Funniest possible way to translate this
(Sophocles's Oedipus at Colonus)
let's talk about Bridgerton tea, my ask is open

祝日 / Permanent Vacation
noise dept.
$LAYYYTER

Kiana Khansmith

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Jules of Nature
Misplaced Lens Cap

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"I'm Dorothy Gale from Kansas"
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he wasn't even looking at me and he found me
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@cursedcypris
Funniest possible way to translate this
(Sophocles's Oedipus at Colonus)
Pelops: Hey wanna get married
Hippodamia: I would be down but my dad will only let someone marry me if they can beat him in a chariot race.
Pelops: That doesn’t sound too hard.
Hippodamia: He’s got some magic horses from Ares and if he catches you he’ll kill you.
Pelops: Hm. I may need to call in a favor from my ex.
Hippodamia: I didn’t know you had an ex. Who are they?
Pelops: Oh did it not come up? I dated Poseidon.
Hippodamia: Like… lord of horses king of the ocean one of the original six Olympian gods Poseidon?
Pelops: Yeah my dad cooked me into soup but then when the gods brought me back to life he thought I was cute and I got kidnapped and lived on Olympus for a bit. It was pretty chill though. Until my dad stole a magic dog or something and Zeus kicked me out you know how it is
Hippodamia: No, I don’t. In this particular case I very much do not know how it is.
Pelops: Did you never notice that my shoulder is made of ivory? That’s because part of me got eaten. They had to make me a new one.
Hippodamia: I thought it was just a weird fashion choice. I didn’t know that was your literal shoulder.
saw someone refer to Pelops as the great grandfather of Theseus an incredibly dubious connection through Troezen who was more hypothetical land than child as opposed to the well known Agemnemon and Menelaus and I am baffled
I imagine Pelops has stitch marks all over his body like Frankenstein’s monster.
I understand Hippodamia because if my husband enlisted the help of his ex-boyfriend Poseidon to kill my father so he could marry me, I too would be confused as fuck why he cheated on me and loves his bastard more than the fourteen children I provided him. Like no, I don't think advising your sons to kill the threat to their throne is that crazy of an ask, especially for the granddaughter of Ares.
If Pollux and Helen were hatched from Swan Eggs while Castor and Clytemenstra were born normally... that means for a time Leda was pregnant with two of her husband's children and two of Zeus's children. Two fetuses two eggs make for the worst quadruplets pregnancy ever...
also interesting that Pollux and Castor are the twin duo when they're half siblings and really Helen is Pollux's twin. And Clytemenstra is treated as if she is not a twin of anyone almost never mentioned in connection to her twin Castor.
The fact that there are multiple myths of people accidentally getting hit in the head with a discus and dying (Apollo and Hyacinthus, Hermes and Crocus, Perseus and his grandfather Acrisius) I just feel as if death by wayward discus was a really common thing the greeks wanted people to watch out for
I still think the funniest discourse ever is people being like "b-but Orestes and Pylades are cousins"... like yeah did you need the family tree? Pylades marries, Orestes's sister, Elektra his cousin and Orestes marries Hermione their cousin lmao. Orestes and Elektra's father (Agamemnon), Pylades's mother (Anaxibia), and Hermione's father (Menelaus) are siblings. Not to mention Hermione's mother (Helen) and Orestes mother (Clytemnestra) are sisters making Orestes and Hermione double cousins. They're all cousins and they're all fucking welcome to the House of Atreus.
I found this youtube comment and honestly,,,, true
Underworld Duet
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“She will follow you, if you remain true to your purpose,” Persephone said, icy and beautiful, with asphodel in her hair, and embroidered on her dress. She sat beside her husband, Hades, and looked down on Orpheus, her face utterly unreadable, “But if you cast a single gaze upon her before she leaves the Underworld, she will be lost to you until time ends.”
“Thank you,” Orpheus said, desperately grateful. His fingertips ached, blistered and bleeding as he played his plea to the gods who had no reason to give him what he requested of them. The return of his beloved wife, who had fled for her life, and lost it trying to escape. “Your Majesties, thank you. I will write a thousand songs in your honor.”
“You had best go,” Hades said, the first words he had spoken since Orpheus arrived. “The journey is long, and fraught with danger. It will not be easy.”
Orpheus took the dismissal for what it was, bowed again, and made his way out of the grand, dark, pillar-lined hall. Here and there, flowers sprouted up through cracks in the stone, the mark of the queen who was only here half the year, and must be dearly missed when she was gone.
Maybe his plea, and the mercy he received in return, made more sense than he thought. Surely there were none who understood the longing for a beloved spouse better than the king and queen of the underworld.
Hades’ warning struck him, and Orpheus fought with himself, with the urge to look back and make sure Eurydice was there, following behind him. The gods were fond of their tricks and traps, but they rarely lied outright.
Well, he hoped they didn’t, anyway.
On and on he went, out of the grand, black-stone palace, into the sprawling, twilight orchards beyond. It was beautiful and peaceful. Sprawling gardens filled the warm air with the scent of citrus flowers and herbs. Fireflies winked their green-gold lights everywhere, and danced in clouds around the hazy ghosts who walked and laughed together. Off in the distance, he heard music and longed to join.
But no. He was here with a goal, and everything here would tempt him, or frighten him, or try to distract him from his purpose.
And he had to have faith in Euridice. She was behind him. Persephone said she would be, and he could only trust, because to look back for her would be to lose her.
When they came to the River Lethe, Orpheus began to fear. After all, the River of Forgetfulness was no small challenge, and he wasn’t fool enough to think that it would not test him, although he would, at least, not have to ford it. There was a bridge, although it was not what Orpheus might call ideal. A rickety thing of woven branches and rough wood, it cracked under his feet, but it held.
It wasn’t until he made it across, that Orpheus heard a faint sound. The sound of a foot on the bridge, barely there, as if from far away, but only a step behind him.
That sound, that faint sound, gave him hope. Euridice was there. She was with him. The gods had not lied, or broken their bargain.
It also gave him an idea.
Music had gotten him this far. Perhaps it would take them just a few steps further.
His fingers ere too damaged to keep playing, but there was nothing wrong with his voice, and so, hopefully, he started on a song he wrote long ago, when he first fell in love with his wife, and heard her lovely voice.
It was a song for two, and he would be lying if he didn’t admit how frightened he was, how his heart caught, when he came to the end of his verse, and hers began.
For a heartbeat, a single heartbeat, he thought she would not, could not reply, but then her sweet, warm alto filled the air, a little tense, a little afraid, but as true as ever.
Orpheus would have wept at the sound.
The song wasn’t a long one, but he started another as soon as it ended, and another, and another. Together, they sang their way through Tartarus. Through the tortured, evil dead who howled around them and tried to drag him off the narrow path that sometimes faded to almost nothing under his feet. The gods had not told him what had happened if he left the path, but then, they didn’t have to. He knew the legends of those who left the path.
The path turn back to a road until the sky light with flame and they came to another river, this one deep, and angry, and blazing with fire.
The River Phlegethon. The river if fire, that bordered Tartarus, and imprisoned the lost souls within.
Orpheus was glad that Euridice had started them on battle songs of coming home almost an hour before, or his courage, shaken form hours of walking through the tortured dead, might have failed him. The bridge here was stone, but as fragile, as frail, and as frightening. Pebbles rolled off the sides when Orpheus stepped onto the thin stone, and his voice broke as he stumbled to his knees. In harmony with him, Euridice gasped, but she didn’t stop singing. Didn’t stop promising she was there.
Together, they made it across, into the slums of the undistinguished dead.
Here, they were followed, although not closely. The dead could not touch them. Not marked as they were by Cause under the authority of the queen herself, but they gathered near, listening to the songs, and whispering amongst themselves. Orpheus raised his voice louder, afraid to lose Euridice in the crowd. She answered him, strong and clear, and only a step behind him, always.
After what seems like hours more, Orpheus found his voice beginning to give out, but he sang on determinedly, unwilling to give up when victory was so close to hand.
At last, finally, they came to the last river in their journey.
So wide he could not see the other side, the Styx spread out like an ocean, and on the shore, the sandy shore, was a single boat.
“I wondered if you would make it back this way,” Chiron greeted Orpheus with a cackling laugh that was mostly hidden by his thick beard and hood. He had ferried Orpheus across only a day before, paid with one of the three gold coins Orpheus brought with him. “The ferry is not free, Bard.”
“I know,” Orpheus said hoarsely, his first spoken words since he left the palace. He dug in his purse and pulled out the coins he kept, carefully packed with the thinnest hope, and how proffered with more of the same. “A coin for each of us, to see us back to the land of the living.”
“Nice to see one of you heroes has the sense to pack for the trip,” Chiron said, begrudgingly impressed. He took the coins and nodded to the boat. “You’re not out, yet.”
“I know,” Orpheus agreed. It was a warning, he knew. They weren’t out, and until they were, he did not dare look back. Could not make sure that Eurydice made it into the boat as well. “Thank you, Ferryman.”
“Get in the boat, boy.”
He got in the boat.
On through the unmarked grey waters they sailed, with barely the lap of waves against the side of the narrow boat to show their passing.
With nothing to do but wait, Orpheus cast his mind over the many sailing songs he knew, chose Eurydice’s favorite, another duet, and started to sing.
Chiron’s laughter punctuated Eurydice’s voice when she joined. In, on time and on key as ever.
Hours passed, as they passed songs back and forth, flirting and joking as they sang silly songs, and bawdy ones, and ones of coming home after a long time at sea.
Through it all, the Ferryman behind him never stopped chuckling. It might have been frightening, but Orpheus thought that maybe it was a compliment too. That his laughter was in celebration of cleverness that rarely crossed his path.
When they came to the far shore, the boat nudged into the sand, and Orpheus caught himself, right before he looked back to thank Chiron for his service.
“You paid me, boy,” the Ferryman said from somewhere behind him. “don’t spoil it with thanks. Go on.”
Orpheus went.
The air was fresher, here. They were close, and now the songs shifted to those of love newly discovered. Not all were duets, but any song would be sung in harmony, and so they tangled their voices together and kept walking.
It wasn’t until Orpheus felt sunlight on his face that he realized, he was out. Out of the Underworld and back where he started this daring, foolish, hopeful journey.
He went to turn, but Euridice’s voice raised sharply, and she cut her loving song off for one of warning, a song for children, to teach them not to trust all they saw.
And Orpheus remembered.
The game was not done. Not until she took her final step into the weak, late winter sunshine.
So he kept walking. Kept singing. Kept hoping.
Until at last, the song faded, and a voice he mourned for, as hoarse as his own, spoke from just behind him.
“We’ll have to write a duet about this.”
And all Orpheus could do was laugh as he turned around, at last, to see his wife standing there, just a single step out of the Underworld, and smiling with tears of joy in her eyes.
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confusing Odysseus and Orpheus is like confusing a liar and a lyre. send post
Looking back, Nobody found this funny.
This seems to be what I've learned.
Here is a Greek Pantheon of Gods and Heroes family tree I made. I hope the link works. Make sure to go to options and click on middle name, nickname, title, and surname just so everything appears.
When Narcissus was born his mother Liriope took him to a seer to learn of his future. And I would assume for this reason
"Enixa est utero pulcherrima pleno infantem, nymphis iam tunc qui posset amari, Narcissumque vocat." (Ovid's Metamorphosis Lines 342-344)
"She was born with a beautiful full womb a child, nymphs already then who could be loved. And he is called Narcissus"
So when you have your new born baby already being the subject of 'love' you probably go and inquire the likelihood of him living a long life. Narcissus was the product of rape which I feel should also be noted. His father was the river god, Cephissus, who took Liriope under the waves. This is only mentioned in passing at the very beginning of the story but I feel it can add to the analysis of Narcissus.
So the prophecy:
"De quo consultus, an esset tempora maturae visurus longa senectae, fatidicus vates “si se non noverit” inquit." (Ovid's Metamorphosis Lines 345)
"On which he [the oracle] was consulted, whether he [Narcissus] will reach mature old age and ripe times, the fateful judge says, 'if he does not know himself',"
Liriope asks will my unusually attractive baby live a long life. And this oracle who Ovid is setting up as very good at prophecy in an over arching Juno vs Jove (Hera vs Zeus) story says yeah sure if he never knows himself. The text itself says this is cryptic and hard to understand but the following tragedy sees it play out.
The following story is the one that people know. It begins with 15/16 year old Narcissus in the woods. Echo (cursed by Juno/Hera) finds Narcissus separated from his hunting group. She wants him Bad. Six seconds into meeting she hugs and tries to kiss him and Narcissus pushes her off. Saying:
"Ille fugit fugiensque “manus complexibus aufer: ante” ait “emoriar, quam sit tibi copia nostri.” (Ovid's Metamorphosis Lines 389)
"He flees from her and fleeing says "take away your entagling hands! May I die before what's mine is yours."
What's his being his body as that is what she was reaching for. So keep in mind he is aware of his sense of self and what belongs to him.
Now it is the curse that comes in here to end it all. And the curse is:
"Inde manus aliquis despectus ad aethera tollens “sic amet ipse licet sic non potiatur amato!” dixerat. Adsensit precibus Rhamnusia iustis." (Ovid's Metamorphosis Lines 400-405)
"Then one raises his hands with contempt to the air "so he loves himself, so he cannot be possessed by his lover!" he had said. He made his prayers to the righteous Rhamnusia [Nemesis] who agreed."
And so Nemesis agrees Narcissus must love himself. And who would never love him back? A reflection. So there is some meta there that Narcissus never loved himself only the image.
"Quid videat, nescit: sed quod videt, uritur illo, atque oculos idem, qui decipit, incitat error." (Ovid's Metamorphosis Lines 428-429)
"He does not know what he sees, but what he sees burns him. And the same one who deceives the eyes, incites error."
So by deceive they mean he Narcissus all throughout this story is called a liar because he is seducing people but he doesn't mean to do anything with it. So now his own reflection is deceiving him but in this case Narcissus is the butt of the joke? It's just hard to grasp because we of course don't see being hot as lying to people. But in any case to note here. Narcissus doesn't know who or what he's looking at. He can't recognize himself at all. All he knows is whoever is in there is beautiful.
So my analasyis:
There is a general consensus Narcissus getting cursed to love that which could never love him back (his reflection) was him 'knowing himself'. And that is an accurate read.
However, I like to think of it as Narcissus Always knew himself (knew he didn't want sex as he plainly rejects other having his body). And if Narcissus had given in and slept with people therefore denying his true self no one would have summoned Nemesis to him and he would have lived to old age. Or maybe longer both his parents are immortal after all.
But since he Did know himself in the end he was cursed for it. Because he would not allow a lover to possess him. It was his sense of identity in the end that was stripped away from him. And he kills himself. In despair. The text says because he grows ugly and can't bear it. Other version because he can't reach himself so he must. Another he starves to death no agency in the matter. But the text also asks Narcissus can you get up? Can you leave? And I think this idea of being forced into love. Forced into this complete farce of love which he never even wanted the real thing of. The shadows here win and they take him. Echo is another copy image idea right she can only repeat words given to her. Narcissus is stuck with the shallowness of the reflection in front of him. There is nothing Real happening here. Not even close.
Narcissus was born in Thespiae, Boetia. The product of the romanticized assault of his mother a naiad by his father a river god who did the assault. What is Also to note according to Desprcitions of Greece by Pausanias, Eros was the patron deity of Thespiae, where Narcissus was born and lived and died. Narcissus was born under the assumption he would worship Eros but rejects him by rejecting love. It adds more cultural layers to why Nemesis specifically would have been the one to punish this sixteen year old for not wanting to fuck every single person he ever met.
It's very similar to the much older story of Hippolytus (I am talking the Euripides not the Roman adaptation), son of Theseus and either Antiope or Hippolyta but one of the Amazons. Hippolytus was one of Artemis's virgin hunters who hated women so much it was enough for someone to want to wash his mouth out with soap <- modern readers clock him as gay which is fair but he did very much hate women. And so Hippolytus scorned the idea of Aphrodite (calls her cursed cypris that's me !) Aphrodite finds this brat out of line and seeks to punish him for not showing her proper deference and worship. She curses Phaedra to fall in love with Hippolytus... Phaedra who just so happens to be Theseus's second wife and Hippolytus's step mother. (Theseus is also away during this whole adventure and they're not in Athens but visiting Theseus's grandfather out of the city state. Just for context of where they are and where he is.)
Phaedra tries to the point of physical illness to resist these new compulsions for her step son. But she fails. And comes onto Hippolytus. As I mentioned Hippolytus rejects Aphrodite and also hates women and gives a really long speech about it.
Phaedra now rejected and humiliated decides there is only one thing to do. She writes a letter saying Hippolytus raped her and so she must kill herself. At this hour who comes home but Theseus. He comes to see everyone in mourning and asks who has died and learns what went down. Hippolytus is innocent but this whole curse thing isn't going to be that easy. Theseus banishes his son and then, in a fit of rage, summons Poseidon with one of his earned wishes to kill Hippolytus. Artemis brings his body back and explains the situation to Theseus and tells him it's not his fault it's Aphrodite. Theseus who gets to apologize and say goodbye to Hippolytus and holds him while he dies. And so that's how Theseus's house had a very bad no good week.
But we circle back to this idea that not worshipping Love and Sex is wrong and inhuman. Only a Goddess like Artemis or Athena should refrain from sex. Or you must as a woman dedicate yourself to the goddesses like a vestal virgin. Men should under no circumstances be refusing suitors and if they are they should be Punished for their transgressions and disrespect.
Narcissus was born to serve Eros he rejected it. And so as was proper. He was cursed for it.
These stories have inherent themes of aromanticism and asexuality while of course not the words the ancient Greeks or Romans would have used. As relationships and desires were actions not identity. And clearly not behaviors they tolerated from these examples of stories.
You also get the comparison of Helen of Troy being so beautiful she was a lying slut cause her beauty seduced and she refused people with Narcissus in the Latin being called a deceiver constantly when he tells no lies. But his looks betray his rejections. So you can see where classical entitlement to sex doesn't line up with our understanding of consent and autonomy and so we get different reads on the situation.
Ahhhhhhh Narcissus is in the second area as our greek hero. Narcissus says "what would it I have been like were I not so unbelievably attractive? Some things would've been easier... not having everybody fall in love with me...maybe arithmetic" oh he's got jokes !!! anyways great first line I bet they're going to go into the myth and how Narcissus was nothing but a harassed sixteen year old people tried to prey on. Narcissus also immediately friend zones Mel which is exactly how he got himself cursed in real life. And Nemesis who is one of our friends was the one to curse him. Very Sisyphus and Thanatos. And Narcissus gives "second hand gifts... would-be suitors lavished him, yet such kove cannot be bought at any price."
Okay okay game I see you. Also ironically Narcissus's art isn't finished yet.
none of my irls understand the humor in this hope some of you will
Minotaur is not a species
The Minotaur was named that because he was the son of King Minos. Anyone with a bull head has to be named after their dad, like the Kyletaur or something.
Im sorry you can’t hide this gem in the tags