welcome to the shitshow

19 || she/her || queer || general craziness Yellowjackets and Chappell Roan fan Flight risk with a fear of falling

[charlottescarlet]

You know what?

This subfandom defending Finn Wolfhard when many people are criticizing his lack of professionalism and his disrespect toward marginalized people feels exactly like when they rushed to defend the Duffer brothers after Will stans pointed out their cheap, poor writing.

Some people called out red flags such as racism and classism being mishandled, as well as signs of misogyny and homophobia in the writing that have existed since S3, and they criticized Mike’s character for the same reasons.

And guess who turned out to be right about the duffers and their writing?

I don’t really care about the actors, and harassing them is stupid. But FW was the host, and hosts do get to review and approve skits. He even taught Nell Fisher how to say no, based on his own experience.

It may be “normal” for SNL, but that doesn’t mean it’s okay. Normalized mainstream comedy has a long history of problems, especially in the U.S.

Heath Ledger refused to present at the 2007 Oscars because of a planned Brokeback Mountain joke.

They were making homophobic and misogynistic jokes, but the gay actor and the two actresses were not there. Divine intervention, I guess?

This subfandom let those rude and bland jokes slide because of what? FW wore lipstick? Because it benefits your fantasy about Mike being fem gay? 

I shouldn’t have expected more from you guys. 

[miwiromantics]

i don't want us to be called 'too woke' or sensitive ever again ...

[capischao]

Is it too woke of me to say that 90% of the SNL episode with Finn Wolfhard felt oddly disturbing

It didn’t feel like the jokes were directed at the show itself, but digs at the fans. Something like a “here, damn”.

Conformity gate being addressed in itself isn’t an issue, but Lucas joking about Max acting like she’s in a coma during sex was… something

I know it can be interpreted as a pillow princess, lays back and thinks of England, kind of joke, but it’s still a very strange thing to say.

Adding on to that, I know they’re not meant to be in character. It’s a parody. That said, why was most of the humour just… misogyny.

Dustin saying “oh yeah I briefly dated that weird nerdy girl that helped us save the world and never talked to her again” and Lucas making that joke about Max??

Finn saying in his monologue that Stranger Things is where he learnt how girls look ‘down there’ right after showing a clip of both him and Millie as 11 year olds?? Who chose this

That other skit where it’s just Finn’s ‘girlfriend’ being annoying as hell + acting like a boy and that’s the whole joke? Men hating a woman?? That’s the joke????

The skit of Will’s coming is another example.

I don’t care how many people say it’s mocking the writing and show, the jokes they used were literally stolen from the homophobes in TikTok comment sections.

If it were mocking the writing, they wouldn’t have made a dick joke — they would’ve poked fun at the entire city being in that room but no. It was mocking the character and the acting.

Because here’s a shocker folks: most straight people didn’t care that the writing was bad, they were annoyed that the scene existed at all. It could’ve been the most perfect scene ever and they would’ve still hated on it and called it unnecessary

It’s also very hypocritical of the people enjoying this skit to laugh and enjoy a joke where a 16 year old says he likes dick but crucify fans online writing/drawing scenarios in which he gets to explore that in a serious manner

It wasn’t labelled as fetishising when Nancy and Steve had a sex scene in season 1 or Nancy and Jonathan had one implied + a pull out joke. Or when Billy, a minor, set out to fuck a grown woman + was ogled by multiple mothers. Or when Max talked about Billy having girls over and hearing them moaning

Apparently being minors is only an issue when it’s queer? Unless you can laugh at it of course, in which case it’s fine to have a minor saying “I like dick”.

All this episode told me is people are fine with queerness as long as they can mock it.

The heated rivalry skit is praised because it’s making fun of the show, while the actual show is hated by those same conservatives laughing at SNL

Maybe I’m too woke. But I’m so tired of this bullshit. It feels like we’re regressing and it’s so disheartening to realise that not even the actors give a shit and are kind of vapid

Because Finn co wrote every single skit and wrote his monologue btw. And Caleb and Gaten had to approve their lines

The only ones who seem to ACTUALLY care about the real issues/meaning/consequences of this fuckass show are the women and Noah. All of them conspicuously absent in this episode but talked about in the most disgusting ways

[inmybylerera2003]

No Laughing Matter

I lost ALOT of respect for Finn, Caleb and Gaten tonight. Is THIS how they support a fellow cast member and "friend" of ten years? And don't even try to tell me they didn't know how that "coming out" skit would reflect negatively on Noah, the show's LGBTQ+ fans and the LGBTQ+ community at large. ESPECIALLY considering Noah wasn't there tonight. Sorry but NOTHING about that skit was funny to me and i doubt Noah's gonna find it very funny either. Like wtf dude? How much more is being a fan of this show going to hurt me? 😞

[xsapphic-celestialx]

say what you will about the Yellowjackets fandom and how shippers behave but at least we’re ALLOWED to have ships, I just got back from Stranger Things tumblr and those guys are STRICT

stranger things fans: um these two characters haven’t explicitly said they love each other how dare you ship them

Yellowjackets fans: background characters 2 and 4 have been standing near each other here’s an in depth explanation of how they’re married

let season 4 jackieshauna do what Byler couldn’t (make out on screen)

(also at least the Yellowjackets writers don’t shit on queer people by saying they need to “learn a lesson” and “just accept themselves and have self-love”) whaaaaat who said that

[kortneylovestoentertain]

been in the stranger things fandom for YEARS & they are sooooo babies first fandom it’s insane

[xsapphic-celestialx]

tell me why the first note on my post was a mileven bitching about Byler 😭😭😭 like there’s a reason I specifically tagged “anti-mileven” you are not welcome here lol

[xsapphic-celestialx]

ok ykw since I’m on the topic of Yellowjackets and stranger things let’s talk about the difference in how the cast and writers treat their female and queer fans, characters, and actors. With Yellowjackets, you can tell that the people working on that show have so much love and care for women and the queer community. Every female character in the show is beautifully written and complex— Shauna, Natalie, Tai, and Lottie being standouts to me. Shauna’s relationship to motherhood and her children is something that I think is explored with so much care and respect. Sammi has spoken about how Yellowjackets has helped her feel more comfortable in her identity as a bisexual woman, and left her old church for a new one upon discovering that they were homophobic. She also asked that people who “did not believe in love for all” not come to her wedding to protect her queer friends and family. Liv and Jasmin have spoken about how important Tai and Van’s relationship is in this political landscape, and have called it “an honour to be gay on screen.” Sophie N has spoken about how if Shauna was in a healthier headspace then her relationship with Melissa “could have been really beautiful.” Melanie has been a gay ally and icon for decades. Juliette has said that she thinks Natalie had relationships with all of the girls in the wilderness. Courtney is very supportive of lottienat shippers. The younger cast PHYSICALLY APPLAUDED Liv when they mentioned getting gender affirming surgery. I think the most negative thing anyone in the cast has said is Sophie T saying she is “very against” being tagged in Mistynat smut fanfic (which is kind of fair lol, I wouldn’t want to be tagged in fanfic of me hooking up with my married coworker).

Compare this to the Stranger Things cast and crew. The duffers calling bylers noise, telling queer people they need to “learn a lesson” and saying they had no intention of ever making Byler canon despite dragging it out for ten years. Them just generally not giving much of a shit about anything to do with the final season. Dehumanising El by saying that she is representative of childhood magic— not a person in her own right— and therefore has to die. All of their female characters being a trope. Maya Hawke having to remind them about the fact that no one else would know about her character being a lesbian. Vickie disappearing in the epilogue. Will getting a random epilogue boyfriend for two seconds. Gaten and Caleb ridiculing Byler in interviews. The snl skit about Will’s coming out scene— a scene which Noah, an openly gay man, said made him have a panic attack. People will say “they weren’t making fun of the scene they were making fun of the writing.” If they wanted to do that then they should’ve had random people appear rather than have it drag on. The people saying it was too long are the homophobes who don’t like that the gay boy was taking up too much time and not letting them ignore his sexuality. They could’ve made fun of any other scene—namely the one where ten teenagers defeat an eldritch monster in about fifteen minutes— but they chose that one. Considering the fact that the snl episode— which did not include any of the three female or queer actors in the main six— also included gross jokes about vulvas and Max “just laying there” during sex I would not put it past the writers to be homophobic. People will say “oh it’s not Finn’s fault he didn’t write the script” which is true but I think he should accept some responsibility. He’s not a child, he specifically mentioned that in his monologue— a monologue which made a derogatory joke about women’s vulvas. SNL hosts can choose to veto skits they don’t like. Hell, Heath Ledger refused to attend the Oscars because they wanted to make a joke at the expense of the characters in Brokeback Mountain. Being an ally to women and queer people isn’t just being a non-homophobic cishet man, it is actively and consistently promoting and defending feminism and queer rights. Finn Gaten and Caleb have proved that they don’t care about that. They are 23 and 24 years old, they are old enough to know better. Snl wants to toe the line between jokes about women and queer people and jokes at the expense of women and queer people. The political climate we are currently in has no room for that. I’m very aware that people don’t have to come out, but if a person don’t feel comfortable enough to come out then they shouldn’t feel comfortable enough to endorse borderline homophobic jokes. Why is misogyny and homophobia more palatable than being queer.

Oh and to all the people who call it parasocial to worry about how Noah feels; I don’t think it’s parasocial to consider the feelings of a gay man who has just had his gay character’s coming out scene mocked on national television. Especially when he’s been open about how hard that scene was for him.

[spaceoddity6]

you guys can be mad at finn all you want but if your anger is entirely reliant on whether or not he’s queer you should probably reevaluate what’s making you angry

if you think the gay jokes were in bad taste, I can’t blame you. if you think he should have refused to do the skits, that’s your prerogative. but if you sit here and are like “well it would be okay if he came out as gay” or you stopped being mad at him in favor of the idea that snl was actually just being homophobic toward HIM and HE’S the victim, that’s a huge issue

this is the whole problem that gives some gay men the audacity to do or say whatever they want about women or other queer identities because they think they can do whatever they want.

either be mad at finn or don’t, but leave his sexuality out of it

[miwiromantics]

yeah, I’m sorry if this is too woke or whatever but I fucking hated the jokes about the coming out scene.

like yeah, I know it’s fucking snl but the gall to make stupid jokes about a scene where your friend and co-star literally had a panic attack while filming for 12 hours and expressed how much it means to him. just for yall to make dick jokes about it and make homophobes who are alrdy harressing both noah and will think it’s even more funny to do so.

and that fuckass coma joke about max is so fucking weird. fuck you lucas would never say that shit to max. it’s disgusting.

[howtobecomeadragon]

regarding all the comments about how snl was poking fun at the writing of the coming out scene, not will himself. "they're making fun of how long the scene was." like okay, the scene being too long as a criticism... how long should it have been? 2 minutes? 1 minute? ofc homophobes are going to claim it was too long, bc they wanted it to be as short and take up as little of their 80s nostalgic show as possible, not bc they had legitimate reason to think the scene was too long.

i need people to get a clue, stand up, and realize when people are being cruel and laughing at them, not with them.

the snl jokes about vaginas looking like a demogorgan, about having sex with max who is just laying there as if in a coma, and about will's coming out: they are not laughing with women and queer people. they are laughing at women and queer people. stop making it easier for them. stop excusing it and insisting that we're in on it.

[xsapphic-celestialx]

say what you will about the Yellowjackets fandom and how shippers behave but at least we’re ALLOWED to have ships, I just got back from Stranger Things tumblr and those guys are STRICT

stranger things fans: um these two characters haven’t explicitly said they love each other how dare you ship them

Yellowjackets fans: background characters 2 and 4 have been standing near each other here’s an in depth explanation of how they’re married

let season 4 jackieshauna do what Byler couldn’t (make out on screen)

(also at least the Yellowjackets writers don’t shit on queer people by saying they need to “learn a lesson” and “just accept themselves and have self-love”) whaaaaat who said that

[xsapphic-celestialx]

do you guys ever think about how Shauna became a mom at around 19 but no one ever called her mom until she was 28

[xsapphic-celestialx]

maybe instead of physically killing characters they decided to metaphorically kill them by assassinating their personalities

[moonmeetmoon]

Okay, but I need to know what the actors really think about this volume, becuase you cannot convince me that they read the script and tought; "Omg this is such a good writing. It makes so much sense that Mike has 10 lines and Will has a whole coming-out scene with 16 ppl. Also we still didnt explain the UD, but whatever. Still, this is peak writing here." Like bro who are you lying

And also pls my dear Finn Wolfhard and Noah Schnapp tell me what was all this, thank you

and ofc its not the actors fault that they got such a bad script

[xsapphic-celestialx]

I imagine they were just repeating in their heads “I’m making seven figures. I’m making seven figures. I’m making seven figures.” Because if I was an actor waiting to find out what happens in the highly anticipated last season of my very famous tv show and I opened my script and saw that train wreck the money is the only thing that could get me through

[purple-mushroom-cap]

how shit your writing gotta be for milevens and bylers to lay down their arms ctfu

[everyus4]

You are Travis Martinez. You’re 16 years old and you’re going on a trip with your shitty dad and your little brother who you love but keep at arms length (love isn’t what men do. It’s what you do. you try not to). You’re surrounded by girls from your school you barely know but they know you well enough to call you the name that has tormented you for years. The plane you’re on crashes and your shitty dad dies trying to save those same girls. You find your Dad’s body in a tree and you climb it. His body falls and you watch. Everything is burning and everyone is afraid and all you know how to do is push away how you feel. So you do. You push your brother and you tease the girls and you use your shooting skills to torment them. You’re bested by a girl. You hunt with her to feed your brother and the girls your dad died for. You fall in love when she cuts the family ring off your father’s corpse because you can’t but you have to give your brother something to let him know (you love him. You love him so much). The girls drug you and use you and hunt you but in the end the girl you love saves you. You’re starving and you’re freezing and you hunt every day from dawn with the girl you love. Your brother goes missing and you try your best to believe he is alive. You turn to the only religion you have to help you believe it and you eat a girl and slice your hand open and you worship. The baby died but your blood saved the mother and in return your baby comes home. The winter continues and you’re starving. You’re so hungry and nothing is working. The mother beats the prophet and in a sick chain of events you agree to a draw of cards to feed her. You survive. Your baby survives. The girl you hunt with is now the prey and it’s not right. You try to stop it. The girl you love comes back with your baby on a pyre and you know with certainty what has to happen. You cry and you hold the baby but you hand him to the mother to carry one last time. You eat your baby’s heart (you’re sorry. You’re so hungry. You let him save you) because it’s the only thing left of him. You live 25 years after this.

[taitravnat]

Lottie letting Nat believe Travis's death was her fault after she watched him die, didnt help, and stole all his money is actually evil.

And then people act as if lottienat is all sweet and Lottie was helping her heal...right.

Also Nat age regressing in Lottie's lap isn't because she feels safe with Lottie, (and if she does, it isn't real, shes being manipulated) the only time before that we saw age regressing is when Shauna stabbed her lover.

Also I hate when people say "when she finally found peace, she died" About Nat. No she didn't. She died blaming herself for her bestfriends death, imagining the little boy she watched die.

[xsapphic-celestialx]

BIG FAT STRANGER THINGS SPOILER AHEAD YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!!!!!!

istg as soon as Jonathan Byers pulled out that fuckass engagement ring I just knew that he’s going to give it to Nancy as he dies in her arms. And she’ll cry and say that of course she would’ve said yes. Because the fuckass writers of this show enjoy seeing everyone miserable.