Yuck.
I am not a tehm, but honey I want dick. A big ass dick. Some other gay dude might be attracted to you, move along.
No gay man is into females, not a single one.
that last one is really something. notice how she rules out every individual opportunity to say no as unacceptable until there's nothing left. you can't give a preemptive blanket no. you can't say no upon disclosure. you can't even say no if it gets all the way to the bedroom because supposedly "it shouldn't matter" by then that you've been led to expect you'll be sleeping with someone of the same sex only to have the rug pulled out at the last minute. the takeaway of course being that it's never acceptable as a gay person to say no to someone of the opposite sex. ever.
Not only this, but also he’s talking about it like it’s a very okay thing to do. Spreading the idea that this is a “normal” way to think and to behave.
This isn’t okay ever, and it’s even dangerous for both parties. You DO have an obligation to tell someone you’re trans before you get to the bedroom, and you DO have to accept sexual orientation isn’t transphobic. Body parts DO matter.
I agree that you have to tell people, I agree that it's not transphobic if they just aren't into trans people, etc... but are we all just gonna ignore the dude who said "no gay man is into females", seemingly arguing against the dude who said another gay man will be potentially be into a transguy? There are plenty of gay and straight people who like trans people of their preferred gender, and saying that they're not allowed to like who they like is absolutely ridiculous. I don't understand this fascination with dictating to gay and straight people who they are and aren't allowed to like, whichever way around it is. Just find somebody who likes you and be happy, live and let live, etc... stop with these ridiculous arguments.
"I don't understand this fascination with dictating to gay and straight people who they are and aren't allowed to like"
Lmao it's not a fascination, the transes are literally trying to change the meaning of homosexuality to include the opposite sex. No homosexual male is into females even if the alter their body to imitate another male. There is no amounts of surgeries or horsepiss-hormones that make a lesbian like a trans"woman". Because they're fucking male.
Those are not ridiculous arguments, it's literally biology. Homosexuality is inborn (transgenderism is not), we cannot change who we're attracted to, so it's our damn right to defend our attraction.
These "plenty of gay and straight people who like people of their preferred gender (delusions)" are not homosexual. Some lesbians might be into trans"men" and some gay men into trans"women" (provided they don't care about being with a mentally deluded person who chose to butcher their private parts). But no homosexual male OR female is going to be with the opposite sex.
Homosexual males are not into fake-arm-tissue-dick and homosexual females will never touch an attempt of an inverted penis.
Those are not ridiculous arguments, it’s literally biology. Homosexuality is inborn (transgenderism is not), we cannot change who we’re attracted to, so it’s our damn right to defend our attraction.
You understand that we have as much evidences supporting the fact that transsexualism is biological, as we have supporting homosexuality is biological, right? Saying this is kind of things is shooting yourself in the foot. I already know a lot of homophobes saying that since we didn’t remove the possibility that homosexuality could be due to social constructs (and never will), it could very well be “fluid” or simply constructed with the years. The same thing you claim for transsexualism, basically. So which is it? You can’t have both. Either both are biological, or either both are socially constructed. Cherry picking one that would be biological while the other isn’t just because it suits your ideology is dumb as fuck.
Study regarding sexuality and particularly trans women with males show that heterosexual males can be attracted to trans women pre-SRS and still be heterosexuals. So by definition, it doesn’t change their sexuality, it’s more complex than that, and only a minority of heterosexual males are actually interested in trans women pre-SRS. Gay men are also very rarely interested in trans women pre/post-SRS, from the same study. But you’re right, people can’t change their attraction, and we should defend our right to say no to anyone. I wish we could have more studies regarding this because it is interesting, but for now, that’s all we have and it doesn’t go your way. Don’t forget that paraphilias regarding cross-dressing, mismatching sex/body exist too and might be playing a bigger part than we know today.
Next time, please be more polite regarding the bodies of trans people, even if you don’t like us.
lmao I'm not gonna be more polite to troons who want to erase homosexuality. There are no exceptions. Homosexuals like the same SEX not gender "identity". And like you suprisingly correctly said how do we know that those participants of the studies that "supposedly" proved heterosexual men are into trans"women" are actually heterosexual and not homosexual or bisexual male feteshists who like the idea of femenized men (more often than not as a power play because they see feminity as an inferiour trait)? Or whatever else paraphilias they have.
And whatever are you talking about? What cherry picking? Homosexuality is definitively proven by science to be inborn and not "curable" by therapy. Transgenderism on the other hand is not well researched enough to definitively say it's inborn and that it's not induced by societies misogynistic influences.
It's really sad we live in a world where it's easier to escape by "changing your sex" instead of accepting your female body.
@ilililian damn right no one takes you seriously if the "rights" you demand are access to homosexual and female spaces and the right to have your little cosmetic surgeries covered by insurance. Try searching for a better therapist. All they want to do is make money that's why they prescribe you gullibles HRT so fast. For you it's not to late I see. You can still stop taking testosterone. 3 months normally don't inclict much harm on your female body.
Wow, you're highkey an asshole.
"troons who want to erase homosexuality" again, nobody's erasing homosexuality, even the people who want everyone to be attracted to trans people, but in this conversation the people who disagree with you are just saying "hey, some gay people like trans people"
there are exceptions, deal with it
People are attracted to sex characteristics, personality, other features of appearance, and so on, not chromosomes - so yes, you can be exclusively attracted to one set of sex characteristics, but that does not necessarily exclude trans people. It can. It often does. But it doesn't necessarily and those people's lives should not impact you or matter to you. Your fascination with dictating to other gays who they're allowed to like is honestly ridiculous - just like the fascination with insisting gay people like trans people is ridiculous. Like I said at the beginning, live and let live.
The cherrypicking is that gender dysphoria is neurological, it's inborn, it's not curable (transition is however the best treatment, it's definitely not treatable via "therapy"), and it's been proven such - to the same extent that homosexuality has been.
Society isn't misogynistic, it shits on men just as much as it shits on women, in some cases more.
It's not easier to "escape", it's easier to cure a condition that you have. Were a woman who was not suffering from gender dysphoria to transition to male, she would get gender dysphoria, because her sex characteristics would now not align with her neurology. It would, were you without that medical condition, be easier to live in western society than to transition.
You were a patronising fuck to that other person, you're not their doctor, you don't know shit about them, and it's not a "cosmetic surgery", it's a medical treatment for a neurological condition.
I glady am a "highkey asshole" if it means saying the truth. these "exceptions" sound pretty bisexual to me. Again homosexuals like the same sex -> you can't change your sex -> homosexuals males/ females can only be attracted to natal males/ females.
Ah yes. "Gender dysphoria" aka body dysmorphia. A mistake a lot of troons make. It's not comparable with conversion therapy at all, you homophobe.
How come "gender dysphoria" is just a first-world problem then? Maybe because people in the third world have real problems and don't make themselves new ones out of boredom and loneliness?
This "cure" is not a cure if involves mutilating your body and being dependent on meds your whole life. And please society isn't misogynistic? Take a look around you, sexualization, objectification, rape threats from males pretending to be women, getting fired from work just because you acknowledge biological sex? Don't come at me with the only non-western women are oppressed. Women as a class are oppressed and don't have more rights than men. Lmao who are you kidding?
I was not patronizing her, I was giving a honest advice. You really think these "gender specialists" care about you? They just see this whole trans trend as a way to make quick money. But hey I won't stop you @ilililian. Go ahead and mutilate your body if it feels right. You're still gonna be a female though, because you were born that way with all the parts: breasts, clitoris, uterus, you can menstruate (what trans"women" claim to be able to do never can).
Better accept than soon. A lot of detransitioners are female who just wanted to escape misogyny and their sexualized bodies. You can't escape. You are female, that's a biological reality.
"these “exceptions” sound pretty bisexual to me."
Well you're wrong. Bisexuality is not a catch-all "other" section for sexuality, and it doesn't mean "people I don't wanna call gay". If you were at a bar and a woman told you she was bisexual, it would be rather sucky to find out that she actually meant "I am never and will never be attracted to women, I just like transmen and men." because these words communicate certain things, and that is not what the word "bisexual" communicates. She only likes men and she does not like women, she's straight. You're advocating to erase what bisexuality is and for people to use words in a misleading manner.
"Again homosexuals like the same sex -> you can’t change your sex -> homosexuals males/ females can only be attracted to natal males/ females."
Nobody can see chromosomes. People are attracted to, as I've said, sex characteristics, personality, other physical characteristics, etc - some gay people are indeed attracted to trans people of their preferred gender, and to erase that is stupid.
"Ah yes. “Gender dysphoria” aka body dysmorphia."
Gender dysphoria and body dysmorphia are two different things, both medically defined, and once again you are misusing medical terminology.
"It’s not comparable with conversion therapy at all, you homophobe."
Things can be comparable without being identical - both are attempts at "curing" something that cannot be cured in that manner, neither work, and that is the only basis on which I compared them. I'm not a homophobe, neither for that nor any other reason.
"How come “gender dysphoria” is just a first-world problem then?"
It's not. People in other countries suffer from it.
"Maybe because people in the third world have real problems and don’t make themselves new ones out of boredom and loneliness?"
You believe, as you said, that gender dysphoria is body dysmorphia, so even excluding the vast inaccuracy of claiming that a neurological condition is chosen, you're also claiming that a mental health condition is chosen to "make problems" for oneself out of "boredom and loneliness", which is both incorrect and ableist. Congratulations.
"This “cure” is not a cure if involves mutilating your body and being dependent on meds your whole life."
I called it a treatment, not a cure. A treatment can require you to make changes to your body (removing tonsils or appendix) or be dependent on medication for your whole life (many physical and mental health conditions require this) - neither of those things disqualifies it from being a treatment, especially given all of the evidence that it helps.
"And please society isn’t misogynistic? Take a look around you, sexualization, objectification, rape threats from males pretending to be women, getting fired from work just because you acknowledge biological sex?"
Sexualization and objectification and rape threats all happen to men too, in fact men are more at risk for violence, and men are raped more often according to many stats, once you include prison and "forced to penetrate" amongst the definition. While we're on the subject of prison, men are more likely to be sent to prison and more likely to receive a sentence, even when you account for the same crime. While we're on the subject of rape, my own country doesn't recognise the rape of a man by a woman as rape legally... including if the male is a child. Everyone gets shit.
"Don’t come at me with the only non-western women are oppressed. Women as a class are oppressed and don’t have more rights than men."
Women have more rights in many countries than men, legally speaking, see my last point about my own country's (and many other country's) definitions of rape legally.
"I was not patronizing her, I was giving a honest advice."
Your advice was awful, irresponsible, and at odds with that of the involved medical professionals.
"You really think these “gender specialists” care about you? They just see this whole trans trend as a way to make quick money."
Hunny, you don't know a thing about me or what I think. I'm well aware that nobody cares about me, but they're not in it to make money, and I'm only here to express the facts, not to pick sides based on who apparently cares about me. Even if I was, you definitely do not.
"A lot of detransitioners are female who just wanted to escape misogyny and their sexualized bodies."
And would you look at that, as I said if a woman transitioned to "escape" then they would get dysphoria, and subsequently detransition... if it were truly easier, as you claimed, to transition to "escape" then why would they have detransitioned? Why wouldn't they be happy in their lives now free from all this "oppression"? Oh right, it's because it's not easier to take a medical treatment for a condition that you don't have than to live your life.
Also, I'm not going to quote your previous part that was obviously intended to trigger someone's dysphoria, that was pathetic of you.
"You can’t escape. You are female, that’s a biological reality."
Ehh... Mostly. Transition definitely changes some sex characteristics (like hormone levels), but it can't change chromosomes... but to invalidate somebody over something so irrelevant to you personally, something that's between them, their partner, and medical professionals, is downright ridiculous. You think you're being spooky with this "you can't escape" stuff or something? It just sounds childish.
oh my god argue in the dms do y’all really think we mf CARE 🔫
