the internet has become cold and unbearable @beary-polarizing-discourse - Tumblr Blog

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I shall be daringly start sharing opinions. I don’t have much left to lose because most of the people I trying to follow here either don’t post anymore anyway. There’s nothing funny left. And now that I’m in a better place in my life, I want to get better at writing opinions and learning from history.

Here are the ground rules. Criticism is welcome. Even anger is welcome, but anger is subject to my judgment and will in all likelihood result in a block unless I determine you to be reasonable

I am reachable through debate, if you appeal to my core values. These values do not include morality or rationality. I do not believe in them in general, and I doubt your personal versions of them are as objective or even thought through as you think they are.

If you wish to sell me on a notion, explain what material benefit it would give me over the effort it would take to implement it in my life. Understanding people and not being an asshole for instance brings great value in my life, allowing me to talk to people in person, connect with them, and learn from them. Actively expecting me to be an asshole to people, even if they “deserve it” in your calculus, would only be useful if I wish to isolate myself from all my supports and only take your (shitty) company. And if you can actually counter my point with sources, that will determine that you have use to me as I desire to be able to source my arguments better, even if you post with anger.

Basically, you are expected to read and understand posts and not just coast on vibes. And I’ll break tone and say it’s fucking stupid that this has to be explained on a “discourse” website but that’s the world we’re in.

#rants #pinned post

biglawbear

Wait a minute so if only non-Jews and antizionists get to define Zionism,

and non-Jews and antizionist refuse to listen to Jews or even liberal Zionists about what Zionism actually means,

And if Jews are overreacting about antisemitism or weaponizing antisemitism and their concerns are dismissed out of hand,

And if Jews talking about Zionism and antisemitism can't be trusted because they're manipulative, and they're lying,

And if any Jew that disagrees with non-Jews or calls out antisemitism gets labeled a "Zionist" according to the non-Jews' and antizionists' definition of the term,

And if any Jew or Israeli in public or any public institution like a synagogue or nonprofit is suspect of Zionism until they are proven otherwise,

And if "Zionists" are excluded from public life, open debate, or any free association,

And if all "Zionists" must go to concentration camps...

Wait a minute, I've almost got it...

ziskeyt

#i thought we understood the meaning of stochastic terrorism but I guess not

Yeah that deserves to come out of the tags

beary-polarizing-discourse

This is something that is pissing me off about trans rights groups all agreeing to "call out antizionism" instead of actually fighting for trans rights. My trans family members will be less safe due to this shit.

All the arguments that were for the protection of transpeople such as how certain people are stochastic terrorists, they've all been chucked in the trash for radical politics points.

Hey, anyone remember that "first they came for" poem. I'm kind of thinking things are going to go for trans rights if it's acceptable to blame and violently attack a tiny minority subgroup for random crap.

brazenautomaton

have you seen the "you're evil unless you press the blue button" discourse on reddit. (two buttons, red and blue, everyone who presses the blue button dies unless more than 50% of people pressed it) I'm guessing you'd be a red button presser like myself but I'm curious if you have opinions on why reddit is pushing this really hard right now. so many subreddits are pushing "you're evil if you press red" and even "liberal" boards are calling red button pressers "retarded" for not risking themselves to save the blue button pressers. it feels like an op or an astroturf to me but not sure why.

Yes I have

It's an ethical optical illusion. The correct choice is red. Everyone would press red and has pressed red. But you know thst "risk yourself to save others" is the kind of answer you are supposed to give as a good and moral person, so people will bend over backwards and invent new elements to make it into the right answer. The social desirability bias will twist their brains up so that picking blue is a heroic moral stand expressing their faith in humanity. They'll say that since losing even 1% of the world would be so disruptive, we have an obligation to press blue to prevent it.

They say everyone has an obligation to press blue in order to save everyone, because some people will press blue recklessly. But they don't believe that logic holds. Nobody actually believes in endangering half of society in order to save the most reckless people in it. If they did, all of them would be as reckless as the most reckless people in society, because they'd be following them around everywhere! They'd hear the national weather service announce a tornado warning that said to stay inside, and would immediately drive outside to try and rescue the people who were too reckless to stay inside.

IIRC, the thought experiment was designed specifically so that the proper-sounding pro-social answer was the incorrect one, in order to illustrate exactly what it illustrated.

cookingwithroxy

It's even more obvious if you reverse the order of presentation. Because described from Red first, it's 'you push this button, you live. You push this other button and you will die, UNLESS over half the population also decides to push this button. Then nobody dies.'

By putting the blue button first, it makes it sound like the default and that choosing red is the choice of death. But blue is the choice of death, in all situations.

monochromaticchime

I learned about this problem from this Dev video:https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HDUak4vAczk which also includes two details that you didn’t consider. 1: Polls, including a poll where the penalty was actually enforced (as a server ban not as literal death) reliably found that about 60% of people choose blue so voting red is effectively risking those people’s lives when blue was probably going to win anyways, and 2: There will always be some people who choose blue, children who didn’t understand the rules and chose a button at random, people who slipped and pressed the wrong button, or who wanted to save everyone and don’t know game theiry or who are blind or whatever. Those people will

From a game theory perspective there is no reason not to choose red. From an ethics perspective it’s much more complicated.

beary-polarizing-discourse

I don't believe the polls reflect what would actually happen.

Everyone says they'd do the selfless thing but when it's really their neck on the line they aren't going to do it. See the "revolution".

I really believe if this were to go out people would say they're going to push blue and hen push red.

button debate

putting the button debate out to my followers.

bunch of people are given two buttons. blue button pressers ALL die if less than 50% press it. this is the only scenario where everyone dies.

i'm curious if i'm getting this wrong and there's some hole in my argument. the positive thing is that this allows for a political debate that does not require knowing all that much history or geopolitics.

i'm going to lead with my personal opinion.

everywhere on reddit, people are guilting and shaming red button pressers even though there's no consequences for pressing it unless someone else presses the blue button. all of the arguments against red button pressing are moral, guilting, and shaming, even in threads on this in true unpopular opinion. everyone is saying that red button pressers have the blue button pressers "blood on their hands".

which is stupid to me. there is no world where more than 50% of people take the button that carries personal risk. no one needs saving unless you willingly press the blue button expecting everyone else to bail you out, and i'm not dying with them. and yet, that's what blue button pressers are expecting me to do.

it's kind of revealing that reddit, even if not astroturfed, is dominated by nonsensical "moral" arguments. pay attention to the tone of the blue button pressers on a left wing board giving a left wing "empathetic" opinion. they are demanding empathy for themselves but really, really not showing any towards anyone else.

but that's just me. what do you think.

#politics

here's my social media pitch

a social media network that forces you to take exams before you can post an opinion on a topic and also makes you take auto-proctored pop quizzes on various subjects. Your average grades on them are publicly displayed, and if you're too dumb about that topic you're autobanned from ever posting about it

You also can block topic-person combinations or follow topic-person combinations. Posts get tagged by the community instead of posted to specific topics like Ao3

I'd probably fail pretty hard at the quizzes myself but I think this would make for something like the old internet where people had to actually compete via at least seeming informed instead of who does the best tiktok dance

really fucking annoyed that mandatory zohan bootlicking is even brought into the discworld subreddit. At some point they're going to find a way to even make the pet picture/video subreddits about zohan aren't they.

So what the fuck happened to Behind the Bastards

I don't know about the other guys on the podcast, but Robert wasn't a tankie. He encouraged voting in the election and did NOT believe both candidates were the same. In fact, the podcast hosts explicitly said they were anti-marxist and were highly critical of communist regimes. Robert himself is a "Holocaust scholar". Entire show seemed opposed to the usual leftist purity testing bullshit.

So what the fuck happened. Why did they start having segments about how all the antisemetic incidents currently happening were made up. Why did they do a complete bullshit history of Israel that completely puts the blame on everything that's happened on Israel. Why did they all start sputtering and snarling about Zionists while talking about completely unrelated topics.

Like I have friends I don't talk to anymore who were way more of the insane kind of leftist than I realized. And this podcast did not have any of the dumb, terminally online, impractical, ideals over action, self righteous posturing over helping anyone, idiotic whit saviorism that has made me cut off from anyone who says they're leftist. They gave me hope that pragmatism and leftism could co exist. What actual belief do they hold that would make it reasonable for them to fall into Israel Derangement Syndrome

(anti-zionists dni, will block. I don't care what you think, just put this post underwater so you can continue spending all your time jacking off in a mirror to how smart and funny you are)

(not tagging the post for that reason. I don't really think current fans will like this take or have a reasonable discussion about it)

depsidase

otakuvampyre

Because she was full of shit and had no proof of that. She wouldn't even go into details, literally actively refusing to do so.

An obvious liar should not be treated like they're telling the truth just cuz they're famous.

toisse1

Expecting details from a trauma survivor is gross.

otakuvampyre

Expecting details from someone who called being arrested "kidnapping" who is in a situation where the person (or country in this case) they're claiming abused them is routinely lied about (even by them on several occasions) when they have no other proof of what they're claiming happened is not gross.

It's common fucking sense. If she won't go into details, and lacks any other proof (even injuries, which she completely lacks) then her claims should be treated as FALSE. This is not some case of an abuse victim not being believed, this is someone who has lied in the past claiming that a group that is ROUTINELY LIED ABOUT, hurt her and being unwilling to give any details of that abuse while also completely lacking proof of her claims.

beary-polarizing-discourse

Unfortunately this is where the slogan "believe victims" had led. People believe their preferred victims. The same person saying asking victims is gross probably will not believe any of the crimes of October 7 or any of the current antisemetism charges (you're just weaponizing antisemetism), and they won't even believe Palestinians about Hamas executing their own.

It's all just vibes and bullshit. Just repeat ACAB but don't think about any of the reasons why cops are bad when they very selectively enforce laws. Just memorize slogans and never learn anything.

Like five years ago I got a friend who basically screamed at me for liking a leftist post. Not going to get into it because it would be doxxing, but it's one of the reasons I ended up staying with leftists.

Just now I liked a post making fun of leftists for supporting a racist. We'll see who gets the hint.

obazervazi

I think I figured out what's going on with antizionists.

The things that happened in Gaza and the things that are still happening in Gaza are horrible, indefensible, and absolutely worthy of condemnation. This is, to my knowledge, not very controversial. The number of Jewish Zionists that believe that the deaths of Palestinian children are a good thing is vanishingly small. Netanyahu is not a good man, his administration has done untold harm, and if I remember correctly, 73% of Israelis agree.

And why is the war worthy of condemnation? Because it's a war. And wars are bad, actually. Children die in wars. That's not an excuse, it's a reason to condemn war. People say "War is Hell" for a goddamn reason. Even when wars are absolutely necessary, they are still cruel, inhumane, and particularly horrid.

But the far left needs war and violence. They look forward to the day the revolution comes and capitalism is finally toppled. Trying to fix a fundamentally flawed system through peaceful means is icky liberalism, flawed systems must be violently overthrown.

So they can't look at the atrocities and the horrors and the war crimes in Gaza, they can't say this is happening because war is evil, because that would mean admitting their much-desired revolution is evil, too.

These horrors can't be explained by war. It has to be a genocide, the worst thing imaginable. If it's just a relatively normal urban war, what does that say about the revolution?

So when Jews say it's a war and not a genocide, they're saying these atrocities and horrors and war crimes are good and righteous and just, because war is good and righteous and just. It has to be. Otherwise, the revolution might not magically fix everything. It might even make everything worse.

No wonder they call us genocide supporters.

beary-polarizing-discourse

It's basically the pro life movement

Everything they do is just shit the pro life movement has been doing for years. Not doing anything about the problem, all of their policies are about attacking a vulnerable group instead of anything practical, not facing any of the factors that make up the current situation, screaming baby killer instead of discussing anything.

xclowniex

The flotilla has been intercepted. Before being intercepted they were told

"If you wish to deliver aid to Gaza, you may do so through the established channels. Please change your course toward the Port of Ashdod, where the aid will undergo a security inspection and then be transferred into the Gaza Strip,"

Yet they chose not to. They had the option for how to get aid into Gaza laid out to them, and they decided to not do so.

They have also denied the Pope's help in getting aid into Gaza.

How can this not be viewed as a publicity stunt?

Also

"French politician Marie Mesmeur and Franco-Palestinian MEP Rima Hassan reported that their boats were also intercepted. Livestream footage showed activists throwing their phones into the sea after soldiers boarded a ship."

Why are they throwing their phones overboard? What is on them which would require them to do that?

The Italian foreign minister Antonio Tajani did co first that Israeli foreign minister Gideon Sa-air told him the IDF was instructed to not use force

Source

Troops board ships in anti-Israel armada, including vessel carrying Greta Thunberg; Foreign Ministry says those detained 'are safe and healt

beary-polarizing-discourse

What's annoying me the most is so many people who are pro-flotilla shit-talked voting at all times because it "wasn't enough".

There's no real way to reconcile both positions coherently.

sophie-baybey

This is unprecedented. Tech companies don't just pull out of military contracts like this. I apologize if this sounds pessimistic in any way, but I really am just in complete awe that this happened. I had absolutely zero trust in Microsoft to do the right thing, and this news just blew me away to wake up to. This will never wash the blood off of Microsoft's hands, but this decision will still echo out. It is a sign of change. The world is starting to see Israel's genocide for what it is. Palestine will be free.

otakuvampyre

I love how y'all are celebrating this like it's a good thing.

Israel is fighting Hamas, a terrorist group ingrained in the civilian population. How are they supposed to ensure that they are, in fact, targeting Hamas without surveillance of the civilian population? Are you stupid or do you just want more civilians to die?

Oh, and while the Guardian is biased as FUCK, you didn't the provide the source for this screenshot. So I will. Cuz unlike you, I'm not afraid of people seeing the rest of what was said. Like how this is temporary while Microsoft investigates, or how it didn't even actually stop the surveillance, just changed where they were storing the data. It's also based off a Guardian investigation. They are a biased as fuck source, more than likely they're full of shit about most of the details.

Exclusive: Tech firm ends military unit’s access to AI and data services after Guardian reveals secret spy project

Oh, and there is no genocide. :P This is a war Hamas started. Some clowns paying $30 to be seen as "experts" saying otherwise does not make it factual.

Edit: oh and to demonstrate their bias, in this article they present the "UN" as finding a genocide has occurred in Gaza. But they link to their own article and in it they say, very blatantly, that the organization that declared this does not, in fact, speak for the UN. It is an independent UN backed organization, but it is not the UN body. So the UN has not declared shit.

That, ladies and gentlemen, is what we call "dishonest journalism."

beary-polarizing-discourse

Main account got called a bot for hating leftists. To spell it out for people who can't read I'm agreeing with post above and dishing on the original post. Not that it matters. Leftists like original poster cannot read and already decided on what my values are because they never actually do the barest minimum of activism by imagining someone disagreeing with them and strategizing how to reach them. It's all just religious 'im one of the righteous and everyone else is a heretic shit"

The barest minimum of what this article means and whether it's good news for the purported cause beyond just moral vibes is not thought throw.

And yet every leftist spaces is now just this shit. Again, I won't be believed here either even though we had that leaked chat where a leftist wanted to poison all the zionists at a music venue and everyone else was okay with it. That's more than a one off "person not on my side did something bad". Same with the movie boycott of Israeli filmmakers. In every left space you have to hate Jews or you're not allowed in.

jingerpi

kropotkindersurprise

one of these is an incredibly important red line being crossed very blatantly, an international elected political figure who fought for the adherence to human rights in international law and international relations between countries, murdered openly by Israel;

and the other is the death of Charlie Kirk, a fascist podcaster, getting shot by one of his countrymen, as he argued is their right as Americans.

Now which one have you seen more coverage of?

boo-keeper

Wait, what happened?

v-lagopus

Ahmed al-Rahawi killed alongside several ministers gathered for prerecorded speech by rebel group’s leader

Admittedly, the Israel airstrikes happened about two weeks ago, which is an eternity in the media ecosystem - but yeah, that was a blip on the radar....

your-url-is-problematic

just to make this a bit more clear - the reason this was not big news is because Israel did not kill the prime minister of Yemen.

Yemen is led by a President, currently Rashad al-Alimi (though that's contested). the Houthis are a political and military organization who are Iranian-backed and separate from the Yemeni government. Israel killed their leader.

"Houthi prime minister" in this case means "prime minister of the Houthis", not "prime minister who happens to be a Houthi".

jewishgay4il

I assure you @kropotkindersurprise, that the leader of the houthis was not advocating for any human rights aside from his own

some-israeli-guy

@jingerpi @kropotkindersurprise @boo-keeper @v-lagopus

The Houthis brought back slavery and child soldiers to Yemen. When kropotkindersurprise says they "adhere to human rights in international law", it means "they attack Jews".

kick-a-long

To be fair “attacking Jews” seems to be one of the few laws that people follow internationally.

spot-the-antisemitism

Free blocklist

beary-polarizing-discourse

There really isn't much difference between left spaces and 4chan is there.

Not even in "how much they pretend to care about gays" given left spaces have a new subclass of gays that it's okay to hate every other week like "tme's" or asexuals or whatever and nothing will save you from them if someone decides you're vulnerable enough to target you with a call-out.

chanaleah

maybe, when your comments get you called out by the united states holocaust memorial museum, instead of doubling down and claiming that people are just “hating”, you could realize it’s time to do some reflection

iswearbyalltheflowers

Unfortunately I think that's probably on its way out. People were willing to treat that kind of thing as a serious indictment when antisemitism only came from a fringe they already didn't like but as it becomes more popular to overtly engage in, they're going to further undermine and cast doubt on the legitimacy of institutions meant to guard against it.

spacelazarwolf

important tags.

hero-israel

Whoever coined the term "narcissism of borrowed trauma" is a genius.

sweaterkittensahoy

"mass killings in the occupied USSR" Okay, so do you mean the mass murder as Germany worked east and put the einzengruppen to work killing Jews. And only Jews. And then more Jews.

Because that one's about Jews. I promise you.

Or do you mean "mass killings in the occupied USSR" where Stalin murdered tens of millions of his own people and ran at LEAST two pogroms against Jews because they were Jews? Because, again, that was about the Jews.

I know no one in this thread is disagreeing with me, but I deleted twitter and just need to make it very clear what fucknuts up above is saying. He is not explaining what he means by "occupied USSR," and there are historical events where Jews were horrifically murdered for existing because Germany occupied parts of the USSR.

But also, the USSR fucking sucked all on its own because Stalin was a fucking despot and Russia still won't admit to everything he did.

Like, the Holocaust museum is for the history of Jews being murdered by Germans for existing while Jewish. It is about how Jew Hatred was central to Nazi ideology.

To claim the Holocaust museum is focusing too much on the Jews is...I don't know. I don't have words for it. It'd be like saying a museum focused on the Rape of Nanking is too focused on Chinese people.

It's not just an echo chamber; it's an intentional decision to know as little as possible. These people saying these things are intentionally and deliberately ignoring any information that shows them they're wrong because they want to be right more than than want to be decent.

I just don't know what to do with it. I don't know at all.

infiniteglitterfall

that one hit me especially hard. Because I have a friend in Maryland, a true mensch who grieves for every emotional wound and every death in Palestine and Israel, who will - like most Jews, both outside and inside of Israel - rail against the Israeli government right alongside anybody else.

And one of her cousins is still being held hostage by Hamas. Her family only found out about this braa.

gogogadgetgolem

If you think all Israelis deserve to die for the mere fact they were born there, maybe you’re just a bigot.

If you think Israel is a uniquely evil country, maybe you’re just a bigot. (Especially if you’re American, English, Russian, Chinese…yall have zero leg to stand on)

If you think that Israel is uniquely responsible for all the world’s problems, maybe you’re just a bigot.

If you think that being mandatorily conscripted into the army is the same as them happily murdering innocent people, maybe you’re just a bigot.

If you think that all Israelis are bloodthirsty monsters who relish in the killing of innocent Palestinian children, maybe you’re just a bigot.

All of this is doubly true if you’re an American leftist. You cannot for one single moment sit in America with Trump as our fucking President and his fascist base and cabinet, knowing full well that most of us didn’t vote him in or support him. Over a million Israelis recently showed up in protest against Netanyahu and his ilk. So maybe rethink your double standards for two minutes.

slyandthefamilybook

since we now know that all those "my blog is safe for Jewish people" posts are bullshit, here are some Jewish organizations you can donate to if you actually want to prove you support Jews. put up or shut up

FIGHTING HUNGER

Masbia - Kosher soup kitchens in New York

MAZON - Practices and promotes a multifaceted approach to hunger relief, recognizing the importance of responding to hungry peoples' immediate need for nutrition and sustenance while also working to advance long-term solutions

Tomchei Shabbos - Provides food and other supplies so that poor Jews can celebrate the Sabbath and the Jewish holidays

FINANCIAL AID

Ahavas Yisrael - Providing aid for low-income Jews in Baltimore

Hebrew Free Loan Society - Provides interest-free loans to low-income Jews in New York and more

GLOBAL AID

American Jewish Joint Distribution Committee - Offers aid to Jewish populations in Central and Eastern Europe as well as in the Middle East through a network of social and community assistance programs. In addition, the JDC contributes millions of dollars in disaster relief and development assistance to non-Jewish communities

American Jewish World Service - Fighting poverty and advancing human rights around the world

Hebrew Immigrant Aid Society - Providing aid to immigrants and refugees around the world

Jewish World Watch - Dedicated to fighting genocides around the world

MEDICAL AID

Sharsheret - Support for cancer patients, especially breast cancer

SOCIAL SERVICES

The Aleph Institute - Provides support and supplies for Jews in prison and their families, and helps Jewish convicts reintegrate into society

Bet Tzedek - Free legal services in LA

Bikur Cholim - Providing support including kosher food for Jews who have been hospitalized in the US, Australia, Canada, Brazil, and Israel

Blue Card Fund - Critical aid for holocaust survivors

Chai Lifeline - An org that's very close to my heart. They help families with members with disabilities in Baltimore

Chana - Support network for Jews in Baltimore facing domestic violence, sexual abuse, and elder abuse

Community Alliance for Jewish-Affiliated Cemetaries - Care of abandoned and at-risk Jewish cemetaries

Crown Heights Central Jewish Community Council - Provides services to community residents including assistance to the elderly, housing, employment and job training, youth services, and a food bank

Hands On Tzedakah - Supports essential safety-net programs addressing hunger, poverty, health care and disaster relief, as well as scholarship support to students in need

Hebrew Free Burial Association

Jewish Board of Family and Children's Services - Programs include early childhood and learning, children and adolescent services, mental health outpatient clinics for teenagers, people living with developmental disabilities, adults living with mental illness, domestic violence and preventive services, housing, Jewish community services, counseling, volunteering, and professional and leadership development

Jewish Caring Network - Providing aid for families facing serious illnesses

Jewish Family Service - Food security, housing stability, mental health counseling, aging care, employment support, refugee resettlement, chaplaincy, and disability services

Jewish Relief Agency - Serving low-income families in Philadelphia

Jewish Social Services Agency - Supporting people’s mental health, helping people with disabilities find meaningful jobs, caring for older adults so they can safely age at home, and offering dignity and comfort to hospice patients

Jewish Women's Foundation Metropolitan Chicago - Aiding Jewish women in Chicago

Metropolitan Council on Jewish Poverty - Crisis intervention and family violence services, housing development funds, food programs, career services, and home services

Misaskim - Jewish death and burial services

Our Place - Mentoring troubled Jewish adolescents and to bring awareness of substance abuse to teens and children

Tiferes Golda - Special education for Jewish girls in Baltimore

Yachad - Support for Jews with disabilities

#actionable

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the internet has become cold and unbearable