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@roundandroundthemulberry
Can someone help me out?
Iām look for a link to the below reference. Was it mentioned in a panel discussion or something else? Please help!
Iām including a š¦ for good will
@sweetonsugden
It's from here:
š¬ 0Ā Ā š 20Ā Ā ā¤ļø 45Ā Ā·Ā The Stars of 'Supernatural' Break Down the Moments That Changed the ShowĀ Ā·Ā Stars Jensen Ackles, Jared Padalecki and Misha
And they wonder why we're not normal about this ship. How can anyone be normal after THIS ???????????
great times to bring this back
have you kissed jensen?
3.10 Dream A Little Dream Of Me || 15.18 Despair
https://x.com/just_me_andi/status/2063605100870820335?s=46&t=8IS411Gjbv-hTUOi1uUN2A
Do you think this is a valid criticism of Jensen as far as setting a tone towards treatment towards destiel shippers or are they going too far with putting so much of it on him?
Iām not going to pretend he hasnāt said things over the years that arenāt the best or phrased things in a way that were less than ideal.
However, with that being saidā¦ blaming everything on him and making it sound as if he single handedly created the friction in the fandom is being completely overdramatic and misguided. And calling him a homophobic POS is fucking ridiculous.
As Iāve said many, many times - people have every right to be hurt, and every right to express themselves, but being a complete asshole about it is not the way to go.
Iāve included more of her rant than you initially linked (which was the second tweet down) so people can see the unhingeness of it all.
Wow that thread is just so bad. The lack of common sense and fandom and media awareness combined with what seems to be a willful, deliberate determination to make Jensen the villain.
I agree with you. Making room for people to feel hurt or sad doesn't mean having to tolerate these extreme bad faith takes against Jensen. It doesn't mean condoning these kinds of bad takes.
Couple of things I want to elaborate on--firstly, even in media with loudly openly queer romances and characters, the homophobes show up and start trolling. Secondly, Misha's very open and loud support for queer Cas in love with Dean did absolutely nothing to shut down the denialism about queer Cas or slow down the hatred targeting the ship and shippers. Thirdly, Jensen is allowed his opinions on a character he plays, Jensen said nothing at purcon hurtful or attacking anyone for having their view, he didn't say anything vitriolic, while he was being badgered in person. Fourthly, blaming him for hateful people existing is about the same as Misha antis who claim his support of queer Cas is responsible for ruining the fandom etc.
There is no stopping the hate trolls.
Every fandom. EVERY FANDOM.
Some people on the destiel side claimed for years that if only we had this or that thing, the hate would stop. Guess what, we got some of those things.
What happened? The hate just kept on going.
Some people even started rooting for canon destiel just to shut the antis up.
Not because they wanted to see it. Not because they felt it made sense for the characters or story. Not for representation. No, they just wanted to just the antis up.
That thread is fully off the rails and it is malicious and it insinuates anyone who doesn't have an issue with Jensen is part of the problem too, it throws insinuations on destiel shippers who are vocal and supportive of queer Cas and destiel lenses while we put our foot down about the hatred flung at Jensen.
I also fail to see how anything he said at purcon was "homophobic rhetoric." That is not a reasonable assessment of what happened whatsoever.
But hey if that account is going to blame Jensen for making antidestiels behave like dicks on the internet
I'm allowed to repeat something I said recently, how some people in the destiel lane are a harm to it and to its goals and they help make the destiel lane less welcoming, not more welcoming, and are harming good faith relations with Jensen and Misha, and adding to the hurt destiel shippers have to bear.
Unfortunately things have become so bad that inside the destiel lane the only popularized acceptable viewpoint is to slam Jensen. It's not deserved. And they don't care how much support anyone has given. Anyone who sticks up for Jensen is treated as a sell out or a traitor or a fake destiel shipper etc etc.
https://x.com/i/status/2063624673217462612
They are talking about Jensen's power on the show, but Misha said that if Jensen had been against the confession scene, it wouldn't have happened. I mean, Dean doesn't even say anything in this scene, but Jensen's approval was still important...
Thatās not about āpowerā. Thatās about a writer and a fellow actor respecting Jensenās feelings about a big shift in another characterās relationship with his character. It was about professional courtesy and respecting his feelings. His approval was important but it wasnāt about power.
If Jensen had that much power, he wouldnāt have had to fight to have Dean die standing up. If he had that much power, Dean wouldnāt have died and Jensen wouldnāt have been told take or leave it.
What fascinates me about the whole "people are upset by Jensen's opinion" argument is that it often seems to work only in one direction. Fans are apparently entitled to be upset with Jensen for not sharing their interpretation, but Jensen isn't allowed to feel frustrated when some fans repeatedly dismiss his perspective and keep trying to push their ship or headcanons onto him.
That's a pretty clear double standard. It feels like some fans stop treating him as a person and start treating him as a tool whose purpose is to validate a particular fandom narrative and feelings which he is not obliged to do at all. (and that's not only with some destiel btw, J1/J2 stans are also treating Jensen like that)
What makes this even stranger is that there are already cast members like Misha, who openly engage with destiel from a shipping perspective. Fans who want that kind of discussion already have someone willing to provide it. Yet some still seem determined to get Jensen to give a different answer than the one he's consistently given for years and every time they act so surprised that he is not suddenly a destiel shipper that they deem it a personal insult and happily jump on a hate bandwagon.
And the wildest part is that Jensen didn't condemn the ship. He doesn't hate it or tell fans to stop creating content or shipping it. Quite the opposite. His position has basically been: "You're free to interpret the characters however you want, create whatever you want and enjoy fandom however you want." And some still behave like he personally killed their puppyš
Nobody is trying to take your ship away from you. Write and create whatever you want. Most importantly have fun while doing it. Don't make it into statement on queer people's rights in society (which is ridiculous, let's be real, those issues are much more complicated than an opinion about popular ship in a fandom). And for the love of God don't be nasty to an actor. The things I've seen some "fans" write about Jensen on X are genuinely awful bordering on defamation. And the sad part is that they collect so much likes which can harm his reputationā¦
In all fandom spaces, many fans tend to see the actors as extensions of themselves, their beliefs, their fantasies, or their perceptions. Unfortunately they also treat them as playthings expecting them to move and talk exactly how they want them to.
Another unfortunate circumstance is that the loudest most obnoxious of people in the fandom are the ones that seem to get their words taken seriously and as fact. Perhaps thatās why they shout so loudly. š¤·āāļø
Iām not going to repeat what I keep saying, as Iām tired of doing so.
I find the interpretation of "The one thing I want I know I can't have" as Cas knowing that Dean loves him, but he can't have it, because he's going to die now, very boring. Where's famous destiel misunderstanding, where's the drama. Do you really think that Cas, who at the start of s15 expressed his doubts about the Winchesters even just caring about him, somehow knew Dean was in love with him? Do you really think Cas, who thought he got the right to be the part of the family only when he became co-parents with Dean and Sam, abd lost his family completely when he lost Jack, knew that he was loved? I find it hard to believe.
I also think this take comes from fans coping really hard with Dean never telling Cas he loved him. Because if Cas knew he was loved just by some miracle, then Dean didn't fail to express his love, then Dean doesn't even have to try to prove his love to Cas.
Jensen Ackles (photo credit: deadline)
Another from the photograhper, Anthony Avellano:
The Boys. @theboystv @deadline studio at Prime Experience @primevideo
Anthony is doing individual posts of each actor so we might get even more from him today.
Good God in Heaven.
How do photographers not BEG Jensen to photograph him?
Lordt.
https://vm.tiktok.com/ZNR7KGjjW/
Jared is the biggest piece of shit
Yep, we know.
Someone sent me a clip the other day of it being retold at a Jtwo panel and Jensen being annoyed by how forceful that first pie was.
Listing all the things they were planning (trashing his apartment) makes me sad. Like I can see Jensen strewing clothes around and moving furniture, etc. but I can the other one actually breaking things and being more destructive.
TikTok - Make Your Day
Lol calling Jared the ābiggest piece of shitā because he yeeted a pie a little too enthusiastically in a prank war that these two have been running for 15+ years your parasocial brainrot. Newsflash: Jensen isnāt some delicate flower clutching his pearls. Heās the same guy who helped pie Misha, swapped ghost pepper jerky, sabotaged sets, and gave as good as he got. They shred each otherās scripts, destroy hotel rooms in stories they both laugh about on stage, and still show up as ride-or-dies. What are you exactly mad about???
Oh, lookā¦. A Jared stan showed up in their proverbial defense of his sophomoric and childish (as well as dangerous because he pied Misha so hard it almost broke his nose even Jensen chastised him at a panel about it) behavior.
As alwaysā¦ excuses, excuses, excuses. Color me surprised.
This is from Mark Sheppard, on the SPN Then and Now:
"Directing television is very different than directing film. And with all credit to my wonderful friend, Mr. Speight, there. I've got a better answer for you. Here's the best answer for you. I watched Misha direct an episode. They shredded his script three times. He got pied in the face twice. Once so hard, I think they broke his nose.
Um, Jared was contemplating taking his [Misha] car and doing something with it, putting it on top, I think, using an industrial forklift and putting it on top of the stage, like on top of the building. Um, he was continuously tortured while doing this. And I think the nicest and politest answer I could give you to this is they didn't play pranks on me because I'd sue them. I'm a grown-up."
From: Patreon, Spn Then and Now, Bonus Clip
That was as bad as it sounded. And Mark was going off the top of his head, not what had actually happened; we are not privy to that whole laundry list of things that have been done.
Season 7 Meta: The Great Season 7 Rewatch
from Episode 1 Meet the New Boss, to Episode 18 Party on Garth
by flutiebear
(grouped into one huge post, under the cut)
Thinking about the light spreading over Deanās face and overcoming the darkness when he finds out Cas is alive
It's details like this that make me appreciate the WORK that went into the everyday production of Supernatural.
This was a thoughtful choice. Everything had to be set up and staged to get this shot. This is a set - not a car on a real highway where this happened by chance. Jensen had a mark. The lights were rigged. The angle and temperature of the lights were chosen to set a specific mood for the scene overall.
Everyone who worked to create this scene was a seasoned professional who knew how to tell a story within seconds with minute detail. It's subtle. While we might not literally be thinking "oh there's light on Dean's face, so that means that he's allowing himself to hope because Cas, his favorite person, is alive". Like, no. We already know Cas is alive and fine because we've been watching him annoy The Shadow for a few weeks. But Dean doesn't know that.
Anyway. All of this was intentional. It continues to be wild to me that given the constraints of production schedules, CW fuckery, how many people were involved in the business of making this show in general, that there are so many moements of just really lovely and subtle filmaking like this. They didn't have to go so hard, but they did.
Which is why, as always, I have so many questions when any of the actors are like "it was platonic" because, yeah, OK buddy, tell it to the production team? Because storytelling goes beyond acting.
So because I'm sitting here doing PT and my mind is wandering, I was thinking about the "Dean doesn't like dogs" discourse and I just...
Once Dean expresses annoyance about dogs, and it isn't really even about dogs as much as it is about dog fur and dog smell.
Hell, I have a dog, and dog fur and dog smell are definitely annoyances.
But I digress.
So those supposed real Dean fans (read: actually Sam fans) ignore all of the other developments we see regarding Dean and dogs and cling to one thing he said once upon getting his car back (and coming back from freaking Purgatory)...why?
So they can give Sam something else (in this case, Miracle the dog).
You know what Sam got that Dean didn't? Shielded by his father for as long as he could from monsters and how his mother died. He got teachers who saw something in him even as he was bouncing from school to school. He got such a good education that he got a free ride to Stanford. He got friends in college and a girlfriend and he got to have normal social interactions like parties and dorm living. He even got a girlfriend or two during the run of the show, one whom he cared about so much that he brought her back from the dead. Then he got married, had a kid, and lived a good, long life.
Dean was six when he shot his first gun. Two years after he watched his mother die in a fire. He was 11 when he built his own gun. He got left in jail for stealing food...for Sam...and then he got taken away from the safest place he had known since he was four years old. He got his ass whooped when Sam ran away as if it was his fault. He was so mentally (and probably physically) abused that he looked at Sam going to college as abandonment, and he cowered around his father, even when he became a man who could take him in a fight if necessary. He got meaningless one-night stands, and then the one relationship he had on screen that really worked, they pretended wasn't really happening. Then they killed the person closest to him and left him to die on a rusty nail.
Let him have the damn dog, FFS.
šš¼šš¼šš¼
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Please and fucking thank you.
Listened to the new SPN Then and Now to hear Misha speak, here's a few quotes I pulled out of it.
About Sera Gamble firing him in S7 and the network president telling SPN to bring him back:
āSeason 7 is not my favorite because they killed me and I was told I wasnāt coming back at the beginning of the season. That colors my affinity for that particular era in the series. ā āThey tried to kill me and then the network president had said āyou gotta bring that guy backāā
About the Cas spinoff:
āI had an idea for a spinoff when I was toying with the idea of a spinoff back in the day and didnāt end up pursuing it. It would have been something like that. Cas is a totally powerless angel who is simply able to tap into the knowledge and veteran experience and then shepherd along a little cabal of young hunters but not walking around with the ability to teleportā¦when we were wrapping season 15 I think we were all just ready to be done and I was having conversations with Mark Pedowitz at that point. Or I should say not conversations but Mark Pedowitz was tapping me on the shoulder saying [imitates Mark Pedowitz] āso what to you think about a spinoff, you want to talk about a spinoff?ā And I did not. I wanted to do something else. It would have been 12 years at that point. For the same reason that we ended the show, I didnāt want to do a spinoff.ā
Thank you for this.
I like it when he reiterates the stories about Sera wanting to off him and Pedowitz making sure that didn't happen.
I like it when he reiterates the stories about Sera wanting to off him and Pedowitz making sure that didn't happen.
Definitely.
Also love that Mark was basically hoping to keep Misha/Cas around for even longer.
I'm trying to disassociate from future cons panels lol, but I'm would like to hear Misha's opinion about Cas pursuing another MALE love interest other than Dean, since he's unavailable. People talk that Cas queerness shouldn't be chained to Dean but I don't see that discussion on Misha's panels, fans just talk about destiel, destiel and I understand why but would be nice to have a real homosexual relationship on the show. TBH I don't think that tptb would have had the courage but I want to know Misha's opinion on the matter.
Hereās my opinion on that and Iām probably in the minority of one.
Cas fell in love with Dean Winchester. He came across many men, other angels, etc.
Casās declaration of love was āhomosexualā because Dean is a man. That doesnāt mean that Cas was going to be attracted to other men just because.
Thatās how I see the situation.
I see the situation as sweet does
Hannah was in a female body and was naked infront of Castiel. He looked away.
Hannah then had a male body [a very attractive one i may add] but still Castiel did not look further
Not even being called pretty by other angels made him flustered or anything
Yet hes in a cowboy hat for Dean, doctors get up which we all know Dean has a thing for coughsDrSexycoughs
To me if you asked Castiel what love is to him he'd probably list of a lot of things Dean has done and taught him and stuff
Hes seen Deans soul and face. He knows it intimately [he did put Dean back together and left a pretty big ass hand print to prove it]
Unless Dean were to say please find someone else to love and be happy with because he doesnt feel the same and cant bear to see Vas unhappy, I doubt Castiel would ever pursue another interest
Hell even if he tried he'd be comparing them all to Dean
So either way he keeps his best friend and his best friend knows hes very much loved without anything expected in return
WHICH IS THE POINT OF THE CONFESSION
Ahem apologises
My inner destiel raised its head
And if I said Jensen's understanding of fandom, ships, and fanfic pretty much starts and ends with the episode FanFiction? I don't even mean that in a snarky way. I genuinely think he, and even Misha to some extent, really don't get a lot of fan culture from our perspective, especially when it comes to subtext + media analysis, and instead take things very literally. (I'm reminded of a time Misha was asked abt his favorite Destiel moment and he genuinely thought the confession was the only real Destiel moment and had to have it explained to him that fans see any moments between Dean and Cas as Destiel moments).
But anyway. I recently came across gifs from FanFiction again and this exchange is really the crux of it all IMO:
DEANĀ : There's no space in Supernatural. MARIEĀ : Well, not canonically, no. But this is transformative fiction.
This is where I think the divide is for them as actors. To them there's canon (in the most literal rigid sense) and then there's fan stuff. That's how it was presented to them in the episode.
I saw another post that was like "oh jensen thinks supernatural was a real life documentary and fan stuff is the fiction." And, well, kind of?
Like the thing is, I actually understand exactly what was being saidāor trying to be saidāat the con. And I understand Jensenās POV on the matter, even if I completely disagree. Like I GET it. Itās the plot of FanFiction to him. Like Dean, he has his reality (what he filmed, his own intent) and the fans have their interpretation. And yes to him those are separate things. (Which btw is why he was bringing up that other ship. Not to equate the two or say Destiel is like inc*st, but to say, to him, these are both "fan things" that exist outside of his understanding of canon).
But like Dean in the ep he very much has been like, fans can find their own meaning. And heās said versions of this before where itās not HIS job to tell anyone what the art means. He doesnāt seem to really get the whole concept of meta / subtext / analysis. And how anything within the text regardless of intention is fair game for interpretation and if we can make a solid argument for itās textual and valid. But thatās okay. A lot of fans donāt understand that either. But he still has seemed chill with fans doing their own thing in the past. Heās been perfectly nice to Destiel fans before and signed countless fanarts and complimented them. He doesnāt seem have a problem with the existence of the ship itself. Heās just very literal abt things from his end.
And where things went wrong here is that he was 1.) specifically asked for his personal opinion on how he played it. And 2.) the fan continued to push, interrogation style, even with Misha, which led to a lot of discomfort, awkwardness, and annoyance. Honestly, it was very reminiscent of times JayTwos and W* have tried cornering him with leading questions abt bro stuff. It was uncomfortable and not the way I would have approached it at all. Which is why Iām not really mad abt it. Or finding anything fun abt the whole circus it created.
