Healing is never out of reach.

I won’t diagnose you in an advice ask. Inbox/submissions ALWAYS OPEN! Send whatever you feel like. I try my best to provide resources, give good advice, and clear up misinformation when I’m able.

[dissociativediscourse]

DISCLAIMER: I WILL ALWAYS TRY TO ANSWER ADVICE ASKS, BUT IT MAY TAKE A WHILE FOR ME TO GET AROUND TO IT. I WILL NOT DIAGNOSE YOU OR ANSWER ASKS ASKING IF YOU HAVE THE DISORDER. I AM NOT A PROFESSIONAL. Anyway, here we go!

Welcome!

I have been diagnosed with DID for about a third of my life, now, and have recently officially achieved remission. I still have DID, but I experience one continuous stream of consciousness (Well… As continuous as an ADHD brain can get LOL) and sense of self. This is known by the community as “Final Fusion.” I am happy to answer questions about this!

This blog is still focused on correct, good info and resources on DID and how it presents, but as someone in the field of peer support and service work, I am mostly going to focus on providing guidance, support, and resources. Feel free to shoot any questions you’ve got at me. If I can’t answer it, maybe I know someone who can, or can compile resources. I can also do research if needed, as I’ve got access to a lot of resources.

More about me under the cut!

❔- I am happy to give advice or answer any sort of asks you might have— Even if that means doing some research and getting some help. I am not a professional by any means, but I do have a lot of information, experience, and a LOT of treatment of various forms under my belt to aid in any conversations around DID or mental illness.

✨ This blog will not tolerate misinformation. If I post something that’s incorrect and you can give me evidence that it is, please do and I’ll correct it to the best of my ability. (Put your carrds down. Now. That’s not evidence.)✨

💕 - I am also the admin of the Survivor’s Network Discord server, an 18+ (NO NSFW ALLOWED) peer support server for adult traumagenic Complex Dissociative Disorder systems/questioning systems to chat, chill, give and receive support, and relate to other people like them. Our syscourse channels are optional and opt-in. We have advice forums, a space for anonymous confessions, a huge category full of resources and literature, fun roles, and a lot of really amazing people there— So if you want to check it out, here's the link: discord.gg/survivorsnetwork

Join the Survivors' Network Discord Server!

Check out the Survivors' Network community on Discord - hang out with 255 other members and enjoy free voice and text chat.

[dissociativediscourse]

A comic I drew about dissociation at work. It’s meant to be relatable beyond that, though — ADHD, burnout, all of those create this thick fog that just… Steals the time sometimes.

I’ve been drawing more lately; thinking about making a series of recovery/mental illness-related slice of life comics.

[dissociativediscourse]

Adulting is so weird. Life is weird. Recovery is weird.

It’s really beautiful, though.

One thing that I’ve discovered recently (or, have been developing my understanding of) is that once peace is found, once there’s real serenity there, that shelter is almost always so much easier to grasp and make use of. I’ve been going through a lot of difficulties lately. I used to think that healing and truly finding those little bits and pieces of peace would take away my ability to handle danger and stress and trauma. But it hasn’t. I can’t express how opposite the truth is.

It’s not my pain that strengthens me. It’s the intuition of the traumatized brain, the potential that it has when the traumas have become one with the story, when they become proud scars where they were once fragile scabs unable to fully heal. It’s the resilience to carry on and the experience of growth and change and healing and getting to meet myself that makes me.

Now, my stressors and abusers and pain and fears don’t make me — I am the only one that can make me. Even then, I only have so much power. And I’m grateful for that. For the ability to not have to worry about managing the universe and planning for every step and predicting every possible downfall. For the fact that the world doesn’t rest on my shoulders and neither does the guilt of decisions I never made, for things I don’t choose. I can breathe and live in the now. And that’s so… Right. It’s enough. It’s so thoroughly enough.

That is wholeness, for me.

I have been reflecting a lot on how different things used to be. Me, the world, the way it all felt and didn’t feel. What I thought Being was and how and who I felt like I could or should be. How I made decisions, how I let them be made for me and how I let them make me instead.

It’s so hard to regret any of it — bad decisions, shortcomings. How can I when it brought me here? To THIS today, of all the todays I could have ended up in? To be THIS me, this complete — and yet still always incomplete, as humans are — me. Of all the people I am not, and all the mes I could have become.

Life isn’t perfect. Things haven’t changed around me to make this feeling — it took me so long to find out that they never could. I had to change and grow into it. I’m still a broke student. I still struggle and face dangerous situations. I am overworked and overloaded.

But I am here, I am me. I am enough. I am grateful. And no one can ever take these things from me, because they are mine. They always have been, but I hadn’t grown into them yet.

[dissociativediscourse]

Time to blog a little bit on the blog. Blog-style.

So… I disappeared. A lot of stuff happened. All good stuff, at least in the long run!

First off, my DID is officially in remission. I achieved ‘final fusion’ fairly recently, and I’m still continuing to learning how to navigate this new phase of life. Healing from trauma won’t fix all issues; not only is there lifelong maintenance and mindfulness to continue living that Grounded Life™️, but I still have a lot of work to do in other areas! All of it is made so much easier by this healing milestone, however.

I may or may not make a post about my experience with this kind of healing. It’s been beautiful. I’m truly in love with the world around me these days — I truly feel infinitely grateful for the opportunity to be able to truly experience and be present for all of the things that come about — even if some things feel like shit. Whether or not I enjoy what’s happening in the moment, I will forever be grateful for the opportunity to actually live that moment and experience it and have the experience I gain from it right there.

I could rant about all that forever, but that’s for another time. I’m always happy to answer questions about this experience/my experience with FF in general, also!

Other than that, I’ve just been making a bunch of major life changes and improvements! I’m teaching my own class at my synagogue’s religious school. I’m finally for real in college and overachieving. (Therapy, here I come). I may begin working in a local psych unit. I am in a genuinely healthy and loving long-term relationship with another person who is also at this phase in recovery, though not with DID. I volunteer however I can to help with local recovery/support groups. I am sober. I am surrounding myself with people with similar goals and similar drive to achieve them. I joined a Chavurah, lol. I am learning Hebrew and doing well with it! I’m baking a ton. Making chocolates, too, lol. I make kombucha now! There’s so much good in my life right now.

Things really do get better. And I’m still getting used to this kind of life and the work that comes with it. But… I’m prepared for it. I’ve survived the hardest part and come out the other end. Now I’m ready to do more than just survive. I’m ready to live!!!

I guess I just wanted to give a tiny little update. I haven’t really been around lately; I haven’t really been online much in general lately. I’m just… Too busy taking it all in. Life is so precious and beautiful to me at this point that I just can’t stop being and growing and experiencing and living and going and seeing and doing and feeling. I’m thankful to be here.

[dissociativediscourse]

We are looking into becoming a peer support worker. We live rural, and rnt super familiar with what the process entails. I would be curious to know what it was like for someone with a CDD to work towards that. Would you be able to talk about what it was like for you?

( or if you have spoken about that process before, could you direct us there?)

Many thanks:)

Hey! I didn’t realize I’d talked about that here. I’d start with going to your state Department of Mental Health’s website. From there, it depends on the state. For my state, you go to the page for forms/applications, and there are forms for CPSS (Certified Peer Support Specialist) and CPRSS (Certified Peer Recovery Support Specialist) certification programs. You may or may not have to print them out. I had to print and mail mine.

Once you’ve got that squared away, search for CPSS/CPRSS (depending on whether you’re working with general mental illness or substance abuse — often either certification will do!) jobs within the area in general — colleges often have openings, as do many in- and out-patient psychiatric facilities. If you attend 12-step meetings like AA/NA/Al-Anon or have any other in-person support groups, ask around to see if anyone there knows of job openings anywhere in the area.

It’s important to know that when searching for jobs in peer support, word of mouth is going to get you much further than an internet search. Call around, call the Department of Mental Health for your state, call psych facilities. Joining some support groups is a great place to start.

They don’t really care what mental illness you’ve got when you apply for certification, and with jobs it’s usually just a general wheelhouse.

CDDs mean you can work well with trauma and dissociation.

To work in peer support, you’re going to need to be in a place where you are focusing on your recovery and healing and using that as your frame of reference, rather than only shared pain. The reason that peer support works isn’t commiseration — it’s working towards a common goal. Commiserating can certainly be a part of that, but learn to uplift yourself and learn from those around you. Remember that if you treat yourself badly, you’re liable to end up doing the same to others.

Thank you for the ask, and let me know if you have any more questions or need further clarification.

[mosaic-system]

I love how most anti-endo syscourse stances feel like they (we) have just gotten so tired of fighting

It used to be completely like “endos aren’t real why are you insisting why are you using our spaces I hate it I hate that you claim plurality fuck off and fuck you”

To now most syscourse stances of CDDs I’ve seen lately are more like

“I do believe non-disordered plurality/ I don’t care if non-disordered plurality exists…

I just want endos to leave CDDs alone/stop trying to demedicalize our disorder/invade our spaces/spread misinfo :,)”

And it’s still considered at best a syscourse take and at worst still anti-endo stance

I love when my (and most other’s) stance is “leave me alone plz” and it’s still controversial???? Somehow???

-Kalo

[ceasarslegion]

Anyone else getting really fucking sick of this support:condemn dichotomy where folks online act like the only two possible responses to anything ever are to wholeheartedly support it or wholeheartedly condemn it?

"Oh you said that you dont think that random stranger should be sent full on death threats and doxxed for their iffy artwork? Why do you support racism" how about we all go outside and interact with real people and see how they react when you say things like that!

[ceasarslegion]

"I dont think you should full on ruin this persons life and all their chances of existing online forever over something that could very well be a shitty mistake that can be corrected" seems to be a real hot take among the same crowd who claims to support prison abolition

[derinthescarletpescatarian]

So much talk about justice and support/condemnation on this webbed site just sounds to me like Bush fans yelling "Support Our Troops" at the top of their lungs

[literallyaflame]

okay. listen. if you ever find yourself falling into a new ideological circle, pay attention. if you notice that you’re among people who define themselves as part of an “in-group” with a pre-prepared human “enemy” to constantly rail against—if everyone fantasizes about the mental state of these loathsome monsters, if they participate in witch hunts or (perhaps worse) poke bears and court harassment on purpose to comfort each other over—get the fuck out. you haven’t been enlightened to some grand conspiracy, there are no evil “enemies” or “degenerates” trying to rip apart the fabric of society, and you do not have the moral duty to “enlighten” anyone to whatever you think the “truth” is. it’s neither safe nor normal to spend hours of your day fighting with strangers on the internet

a lot of people wear this shit like a badge of honor, but it’s also not normal to hide your “in-group” status as a form of martyrdom, relishing when the “enemy” slips up around you. it’s comforting in the moment, but in the long run, you’re alienating yourself from the world outside of your bubble. the more you alienate yourself, the more vulnerable and lonely you become, and the harder it is to reject the comfort of belonging to the “in-group”

i’m writing this from the perspective of someone who grew up in a cesspool of awful, cult-like rural churches—which is its own situation—but i see similar shit happening in online communities all the time, both within and 800 miles outside of my own ideological principles. yes, every toxicass radfem i block seems to be trapped in a version of this vicious cycle, but i also see it happening in random queer circles and niche fandom communities. no one is immune, not even me. i’ve watched people fall into this shit and never make it out. be careful

[sysmemes]

I do not want to put Jewish trauma on display to prove a fucking syscourse point. I don’t want to explain how being part of a people targeted by actual facist hate groups feels. How it feels to know there is a group who wants you and your people exterminated, who nearly succeeded, and who still keep trying, and who are getting bolder and bolder and bolder. What it does to you and what it does to your community. How it affects daily life. Especially not now. I shouldn’t have to, just to get some children on the internet to stop calling everything “nazis” or “facists” or “hate groups”. So I won’t.

But you need to fucking listen to me.

It is so clear to me that facists and hate groups aren’t real to you. They get to be a fun little hypothetical for you. You don’t have to grapple with the fucking weight of what it means to be an actual target. You have the freedom to pick these terms up and play with them like toys to prove a point on the internet and never have to worry about being fucking murdered or having your community torn apart by a real facist hate group. I almost envy you, but I never want to be the type of person to treat this horror like a fucking game or a gotcha.

Words have meanings. A group of people on the internet telling you that you aren’t ✨ UwU Valid ✨ doesn’t make them a “literal facist hate group”. Grow up.

[dissociativediscourse]

Where did you develop your DID from

Childhood trauma?? Lmfao 😭 what, do you want me to give you a long sob story about how awful my childhood was? I’ve touched on the subject plenty of times on this blog. Go ham. You’re gonna have to work for your scraps, honey.

[magnetothemagnificent]

Hey warning for everyone but especially Jews:

Hamas has threatened that they're gonna start posting graphic videos of their torture/murder of their Jewish hostages in the next few hours on social media. These will be very graphic and very distressing, so please be very careful on sites like Instagram and TikTok when scrolling through recommended videos. Please do not share these videos and photos, it is part of the terroristic strategy. Also, because unfortunately there is no shortage of antisemites on Tumblr, please be careful when sent a video or photo on anon or from a user you don't recognize. These are intended to induce horror, don't help Hamas spread their message.

[dissociativediscourse]

hey i rly love ur blog! So much good brainfood :3 /gen! -r

Yeah we’ve been meaning to read through syscourse-type stuff, since we dunno much yet -v

Thank you! I really appreciate it. Please don’t start posting/getting into syscourse if you weren’t already/aren’t at a stable point in your life, though. It’s bad for you.

[dissociativediscourse]

Did you experience ramcoa

Don’t ask people that.

Imagine walking up to a stranger and asking them about whether or not they’d been sexually abused as a child.

Don’t do that, don’t do this either.

If someone wants to share their deepest childhood traumas with you, they will.

[dissociativediscourse]

Can anybody use the idgaf about validity of endogenic banner on your pinned profile?

Absolutely! Just reblog the post:

Anti-Misinfo, OSDDID Safe

ID: A userbox with a black-and-white scale-patterned background. There is a black-and-white image on the left, which is a kaleidoscope-style

[dissociativediscourse]

Post your diagnosis papers

These were both asked at the same time and have the same thoughtless vibe going on, so I figured I’d put them together.

Thoughts on “endogenetic systems” — Well, most of our genes are inside of us, usually. That is what you mean, right? If you mean endogenic systems, it’s in a big, fat userbox right at the top of my profile.

Diagnosis papers? Okay, bet!!

DISCLAIMER: This is a joke. Yes, this is an actual therapy bill of mine. But I don’t expect this to prove anything — anyone can screenshot a bunch of words on a paper and blur out information. It doesn’t mean anything. Even if I were to fully doxx myself, it could be 100% fabricated. There’s no way to “prove” a diagnosis over the internet like that, and if you think you have the right to ask random people with trauma disorders or really any disorder that, in real life or in person: Why? I know I’m not spreading misinformation or doing anything harmful to the DID community or the perception the average layman has of it. I’m actually devoting my life and career to the treatment of it. What about you? What right do you have? What have you done for any disabled person recently? Have you ever even held a door for a person with an injury?

Also, here’s something really important that people just… Don’t seem to get.

They don’t just give you a piece of paper when they diagnose you with a disorder. You don’t just magically become Mentally Ill Certified.

That’s the stupidest misconception I see around. When you go to the psychiatrist for your depression or anxiety or whatever it is you’ve got, do they just send you out with a big old certificate of diagnosis? No, that’s fucking stupid and pointless. They treat you for the disorder you’ve got, and they put diagnostic codes in your bill so that your insurance will cover your treatment. Otherwise, they can disclose your diagnosis for other reasons needed, but rarely are they actually going to need to. The only time I’ve ever needed it to be disclosed to anyone outside of therapy was very recently, and it was so that the state department of mental health could make sure I was actually diagnosed with the disorder I was saying I had — you know, to be a peer support specialist for related disorders. (I’m currently working on my certification.) Diagnosis is there to help you pursue proper treatment and have that treatment covered by insurance. It means very little.

[dissociativediscourse]

Understanding the difference between systemic oppression and social stigma: Why endogenic systems aren't oppressed for being plural, and why that doesn't mean that their struggles are unimportant

Time for the newest syscourse topic, one that I’ve actually been thinking about quite a bit lately. I had a conversation with my very pro-endo friend about it a while back, and it caused me to realize that the entire issue is really that we don’t understand the distinction between oppression and social stigma, and why exactly endogenic plurals are stigmatized, but not oppressed. And why this doesn’t mean that struggles that they do face are “invalid” (boy, do I hate that whole concept. I hate the whole valid thing. It doesn’t do anything any justice.) 

To start off with, it's important to clarify each of these terms. Oppression refers to the systematic mistreatment, subjugation, and denial of rights by those in power against a specific group. On the other hand, social stigma involves societal disapproval or mistreatment directed at individuals who possess certain characteristics or identities. While the two concepts may intersect, they are not synonymous. 

Endogenic plurals, despite facing challenges in the form of social stigma, do not experience systemic oppression in the same way as historically marginalized groups. The comparison I drew in my conversation with the previously mentioned friend was to communities like furries and therians, who similarly encounter varying degrees of societal rejection. While they may be subjected to ridicule, bullying, or social ostracization, these experiences are not the same as being actively oppressed by institutions and systemic structures.

I would also like to highlight that the challenges endogenic plurals face are largely only present within the Western context. Outside of that, they not only ‘would be’ but are very easily accepted, sometimes for religious/spiritual reasons. I had someone from the Middle East (not going to specify which country because I don’t know if anyone knows who this is and would prefer to not dox them lol) describe to me that they once thought that they were endogenic – they were open to their family and community about this, and were very widely accepted for it. It was seen as creative, and a beautiful thing! But once they discovered that they had formed their system through trauma, and that they had DID, it became different. Suddenly it was something to be shunned – this is largely because it isn’t the system that’s the issue. It isn’t the concept of plurality that is an issue, by and large, it’s the trauma. It’s the fact that this is a disabling condition. It’s the fact that when you have DID, you have a rare mental illness. It’s the fact that you are experiencing trauma responses that are unpalatable to those who don’t understand them. 

That’s far from the only story I’ve heard of that type, and I’ve particularly seen a LOT of Asian systems speaking about acceptance of endogenic plurality vs. rejection of DID in their cultures. This is a very West-centric argument, and also goes to show how narrow of a perspective many of the current larger syscoursers pushing endo oppression as a concept have on the subject of oppression. 

You may say, “But, there’s a potential for systemic oppression and violence against endogenic plurals! We just don’t have enough data, because they’re not “out” yet.” My friend said this! I appreciated the point, because it allowed me to highlight my above argument about endogenic plurality outside of the west and also the fact that historical patterns of systemic oppression and the reasoning for such and the examination of parallels with other marginalized groups and their histories with oppression reveal that such concerns are really just… Not warranted. Genuinely, the struggles that endogenic plurals face are much closer to that of the furry community, or that of the therian community. These groups also have to deal with with societal misunderstandings and negative perceptions. Just as with endogenic plurals, the issues they face stem from a lack of understanding rather than a deliberate effort to oppress. If either of those groups were to be open about their identities, they’d face similar struggles – and they do. It’s not exactly the wisest thing to talk to your boss about being a furry or a therian, and it’s liable to get you some hate/bullying/mistreatment directed towards you at some point. It’s stigma.

While endogenic plurals may experience interpersonal mistreatment and possibly even limited job opportunities due to being open about their identities, these challenges are primarily driven by social stigma and negative perceptions. It's worth noting that any systemic violence or marginalization they encounter often stems from an intersection with already marginalized groups, such as the queer or neurodiverse communities. Sure, many endogenic plurals are queer or otherwise neurodiverse, but that intersection and further the violence directed towards it can’t exist without the existence of those other identities. A cishet, white, NT and otherwise non-marginalized endogenic plural isn’t oppressed. A trans, ND, POC who is an endogenic plural is, but not because of their plurality, though it does create a different (and notable) intersection with a few of these aspects. 

It's really important to recognize that conflating social stigma with systemic oppression oversimplifies the experiences of truly systemically oppressed groups, while at the same time not even doing any justice to the issues endogenic plurals themselves DO face. If we can just… Understand that these are two very separate issues, the distinct challenges that endogenic plurals DO face can be more accurately and effectively addressed and advocated for. If we can just ACKNOWLEDGE this, that’s already contributing to a broader, more informed discourse that fosters so much more inclusivity and empathy than what we’ve got right now.

[lordblepblep]

serious question. When I was in middle school my teacher caught me mumbling to myself and mentioning voices in my head and she then called my mom into a parent teacher meeting where she discussed that I could have schizophrenia. Afterwards I was told harshly to not show any signs of plurality and that doing so could get me institutionalized. Is that oppression or social stigma?

[dissociativediscourse]

It’s misdirected ableism! I think I went into it above, if not, that’s my bad. It’s mistreatment happening because it’s perceived as a mental illness that it’s not — schizophrenia. It’s also wildly incorrect on the person who told you that’s part for how a psychotic disorder would be addressed at that point and with those types of symptoms, anyway. I’m sorry you had that experience.

But without the ableism there that’s directed towards schizophrenia/psychotic disorders/etc., this particular issue isn’t something that would come up. It doesn’t mean your experience doesn’t matter, or is any less valid. It just means that the reason it happens is complex and the way it’s addressed needs to do it the justice it deserves for anything to change.

[lordblepblep]

Okay, new question isn't abeism considered a system of oppression? Of abled people historically discriminating against disabled people.

If you want to direct me to research on oppression I'd be grateful, I just want a better understanding.

[dissociativediscourse]

It is! But the ableism is misdirected — it’s not because of plurality, it’s because of plurality being perceived as something else that DOES have its own axis of oppression — schizophrenia, in this case. It’s not a new kind of oppression if a straight person gets called a gay slur, it’s misdirected homophobia. It’s not a new kind of oppression when my gentile friend gets called the k word — it’s misdirected antisemitism. I hope that makes sense, I’m happy to help clarify any further if needed!

[lordblepblep]

"It’s not a new kind of oppression if a straight person gets called a gay slur, it’s misdirected homophobia. It’s not a new kind of oppression when my gentile friend gets called the k word — it’s misdirected antisemitism."

what about if you are like a femboy on hrt, but you don't identify as a trans person. you're going to face the same kind of treatment and it's all going to be misdirected transphobia, but at that point you are suffering in almost all the same ways as an oppressed group. but it is somehow not a struggle of oppression, since you do not identify as said oppressed group? Would that be correct?

[dissociativediscourse]

It’s not about not identifying as said oppressed group. In your case, you’re not schizophrenic. You can’t identify your way into that, you know what I mean?

If you’re a femboy on HRT, that’s a different case. No matter how you cut it, that is a form of queerness and is still queerphobia directed at you for such, and is still coming at you from an angle where the only difference between what you’re experiencing and any other kind of transphobia is your internal way of identifying yourself.

The point to all of this is that endogenic plurals do not have their own axis of oppression, though they can still intersect with other axes and frequently do. Without either being perceived as or already being a part of an otherwise oppressed group, the systemic oppression isn’t there. Endos face misdirected ableism, sure, as well as other things. But it’s not because of plurality and directed at plurality.

I think your comparison isn’t really equivalent, because the hypothetical person that you mentioned is facing misdirected transphobia, yes, but they’re already a part of the same/an overlapping group — They are still oppressed for being queer — because that is a queer identity.

More accurate comparison would be a cishet man being harassed for being accused of being trans. He is not trans, he is not queer, and he’s certainly not oppressed for… Looking a bit trans to some people. He is just an unfortunate victim of misdirected transphobia. Does that mean his issues aren’t real? Does that mean they shouldn’t be talked about? Does that make them not hurt or not matter? No. It means that they need to be addressed accurately in order to actually be taken care of.

I’d actually like to hear your opinion on this to get a better idea of where you’re coming from: Do you feel that furries, otherkin, kinnies, and therians are systemically oppressed simply for being what they are? (Keep in mind, we’re not including things like misdirected ableism or any LGBTphobia they may experience, because these are due to those other groups being marginalized.) Why or why not?

[lordblepblep]

Tbh I think queerphobia, sanism and ableism have a lot in common, but I think your argument for use of accurate terms is right. What's interesting to me is that I don't think I have ever experienced oppression for my existence as an osdd system. I've only ever experienced misdirected ableism on grounds of people mistaking me as schizophrenic, because no one around me knows about dissociative disorders. So that is food for thought. "Do you feel that furries, otherkin, kinnies, and therians are systemically oppressed simply for being what they are?" No, I just see a lot of misdirected ableism, misdirected homophobia, and sanism thrown their way. Anyways thank you for this discussion I have learned a lot.

[dissociativediscourse]

They do have a lot in common and overlap pretty frequently! They’re all their own axes, but they intersect to create very complex forms and a wide range of experiences within the lens of systemic oppression.

I do want to say — if you have OSDD/DID and that is what the source of your Plurality is (I usually use plural to mean outside of complex dissociative disorders, usually endogenic or nondisordered, sometimes I forget people with OSDDID identify as plural occasionally), the ableism is certainly not misdirected! I think it’s just very complex. When you have this disorder, the ableism and aggression isn’t because of being plural — it’s because you’re traumatized and show signs, it’s because you have undesirable symptoms, it’s most of all because you have a reasonably rare mental illness that many laymen aren’t educated about and that they certainly, much of the time, aren’t interested in humanizing or learning about beyond morbid ‘fascination’ that plays into stereotypes and that uses our experiences for horror or entertainment.

See what I mean when I talk about it being complex? Lol. It’s a lot to try and parse in just a few Tumblr reblogs, for sure. (A quick aside: I really appreciate you asking the questions you have and being receptive — I am always happy to explain a statement I make/have made. I’m here to help people understand things!)

If you’re not disabled (in this case disordered), ableism is misdirected, yes. If you are… It’s not really ‘misdirected’ (in this case) as much as it has another layer added onto it. They think DID is the same thing is schizophrenia — they’re exhibiting ableism towards both, regardless. Schizophrenia is a popular mental illness to make fun of or stigmatize for shitty people, and they see you as “crazy”, so they lump you in with it. This is when it turns onto you: It’s not about how you identify in cases like this as much as how you objectively experience what you are already experiencing vs. this being directed at you.

Are you disabled, can you experience ableism? Yes. Are you being discriminated against or mistreated for something related to your disability/disorder? Yes.

Let’s go back to our trans vs. mistaken for trans hypothetical. But let’s add in another person. Let’s add in a third trans person, who has hypothetically been on hormones for a long while. He is a trans man, who passes very well. He is wearing a gender nonconforming outfit and makeup, however, and in this scenario is mistaken for being a trans woman, and is subsequently mistreated.

So, we have:

- Trans person facing transphobia

- Cis person facing misdirected transphobia

- Transmasc facing transphobia, but because of being mistaken as transfem for being gnc.

Both trans people are facing transphobia, this goes without a second thought. But the second one has a situation that is a bit more complex. First off, he’s facing a slightly different flavor of aggression than he’d normally experience. The transphobia that gets directed at transfems, NB people, and transmascs can differ in “style” in some ways. Secondly, it’s because of being mistaken for something he’s not.

Sure, it wasn’t meant for “him”, but he is still trans, and is still having to face this on top of the trauma of already facing transphobia in his life, as trans people do. He still experiences the impacts of these things in a way very similarly to, if not the same as (give or take some complex gender feelings related to passing in this scenario, really) how they are intended to by the aggressor.

Hope that makes sense?

In shorter words: Ableism is “You’re disabled, we’re going to make things in life much harder for you in a host of ways, while all the while mistreating you for it.”

Misdirected ableism is “You’re not disabled, but I think you are so I am going to be mean to you like you are.”

Only one of these is experiencing the full ramifications and societal effects, the life-changing and even further disabling effects, of systemic ableism and the subjugation of disabled people by society.

I want to thank you for this discussion as well!! It was a great opportunity for me to work on explaining these things in detail and in a digestible way, and I always am thankful to be able to help clear up any confusion that I can.

[dissociativediscourse]

Understanding the difference between systemic oppression and social stigma: Why endogenic systems aren't oppressed for being plural, and why that doesn't mean that their struggles are unimportant

Time for the newest syscourse topic, one that I’ve actually been thinking about quite a bit lately. I had a conversation with my very pro-endo friend about it a while back, and it caused me to realize that the entire issue is really that we don’t understand the distinction between oppression and social stigma, and why exactly endogenic plurals are stigmatized, but not oppressed. And why this doesn’t mean that struggles that they do face are “invalid” (boy, do I hate that whole concept. I hate the whole valid thing. It doesn’t do anything any justice.) 

To start off with, it's important to clarify each of these terms. Oppression refers to the systematic mistreatment, subjugation, and denial of rights by those in power against a specific group. On the other hand, social stigma involves societal disapproval or mistreatment directed at individuals who possess certain characteristics or identities. While the two concepts may intersect, they are not synonymous. 

Endogenic plurals, despite facing challenges in the form of social stigma, do not experience systemic oppression in the same way as historically marginalized groups. The comparison I drew in my conversation with the previously mentioned friend was to communities like furries and therians, who similarly encounter varying degrees of societal rejection. While they may be subjected to ridicule, bullying, or social ostracization, these experiences are not the same as being actively oppressed by institutions and systemic structures.

I would also like to highlight that the challenges endogenic plurals face are largely only present within the Western context. Outside of that, they not only ‘would be’ but are very easily accepted, sometimes for religious/spiritual reasons. I had someone from the Middle East (not going to specify which country because I don’t know if anyone knows who this is and would prefer to not dox them lol) describe to me that they once thought that they were endogenic – they were open to their family and community about this, and were very widely accepted for it. It was seen as creative, and a beautiful thing! But once they discovered that they had formed their system through trauma, and that they had DID, it became different. Suddenly it was something to be shunned – this is largely because it isn’t the system that’s the issue. It isn’t the concept of plurality that is an issue, by and large, it’s the trauma. It’s the fact that this is a disabling condition. It’s the fact that when you have DID, you have a rare mental illness. It’s the fact that you are experiencing trauma responses that are unpalatable to those who don’t understand them. 

That’s far from the only story I’ve heard of that type, and I’ve particularly seen a LOT of Asian systems speaking about acceptance of endogenic plurality vs. rejection of DID in their cultures. This is a very West-centric argument, and also goes to show how narrow of a perspective many of the current larger syscoursers pushing endo oppression as a concept have on the subject of oppression. 

You may say, “But, there’s a potential for systemic oppression and violence against endogenic plurals! We just don’t have enough data, because they’re not “out” yet.” My friend said this! I appreciated the point, because it allowed me to highlight my above argument about endogenic plurality outside of the west and also the fact that historical patterns of systemic oppression and the reasoning for such and the examination of parallels with other marginalized groups and their histories with oppression reveal that such concerns are really just… Not warranted. Genuinely, the struggles that endogenic plurals face are much closer to that of the furry community, or that of the therian community. These groups also have to deal with with societal misunderstandings and negative perceptions. Just as with endogenic plurals, the issues they face stem from a lack of understanding rather than a deliberate effort to oppress. If either of those groups were to be open about their identities, they’d face similar struggles – and they do. It’s not exactly the wisest thing to talk to your boss about being a furry or a therian, and it’s liable to get you some hate/bullying/mistreatment directed towards you at some point. It’s stigma.

While endogenic plurals may experience interpersonal mistreatment and possibly even limited job opportunities due to being open about their identities, these challenges are primarily driven by social stigma and negative perceptions. It's worth noting that any systemic violence or marginalization they encounter often stems from an intersection with already marginalized groups, such as the queer or neurodiverse communities. Sure, many endogenic plurals are queer or otherwise neurodiverse, but that intersection and further the violence directed towards it can’t exist without the existence of those other identities. A cishet, white, NT and otherwise non-marginalized endogenic plural isn’t oppressed. A trans, ND, POC who is an endogenic plural is, but not because of their plurality, though it does create a different (and notable) intersection with a few of these aspects. 

It's really important to recognize that conflating social stigma with systemic oppression oversimplifies the experiences of truly systemically oppressed groups, while at the same time not even doing any justice to the issues endogenic plurals themselves DO face. If we can just… Understand that these are two very separate issues, the distinct challenges that endogenic plurals DO face can be more accurately and effectively addressed and advocated for. If we can just ACKNOWLEDGE this, that’s already contributing to a broader, more informed discourse that fosters so much more inclusivity and empathy than what we’ve got right now.

[lordblepblep]

serious question. When I was in middle school my teacher caught me mumbling to myself and mentioning voices in my head and she then called my mom into a parent teacher meeting where she discussed that I could have schizophrenia. Afterwards I was told harshly to not show any signs of plurality and that doing so could get me institutionalized. Is that oppression or social stigma?

[dissociativediscourse]

It’s misdirected ableism! I think I went into it above, if not, that’s my bad. It’s mistreatment happening because it’s perceived as a mental illness that it’s not — schizophrenia. It’s also wildly incorrect on the person who told you that’s part for how a psychotic disorder would be addressed at that point and with those types of symptoms, anyway. I’m sorry you had that experience.

But without the ableism there that’s directed towards schizophrenia/psychotic disorders/etc., this particular issue isn’t something that would come up. It doesn’t mean your experience doesn’t matter, or is any less valid. It just means that the reason it happens is complex and the way it’s addressed needs to do it the justice it deserves for anything to change.

[lordblepblep]

Okay, new question isn't abeism considered a system of oppression? Of abled people historically discriminating against disabled people.

If you want to direct me to research on oppression I'd be grateful, I just want a better understanding.

[dissociativediscourse]

It is! But the ableism is misdirected — it’s not because of plurality, it’s because of plurality being perceived as something else that DOES have its own axis of oppression — schizophrenia, in this case. It’s not a new kind of oppression if a straight person gets called a gay slur, it’s misdirected homophobia. It’s not a new kind of oppression when my gentile friend gets called the k word — it’s misdirected antisemitism. I hope that makes sense, I’m happy to help clarify any further if needed!

[lordblepblep]

"It’s not a new kind of oppression if a straight person gets called a gay slur, it’s misdirected homophobia. It’s not a new kind of oppression when my gentile friend gets called the k word — it’s misdirected antisemitism."

what about if you are like a femboy on hrt, but you don't identify as a trans person. you're going to face the same kind of treatment and it's all going to be misdirected transphobia, but at that point you are suffering in almost all the same ways as an oppressed group. but it is somehow not a struggle of oppression, since you do not identify as said oppressed group? Would that be correct?

[dissociativediscourse]

It’s not about not identifying as said oppressed group. In your case, you’re not schizophrenic. You can’t identify your way into that, you know what I mean?

If you’re a femboy on HRT, that’s a different case. No matter how you cut it, that is a form of queerness and is still queerphobia directed at you for such, and is still coming at you from an angle where the only difference between what you’re experiencing and any other kind of transphobia is your internal way of identifying yourself.

The point to all of this is that endogenic plurals do not have their own axis of oppression, though they can still intersect with other axes and frequently do. Without either being perceived as or already being a part of an otherwise oppressed group, the systemic oppression isn’t there. Endos face misdirected ableism, sure, as well as other things. But it’s not because of plurality and directed at plurality.

I think your comparison isn’t really equivalent, because the hypothetical person that you mentioned is facing misdirected transphobia, yes, but they’re already a part of the same/an overlapping group — They are still oppressed for being queer — because that is a queer identity.

More accurate comparison would be a cishet man being harassed for being accused of being trans. He is not trans, he is not queer, and he’s certainly not oppressed for… Looking a bit trans to some people. He is just an unfortunate victim of misdirected transphobia. Does that mean his issues aren’t real? Does that mean they shouldn’t be talked about? Does that make them not hurt or not matter? No. It means that they need to be addressed accurately in order to actually be taken care of.

I’d actually like to hear your opinion on this to get a better idea of where you’re coming from: Do you feel that furries, otherkin, kinnies, and therians are systemically oppressed simply for being what they are? (Keep in mind, we’re not including things like misdirected ableism or any LGBTphobia they may experience, because these are due to those other groups being marginalized.) Why or why not?