Savan Kotecha: Very well-known and successful songwriter who has worked with a ton of acts, including a lot on One Direction’s first 2 albums (”One Thing,” “Kiss You,” “Up All Night”). He worked on the X Factor the season the boys were on, too.
Ross Golan: Songwriter who wrote “If I Could Fly” with Harry for “Made in the A.M.”
So it’s kind of like, the old guard meeting the new guard of songwriters and talking about One Direction a little during this longer podcast.
After talking about not breaking acts like Ariana and the Weeknd, but helping them surpass their middling chart performances and break into real Top 10 of the Top 40 Radio market:
Savan: But, yeah, we didn’t break an act. And even though One Direction is not, like, a credible act, the way, the-the meetings I had with the industry, because, whether or not all the boys recognize [laughing] the development I did for that band from day one, everyone that was around it that was in charge of it, they all saw it, and that spread within the industry. And the tremendous success obviously.
Ross: Is that why you pulled away from them, or is it just sort of like, they grew up-
Ross: And do their own thing, because they want to go and try to be more credible and-
Savan: Yeah, I think, like, it was a lot in the very beginning. And I’ll take a lot of blame for some of the stuff in the very beginning. They were a manufactured boyband. That’s what it was. They weren’t all hustling musicians trying to make it. They were on a TV show and, and we purposefully, and I was open about that. Like ‘you’re gonna hate hate the music that you do in the beginning.’ Like, I was open about that. You’re 17, 18 year old boys, you’re not supposed to like what a boyband does. Historically, that’s just not how it’s gonna go. And that’s what happened, but it blew up. And yeah, I think by album 3 [Midnight Memories], yeah, not all of them, there was definitely one or two-one especially-that was like, kind of bitter about the fact, that, you know-
Ross: They were a boyband?
Savan: -and he was not the talented one. He wasn’t the singer, and he wasn’t the star. And you know which one I’m talking about…
Savan: And he then started having something against me and against that process, I think. And, you know, maybe we could have been more inviting in the creative process during album 2 [Take Me Home] and not been so…authoritative, but. What happened is that, also, I knew the from day 1. They would cry on my shoulder, because I was with them through the show, and development. No one knew what that thing could be, and who could sing lead, or what that was. And that was me helping shape that thing. And especially the first record. You know, the label wanted, there was this, like, Stargate [another production team] reject Rhianna dance-y song, that they really wanted to do. And I was like ‘No, that can’t be the direction.” ‘Cause, like, they were like my little brothers. I had a lot invested, in like, my time, and emotionally in these kids and their parents and everything.
Ross: Because of the show.
Savan: Because of the show. And the U.K. show is really intense. You become family. It’s three months, and, I love those kids.I will always pick up the phone if any of them call. Even like, that one. And I remember with, like, Julien, I had to convince some of them that, like, ‘you should go in with Julien, he’s really good.’ And agree to go in with him, and like, I think like, and, and when they did, I mean, I’m really happy for Julien in all that.
Savan: Because I think, like what he was able to do, because he came from a different perspective. Like, I came from ‘these are kids from a show and I’ll tell you guys what to do,’ because in the beginning, that’s what I had to do. And I think, for me, it was then hard for me to see them in a different way. And I think they needed, especially a few of them, like needed, people who could see them in a different way.
Savan: And it’s kind of hard for me to see them-it was hard for me to adjust and see them in a different way. They’d be like ‘yeah, I’ll give you musical-yeah, you have musical credibility.’ ‘Cause I already had a bunch of hits with them, with people, and for me, it was like ‘you guys didn’t know what you were doing in the beginning, so why-.’ For me and looking back, I’m sure my process was like ‘but of course they don’t know what they’re doing or saying. they’re just from a show!’ You know what I mean?
Savan: And I was wrong. I was wrong to think that way, because they’re, they’ve grown into like, especially some of them, have grown into like really knowing what they’re doing. I mean, like Harry’s a fantastic writer.
Ross: We did that song. Harry and Johan [Carlsson] and I did that song [”If I Could Fly”] it was shocking how good he is.
Ross: [talking over Savan] And these kids are now working with the best writers, been on tour with the best artists, and been on tour throughout the world, you know, and your developing years spent, spending those four or five years listening to amazing writers…if you’re open-minded, and you know, these kids all should be really good.
Savan: Yeah. And at the point, it was like, yeah. And you know, it was also just the social thing, where like I had a baby during the second album. I couldn’t be around, hanging, going on tour with them, and doing that thing with them. If you haven’t had this yet, but when you like, help an artist start from the beginning and you guys are close, you start going on tour. There’s a lot of other people, they start meeting other artists and other writers. And there’s a lot of people that want to go get in there, and be in your position, and that happens, and that becomes, like, this mind fuck. So, with Harry, it was really interesting. Harry always-especially since album two-you really saw he’s a really fucking good writer. Like, we did a song together, like for the third album [”Happily”], the only thing we did for the third album, and he was just-the song “Happily” which I’m really proud of, and I think he is, as well. He was-it wasn’t like that thing, where like, writing down for the artist, he was like fucking great, like bringing ideas. So that was cool to see. But I think, especially, with like one of the particular members, it was hard to see that person, and like take that person the way he wanted to be seen, and he became, like, the loudest voice of the group. And at that point, I just told the label, it became kind of like unhappy for me to feel like, ‘why’s he doing that?’, like, so for me it became just this really heartbreaking thing, that like, he wanted, they wanted to move in a different direction. And I felt like ‘I don’t wanna lose sleep over this.’ It really felt like I can’t see it in a different way than I’m seeing it. So I think they made the-it was right for both of us. Put it that way. To not continue creatively being-
Ross: That gave you time. First of all, cutting out things that are negative as a songwriter is essential.
[chatter about a bad artist relationship Ross had]
Savan: Yeah…and like, Harry and I always stay in touch. Me and Zayn, at the time, were always in touch. And that…it was always, sort of like, this loving relationship. And obviously I brought Harry into our camp, and like, Johan, and you guys starting working-you guys write great music together. And I’m so proud of him. And I haven’t heard Zayn’s solo stuff, but I’ve heard it’s really good.
Ross: Do you like…have you though about working with…[Zayn], or is it sort of like, that train has sailed [laughs]?
Savan: Put it this way. For any of those boys, if they ever reached out to me and wanted help, I would, in a heartbeat, do it. Just because of loyalty. If Zayn ever said ‘look, i need your help,’ or ‘can you come listen to stuff.’ He doesn’t need me, from what I understand, it’s really good. I don’t think they want to go to me, I don’t think. I mean, maybe Harry’s different, because we’re kind of closer, and we’ll see what he does if, you know, if all that stuff. But like, um, probably until the Weeknd, I understand why Zayn wouldn’t want to. They only know me as the guy who did their early stuff, which, you know, is not the stuff that they’re proud of. Even though they know I did other stuff. I mean, Harry understands that, because he understands the music business.
Ross: But the Weeknd gives you a credibility…it opens such a big door. Like you said, Ariana opened the door for the Weeknd.
Savan: Yeah, and then, the whole, letting the One Direction thing go. It was a year of trying to find myself again. It was a super intense few years. And I lost a lot of confidence during that time. And it was Max [Martin] who helped me get out of the funk.
There’s a lot going on here. I don’t know if the person he repeatedly references in the group is Zayn or Louis or Liam. He names Harry and Zayn by name later in the interview, and talks fondly of them and working together again. So I think the person he has conflict with was likely Louis or Liam. Neither of them wrote much with Savan on songs that made the first three albums. I tend to think it was probably Louis he had creative differences with, because Liam’s stuff is more R n B sounding, which is more Savan’s chosen style. Louis’ stuff is all acoustic/rock/EDM. It’s never that rythmic pop sound. So I can definitely see them having creative differences around Midnight Memories time.
I think they talk the most about Harry and Zayn in this interview, because at the time it was recorded, Zayn’s album wasn’t out and Ross co-wrote “If I Could Fly” with Harry, so they had a shared, positive writing relationship.
Savan takes a lot of subtle swipes at the band and Louis, especially. There’s definitely a lot of bitterness wrapped up in being pushed out (by Louis) and replaced (by Julien), and that definitely lends itself to the “Praise Harry!” and “Fuck this unnamed member who is totally Louis” tone of this interview.
jacobvanloon
