You can't support healthy multiplicity and oppose created systems.
If someone intentionally becoming plural makes you uncomfortable because you think being a system is inherently less healthy than being a singlet, then it logically follows that a system who achieves healthy multiplicity is less healthy than one who achieves final fusion.
Normalizing healthy multiplicity can't happen when the support of many boils down to "I support you in choosing to be less healthy than if you fused."
I don't think that's the intention. These groups haven't thought that far into it, and don't want to confront their own internalized sanism and cognitive dissonance.
But intent doesn't really matter. r/systemscringe and r/fakedisordercringe are listening, and their takeaway is that all multiplicity is a terrible experience that nobody would ever want, and anyone who has positive experiences with being plural are lying fakers.
Every post falsely claiming created systems are unhealthy puts just a little bit more stigma of healthy multiplicity out into the world.
Where the actual fuck is your source for claiming anti-endos are pro-genocide? That's a HUGE fucking claim to make a biiiiiig stretch. Like you are actively dismissing people who are Tibetan who have said there's an issue with the usage of the term already- and now you're claiming a HUGE demographic is pro-genocide?
Who? I'm genuinely curious. I don't see many anti-tulpas who actually identify as Tibetan Buddhists. A lot are really vague about the type of Buddhism they practice or don't even seem to know where the tulpa even comes from.
Before going any further, it's important to understand the relationship between China and Tibet. I covered this in another post:
Because this...
Describing the Dalai Lama, the leader of Tibet from before it was even annexed by the China and has lived most of his life i
The above post was in response to an anti-endo who repeatedly echoed CCP talking points that "Tibet is a part of China," which while true from a certain point of view, is a little disturbing in a conversation about the cultural identity of the Tibetan people. This culminated in them describing the Dalai Lama as an "80-year-old Chinese Man," which is incredibly invalidating to the Tibetan people who have been struggling to maintain their freedom for reasons so obvious that I shouldn't have to spell out.
And the anti-endo community... doesn't care.
I wouldn't say they're pro-genocide. They're just... genocide-neutral when it comes to Tibet. By erasing the unique cultural identity of the Tibetan people, they can pretend that all Asians are a monoculture and anyone of any Asian descent have just as much right to declare Tibetan Buddhism as a closed practice and anything borrowed from it appropriation.
Even if that ancestry may be from the same people who invaded and are oppressing Tibet, it doesn't matter to them, because anti-endos don't care about Tibetan culture, history or autonomy any further than using them as talking point to silence one of the largest communities of created systems
They're okay with repeating CCP propaganda that erases Tibetan identity as long as that propaganda suits their own interests.
Anti-endos, at every opportunity, erase the history of Tibet and Tibetan religious leaders.
They claim that Tibetan Buddhism is a closed religion, something that practically every Tibetan Buddhist will tell you is wrong in a heartbeat, and erases the countless monasteries across the globe that are welcome to everyone.
When that doesn't work, they will claim that Tibetan Buddhist practices cannot be used by people who aren't Tibetan Buddhists, contradicting the Dalai Lama himself encouraging other religions to use Tibetan Buddhist meditations.
They will try to paint the story of how the tulpa arrived in the West as one of white people stealing Tibetan culture, erasing the involvement of translator Lama Kazi Dawa Samdup in bringing Tibetan culture to the West, tulpa included, helping to spread knowledge of their religion around the world in a way that would appeal to Western audiences.
And as we see above, many anti-endos will go so far as to actively support CCP propaganda that brands Tibet as nothing more than just another part of China or the Dalai Lama a "Chinese man," literally supporting the CCP in its aim of erasing Tibet's identity.
Make no mistake, the anti-endos who pretend to be so angry over people identifying as tulpas don't actually care about Tibetan culture. They don't care about the secular CCP trying to take control of the religion. They don't care about teachers being imprisoned for teaching the Tibetan language.
When the current Dalai Lama passes, the CCP will try to choose their own illegitimate reincarnation as they did the Panchen Lama. Anti-endos and you won't hear a peep out of anti-tulpas who will continue to act as if the greatest atrocity to befall Tibetan culture is created systems borrowing a word with a Tibetan etymology.
The whole thing is just performative.
Anti-endos try to speak for Tibetan Buddhists, rewrite Tibetan history, and erase the autonomy of Tibetan Buddhist spiritual leaders to determine who can and cannot use their spiritual practices. Then they turn a blind eye when their own echo CCP rhetoric that has been used to justify the cultural genocide of Tibet.
"DID/OSDD experiences and endogenic experiences are so different! we have nothing in common! our communities need to be separate, there's nothing for us to learn from each other!"
i have seen literally so many of my experiences and feelings (including the ones that are extremely typical to the medical model of DID, btw) reflected in the words of endogenic & nondisordered plurals describing their own, lol. i have yet to see a single functional difference that would allow a clear line to be drawn between all 'DID/OSDD system experiences' and all 'endogenic system experiences'.
Someone just followed. Like. Three of our very explicitly pro-endo blogs and we look at their blog and everything they reblog is anti-endo and AEMOGAI stuff.
I feel like a lot of people get all angry about transids and especially trans(diso)plural ids because they can’t see why someone would want this, and I can understand that.
But to say it’s ableist is… subjective.
It’s really a matter of… how you personally feel about it. In our (disabled, disordered plural) opinion, someone who wants to have DID might be, well, misguided? but it’s also not my place to stop them or make them feel bad for something that actually has no effect on me. But this is just our opinion, another disordered system might think differently, and that’s okay.
Most people say it’s ableist and then use a purely personal, emotional reason to justify why they think it’s ableist. Instead of attacking people who feel like they should be transplural or whatever else, just block them for your own emotional and mental well-being.
again. bodily autonomy, fundamental bodily autonomy HAS to have room for people doing things with their own bodies that you do not and will not approve of. if it doesnt, it is not bodily autonomy
We don’t think it’s ableist, as a disordered system. We find it kind of nice that people want to be like us in a way, shows that we’re not horrible monsters for being a disordered system.
This is our opinion and disagreeing with it is obviously fine, you do not have to agree– but one does not need to add actual hate and venom to a post that’s supposed to be positive.
If it really, truly bothers you, please for your own mental health, just block both of these blogs and move on. /g
how did you get so far into denial about being trans, you had to create a new identity to deflect it all. mate you can be trans. you ended up twisting around beliefs that you have ended up supporting things that made it ok but still didnt address the original event. also you dont have did or osdd please stop speaking over people who do.
It's always weird to me how accusing people of "speaking over" others has become a way of silencing any disagreements. Having a disorder doesn't give people special insight about anything other than their own experiences. It doesn't automatically make you informed on every type of experiences and any similarities that may exist between them.
Having a dissociative disorder doesn't grant an authority to claim the experiences of endogenic systems are fake.
It’s no different than when transmeds claim authority to decide who is "really" transgender or when psychotic IRLs fakeclaim Otherkin and push a narrative that the only way to view yourself as nonhuman or a fictional character is by having a psychotic disorder.
Personal experiences are so valuable in so many ways... but they don't give you a window into other people's brains. They don't give you some magical authority to be able to fakeclaim others because their experiences are different from yours.
As to the fakeclaiming at the beginning... first, gross... second, I want turn this into a PSA for anyone reading.
PSA: it's not normal to have "genders" who talk to you in your head with their own sense of self and memories.
If you find yourself with multiple genders... and those genders have their own names... and they have conversations with you in your head with their own internal voice that you recognize as them... and your memories of what "you" did while "you" were that gender feel like you're remembering things that happened to someone else...
“Yeah I’m genderfluid and on my feminine days I also have a vampire kintype and on my masculine days I have a deer kintype, and I really hate being called any other name besides Crystal when I’m femme or Eren when I’m masc, and when I am genderless I like to be called Aster and I feel like a fox. Sometimes I have a lapse in memory when I feel different genders. But it’s just genderfluidity.”
Yeah, no. Like Sophie said, if these other “genders” talk to you and reply to you, among other things, they’re likely not just “genders.”
Someone dropped screenshots from academic sources on r/systemscringe.
Here are all the images they posted before the mod deleted the thread. (Isn't it funny how they can delete science instantly but take days to deal with raids?)
Their reaction, of course, instant denial...
Let's just cover this, then.
Screenshot 1 is from the ICD-11.
Screenshots 2-4 are from a book called Transgender Mental Health that was reviewed and published by the APA.
Screenshot 5 was written by the creators of the Theory of Structural Dissociation.
Well, of course you wouldn't think so. 🙄
The standard of "reputable sources" for r/systemscringe seems to go no further than "does it confirm my pre-existing beliefs."
That sysmed fucking blocked me but drawing a concept you also drew that they want to use, but they can’t use your exact thing because you told them to “DNI,” IS NOT FUCKING VIOLATING YOUR DNI.
THEY DID NOT INTERACT. THEY MADE THEIR OWN. FUCK OFF.
System discord emojis! Descriptions are in alt and are as followed;
blurry* | tulpa
fictive | factive | brainmade+
caretaker | host | co-host
gatekeeper | protector | sexual headmate
systeen | syskid
* blurry can describe when it feels like several headmates are 'blurring' together.
+ brainmade is a headmate that does not come from an external source
---------------
I saw a cool set of system emojis but the artist didn't want endogenic systems interacting, so I made my own versions! I think I covered the most popular roles and am pretty happy with how they turned out! ^^
You're free to use them for any non-commercial use and credit isn't required unless you edit the originals. Do not claim them as your own.
I don’t mean to start drama but for the love of god don’t take my idea. If you are at least credit me AT LEAST. If you want endo sysmojis I genuinely don’t care, just don’t take my idea. What part of “endos dni” did you not understand? This is incredibly upsetting. Don’t do this. This makes me so uncomfortable.
I'm personally having trouble with the part where you think someone making their own thing borrowing a vague concept (colored torso with floating object heads) is "interaction." And the part where you think someone who is on your DNI list and has several followers who are also on your DNI list should publicly post your name for all their followers?
It feels like you're upset about something that isn't interacting with you in any way... and also want them to credit you for a vague idea in a way that could cause actual interaction with people you don't want to interact with.
I would never condone actual art theft, but they made their own emojis with their own symbols to represent them that are distinct from yours, and even had the torso tops different to distinguish them further. (Using more human-shaped torsos with arms vs basic shaped bodies with straight lines.)
I saw a post claiming it's acceptable in the plural community to have traumagenic systems in your DNI to make a case for some sort of double standard and.... that's not a thing.
Quick! Do a search of the tags "#endogenics dni" vs "#traumagenics dni."
You will notice quickly that one is a real tag people post in while the other...
I don't know anyone who would support or be okay with "traumagenics DNI tags" either.
"Anti-endos DNI" is much more common. Because shockingly, people don't like interacting with members of hate groups. That's not at all comparable to having endogenic systems in your DNI.
I also find the justifications for the endogenic DNIs really weak.
"We're not bigots discriminating against a marginalized community, we just don't think they can relate to us..."
Okay, but like, I notice a distinct lack of "#singlets DNI" in those too... the relatability thing clearly isn't the legitimate reason.
We need to acknowledge that certain DNIs are expressions of bigotry. Someone with "autistics DNI is ableist." Someone with "trandgenders DNI" is transphobic. And whether we call the anti-endo bigotry "system medicalism" or "endophobia," it is bigotry. It's hate. And no one should pretend otherwise.
Having said that, I do support people having "endogenics DNI" banners and tags for the same reason I support people wearing MAGA caps. It's incredibly useful to be able to identify bigoted people just by looking at them. I would much rather deal with those wielding chainsaws than hidden knives because with the former, you know right away to turn around and run the opposite direction as fast as you can, while the latter is going to stab you in the back.
I also believe that these DNIs should be respected. Not because hate groups are deserving of respect, but because there's nothing of value to be gained by interacting with them. Anyone using that DNI isn't willing to listen, and all you can accomplish by interacting directly is making both them and yourselves miserable.
The best way to deal with bigots is often to just ignore them when you're able. And if they want to be ignored, that seems like a win for everyone!
There are multiple reasons why someone would see a transabled identity and feel that it applies to them, usually being that they already have some traits of the disorder they identify as having.
Another reason I could see is that they ARE genuinely disabled and don’t know what words to use to describe their disability.
And yet another reason is that they’re genuinely disordered but identify as their condition being “better” or “worse” (transseverity). The former I’ve seen as an actual goal (much like transition) or to describe the level of severity they feel they should have, and the latter I’ve seen people identify with to feel more valid in their condition.
I can remember back in high school (2010-14) we totally would have called ourselves transDID before finding out we already WERE plural. Thing is we always suspected it and even knew of two total alters in high school.
POINT IS that even though transdisability seems weird on the surface, maybe it’s just natural progression for a normal phenomenon.
Y’all don’t really “need” a separator in MOGAI anyway, just say you’re anti-endo and leave it at that.
Or like, you know, acknowledge that barring certain demographics from using your terms just because you disagree is pretty childish. If you’re really that concerned just mention being anti-endo somewhere on your blog and block who you see fit, and those who read it can choose whether you’re someone they want to interact with anyway.
Plurality Is Not As Black & White As Sysmeds Say @pluraldiscourse - Tumblr Blog | Tumgag
