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cringefailvox

this is a really really good look on him unfortunately

the-irreverend

Poetic justice at its finest.

hazbinwithquantum

HOLY FUCK I THINK I FIGURED SOMETHING OUT

So, the scene where Alastor gets free of his Deals with Rosie and Vox has been bothering me since I first watched "Curtain Call" at 4 am this morning.

For one, why did Charlie saying Vox is the most powerful break his Deal with Rosie?

What does her words change in this situation? Like, if Vox is more powerful, then he's more powerful, regardless of what Charlie says, right? It's not like there seems to be any magic involved other than Alastor using the Favor she gave him. Vox himself has been saying he's more powerful than Alastor for a while, so it's not like they just needed someone's verbal confirmation. And there's a significant delay between Charlie's words and the leash around Alastor's neck vanishing.

I was trying to figure this out all day. Maybe he needed the ego boost to transform into demon mode, and that was what tipped him over the edge to being the strongest sinner? But even then, there's this still a delay between Vox transforming and the collar vanishing.

Additionally, if Alastor's Deal with Rosie was broken, then how did he still have his power? My understanding of Deal Magic is that if the Deal is broken, it's broken. Neither side seems to keep what they got. Why would Alastor get to keep his power for free?

But what if Charlie didn't break Alastor's Deal with Rosie? What if she completed it?

Let's go through the scene again.

Charlie says: "Vox is the strongest sinner in Hell"

Then, we cut to three separate reaction shots where the people of Hell cheer.

The delay for those three reaction shots can be explained by them occurring simultaneously, and if the next shot was Alastor's leash vanishing, then I wouldn't have thought this much about it.

But the next shot is actually Vox and Charlie. Vox laughs maniacally, then transforms, screaming "Oh, yeah!"

Then Vox delivers another line of dialogue: "Look, Princess! Hell's finally listening to you!"

Only THEN do we cut to Alastor, with the collar breaking.

And not just Alastor, but Rosie, too.

Why include Rosie here? Specifically like this? The collar around Alastor's throat broke, but we don't actually see anything on Rosie's end that looks broken. And the sound effect at this bit isn't the sound of something shattering or breaking. Listen.

There's a sort of magical "ting!" as the collar breaks, and a dramatic "thrum!" when Rosie's eyes flash.

The time delay between Charlie's line and Alastor's collar breaking is 18 seconds.

The delay between Vox saying that Hell is listening to Charlie and the collar breaking is less than a second.

What if the task Alastor was supposed to complete for Rosie was making Hell listen to Charlie? At least three separate times in this episode, we are reminded about Alastor's cunning specifically when it comes to words and Deals.

Right after this when Alastor escapes Vox's captivity is the first reminder.

Vox: "Fucking wordplay?! You tricked me with a fucking technicality?! Seriously?!" Alastor: "Mmm... it worked, didn't it? Baby, I'm a demon in Hell! It's kind of our thing!"

Then, Rosie reminds us twice in her and Alastor's part of "Hear My Hope." "Why don't you help them, you double-dealing manipulator?" and "I will not reward a snake like you."

On that note, Rosie seems angry with him here. Like she didn't get what she wanted.Like, perhaps, she wanted him to help Charlie, but he used her phrasing to his advantage to free himself without actually having to help that much.

Even when he came to the Emporium to tell him he had quite the hotel and basically threatened her, she didn't get angry.

And apparently, Rosie cares about "them" (unclear whether that's just Charlie and those closest to her, the entire hotel, or more. Alastor's shadows showed Emily, Charlie, Vaggie, Husk, Angel Dust, and Niffty dying when he said that).

Remember Alastor's lines in "Finale." "The constraints of my Deal surely have a back door." I think this was the back door. A way to technically fulfill his end of the bargain and free himself now.

The more I think about it, the more I think this is the case. Charlie completed Alastor's Deal, she didn't break it. Which is how he still had so much power to fight Vox right after.

emotionalsupportfantasyworld

I love this theory and have some possible additional evidence

In both episode 7 and 8 of season 1, Alastor loans Charlie his microphone to rally a crowd, was this also him trying to complete the deal? Did it just not work because it wasn't on a large enought scale?

My only argument against this is, his deal with Rosie was to be the strongest in hell, having that not be true means she failed her end of the bargain and thus he was able to keep the power, she broke the deal so she's the one who has to sacrifice, both in letting him keep his power and not getting what she wanted

But I did go back and re-watch the scene and your right about the sound of the chains, Rosie's was a more delicate clink, while when Vox breaks their deal, the chains make a much louder breaking sound (this could have been from Alastor's anger, but still)

We need more details on their deal and know for sure what she wanted him to do, that couldn't have been completed in the 70+ years prior

hazbinwithquantum

YES FINALLY SOMETHING THAT MAKES HIM LENDING THE MICROPHONE MAKE SENSE

I've been trying to figure THAT out for over a year!

I wonder if she just held the favor over his head for ages, cuz even when he was alive, she just said she'd have a task for him, she didn't specify what it would be. If that was the case, I completely understand Alastor's rage. He made a Deal for power, and spent possibly decades not even knowing what he'd have to do or when to finally regain his freedom.

I don't think the sound from the collar evaporating sounds metallic at all (or if it does, more like ringing a bell than breaking chains), it sounds like a pure magic sound effect, but that's very much up to interpretation.

I also feel like this makes more sense given that we have no idea what the fuck Rosie is. We know she's not a sinner (since she could make Alastor the most powerful sinner), and apparently she wants something to do with Charlie. At first I thought it was a sinister desire, but after seeing her seem saddened at the thought of everyone dying, it might not be malicious. Other than that, we just have no idea who or what she is or wants.

However, it seems like Rosie appreciates people being straightforward, honest in their intentions. She tells Alastor in "Don't You Forget" that she's "an honest woman, always there to lend an ear", and she seems angry with him for being a double-crosser specifically.

She calls him out for being a "double-dealing manipulator", a "snake", and a "demon". (So is she not a demon at all? WHO/WHAT IS THIS WOMAN??? GAHHHHH).