, overall, I think he was forgiven too fast, the root issue of his fight with Wukong unaddressed, and he takes up time from the others characters.