How did you decide that you were an 8? You seem too nice to be an 8.
There’s a good chance I’ve mistyped.
I’ve recently been having a sort of crisis and I’ve been working through it with the enneagram.
I’m going to share a bunch of information here in the hopes someone can help me make sense of things.
It’s going to be long and disorganized. I haven’t made sense of it in my head yet, I can’t externally express it in an organized way. But it’ll be helpful to me to write it all out and look back on it later, even if no one else can make sense of it or bothers reading it.
I’ve been revisiting enneagram over the last couple weeks and, despite frequent breakthroughs and moments of clarity, I feel very “lost” in the theory. I’m having trouble assessing myself correctly.
As it stands, the top contenders are 4 and 8. 5 and 7 are also possible. I can’t relate very much to the other types at all, and I find descriptions of 2s and 9s particularly off-putting.
There’s a lot of things that make me think I’m a 4. I’m prone to seeking the meaning in everything. I define myself by my negative traits at least as much as my positive ones, because I believe every trait is a tradeoff.
For example, people of East African descent tend to have more slow-twitch muscle fibers, whereas people of West African descent tend to have more fast-twitch muscle fibers. This makes the former better at aerobic activities and the latter better at anaerobic activities (hence the west-African dominance in sprinting, or American sports). I’m very interested in /why/ West Africans evolved more of these fast-twitch fibers. Human beings are primarily persistence hunters, which would make slow-twitch fibers preferable to fast-twitch ones. Why did West Africans evolve differently?
My dad is Haitian, descended from West African slaves, so this question has a personal significance for me. I feel like if I can understand what genetic variances I have, and why they evolved in the first place, I can better understand my purpose as a human being. When I was in 5th grade, we had to do a mile run. I had to stop running and walk multiple times, and finished close to dead last. But when we did sprints, or the high jump, or anything that involved strength, I completely dominated the other kids. I wonder a lot about why that is.
I believe everything in life has a purpose. Nietzsche talked about the “artist” being able to live their entire life over again without having any regrets. I relate to that a lot. I feel that every experience, positive or negative, has shaped me into who I am today. And if I could go back I wouldn’t change a thing. Instead, I look to learn from my experiences. I choose to let them shape me going forward.
This description of Sp4 fits me pretty well: http://www.enneagramcentral.com/Enneagram/Subtypes/Subtype%20Four%20Self%20Preservation.htm
I had previously dismissed being Sp-dom as an option, because I don’t stress that much about being broke or homeless or germs or whatever. There’s definitely aspects of Sp I can relate to; I tend to be hermetic, my environment reflects my mental state, and I’m fairly focused on my physical security (more on this later). Then there’s my drug use, which seems pretty classically Sp4. I seek emotional intensity.
However, I don’t prioritize my comfort over connecting with people. For example, one time I was trying to get my sleep schedule back on track and had just popped a melatonin when two friends of mine said they wanted to hang out. So I met with them, bought some adderall from some other kid, and popped a bunch so I could stay up and hang out with them. As we were walking back to my apartment, my clearly Sp-dom friend said he needed to grab his skincare products from his place. He told us he’d meet us back at my apartment. When we got to my apartment, he called me and said he was tired and decided to go to bed. I was annoyed at that, and so was my other friend (Sx/So). We couldn’t relate.
I’ll readily prioritize close relationships over my sleep, my homework, my money, etc. But I also relate to the concept of “splendid isolation.” I have this recurring fantasy of living in a cabin or farm on a huge piece of property, growing my own food and building things for myself. Completely isolated from other people. And yet, I’ll readily put other people above my own physical needs.
It’s possible I’m an So dom. I can relate to this description of to a degree: http://www.enneagramcentral.com/Enneagram/Subtypes/Subtype%20Four%20Social.htm
But at the same time I frequently miss out on social rules and don’t understand my role in the group. A lot of the time teachers and administrators punish me because, in their words, “You have a certain confidence about you that other people look up to. But you don’t seem to realize how much you influence people.” I have a tendency to get blamed for the bad behavior of an entire group of people, even though I don’t think I’m leading/influencing them to do anything.
Now, you might be thinking “This sounds a lot like Sp/Sx.” And I’ve thought the same thing. The “building a fortress and hoping others will come” kinda fits me, and I can relate to a lot of the So-blind stuff.
However, I can’t relate very much at all to the descriptions of Sx4. I relate most to Sp4, second most to So4, and don’t really feel a connection to Sx4 at all. Going by this description for example: http://www.enneagramcentral.com/Enneagram/Subtypes/Subtype%20Four%20Social.htm
There’s also a very strong case for 8.
I’m a fairly angry and confrontational person. I’ll pick fights just to ratchet up the emotional energy. I get bored with dullness. I don’t really trust people. I have a tendency to want complete submission out of my romantic relationships; I want to completely influence and control the other person. One aspect of Sx4 that I /can/ relate to is that ideally I would be the only person my partner ever loved.
I’m also very protective of my partner’s wellbeing. I tend to bond with girls who have issues with anxiety or self-harm or things like that. I get really angry when my partner hurts themselves, but I don’t see an issue with hurting myself. I tend to project my nurture needs onto other people.
I’m very against any acknowledgements of my own weaknesses. Mentally I’m still in denial of them. Despite multiple diagnosis of mental illness and drug use issues, I don’t believe I’m mentally ill or have a drug problem. I know I’m in control no matter what.
I tend to test people a lot to see if I can trust them. This testing happens subconsciously. In person, I can read people really well. I tend to push people on issues and argue with them to see how they react. The people who push back are the people I trust. The people who completely give in I continue pushing and subconsciously view as weak and disgusting.
People being genuine is very important to me. I’m not sure if that stems from 8 or 4, or both. I can pretty much always tell when someone is lying. And not lying in the sense that they literally lie with their words. I can feel in my gut what people really mean when they say things. I can tell when someone is being incongruent and it bothers me. A lot of the time I call them out on it.
I also have my own code of integrity, even though I subconsciously view morality as weakness. I keep my word to people. I’m loyal to my friends. Loyalty is important to me.
Back to the subject of conflict: most of the fights I get into aren’t the ones I create myself. I assert myself in my environment. I’ll play loud music if I want to, smoke where I want to, etc etc. If people take issue with that, I don’t initially respond aggressively, even if they approached me that way. But if they continue pushing, my aggression comes out and I assert myself.
For example, one time I was moving out of my apartment into another one. I was renting on room. My landlord let the new tenants move into the other rooms a couple days before I moved out. On my last night there, I decided to smoke some weed. The new tenant smelled it. When I walked out of my room, he said “Do not smoke weed in this apartment anymore” in a stern and angry tone. I said “Ok I hear you, I definitely won’t smoke weed in your area, but I’m gonna smoke in my room. I’ll turn the fan on and open the windows so the smell doesn’t bother you.” He said, more loudly this time, “Do not smoke weed in this apartment anymore.” That’s when I started getting angry. “No, I’m gonna keep smoking weed in this apartment.” He got angry and walked off in a huff. I said “I’m gonna take that as a yes,” loudly. I was challenging him to do something. I was staring him dead in the eyes while he kept looking away. He said, a little less convincingly, “No, don’t smoke weed here anymore.” I said “It’s still my space and I’ll do whatever I want. Bye.” And left to take a bunch of bong rips without opening the windows. When I walked out of my room again, I subconsciously made an effort to invade his physical space as I walked into the kitchen. He looked away and made room for me. That’s how I knew I had won.
When I’m arguing with someone about something, my aggression is a buildup. It’s not out of nowhere. I start by being neutral and matter-of-fact, and then while they continue to challenge me I get increasingly passionate. I find myself gesturing wildly and making intense eye contact.
My anger in general is very bodily and physical. Clenching my fists or jaw, punching walls, breaking things, screaming, shaking. It’s like it takes me over physically.
A lot of my anger comes out over issues of competence. There’s very much a “you’re doing this wrong and it’s so easy” thing to a lot of the arguments I have. This comes out when I’m working on a project with other people. A lot of the time I push people because I know they can do better, or at least I think they should be able to do better.
I’ve asked a lot of my friends to take this enneagram test (https://www.eclecticenergies.com/enneagram/test-2) and answer as though they were me. They get 8w7 every time. Whether I’m a core 8 or just a strong 8-fixer, I definitely vibe to others like an 8.
Finally, there’s the 8 “trauma” thing. After my parents got divorced, my mom took my sister and I and moved us far away from my dad. Then she started projecting her issues with my dad onto me, because she saw his traits in me. She favored my sister. I learned from a young age that authority is biased and can’t be trusted. I also learned that asserting myself in the face of injustice is the best response.
Even before the divorce, I always had issues with authority. I could tell my teachers thought I was a trouble kid starting in the 1st grade. I would do things impulsively, and they would attribute malice to them where there was none. Worse still, a lot of the time it seemed like they just didn’t want to take my side.
When I was in 5th grade I had a bully. He teased me every day. Most of the time I just ignored it. But one time I had to give a presentation in front the class. He kept making comments and heckling me. The teacher barely did anything to get him to stop. Eventually, I snapped and said “Shut the fuck up Lukas.” I was immediately suspended. He wasn’t punished at all. Later I learned his mom was on the school board and his parents were huge donators to the school. It made me question human motives and realize that people are untrustworthy and selfish and often willing to be unjust for their own benefit.
I’ve had run ins with authority ever since the first grade. I’ve been expelled from 3 schools as a result. It’s made me realize that the people in power are rarely actually on your side. And that the only way to counter that is to become powerful yourself.
But back to my instinctual variants. I relate to Sx8 a lot. I also very much relate to the Sx “each relationship is different” idea. I don’t really compartmentalize my relationships, but they’re all different and they all have their own dynamics. I spend a lot of time thinking about those dynamics. I’m very aware of the chemistry between myself and other people.
But I also enjoy being popular. I don’t actively change my behavior to seek out popularity, but as I’ve gotten older I’ve tended to become popular wherever I go. Other people then start telling I’m popular, and when I learn that I feel happy. I think a lot of that comes from 4; I do feel defective, to a certain degree, so when other people accept and admire me I feel less defective. But it could also be So.
There’s also been a few times where my impulsivity or insensitivity has lead to mass shunning and social isolation. As much as I hate to admit it, I’m very bothered by this. I don’t mind sitting at lunch alone before I’ve been popular at a school, but I hate sitting there alone afterwards. It makes me feel completely rejected and defective. I start wondering if I really do have NPD or ASPD like they say I do.
And a lot of that sounds like So4. But one of the problems I have with 4s is the victim complex. I really don’t feel like a victim. I know I’m in control of my actions and can create any life I want for myself. I don’t spend a lot of time wallowing in the pain of my past. My 4-ish reactions generally seem to happen after my 8 methods of problem solving fail; after I’ve already given everything I can into bashing the problem on its head, confronting people and honestly talking about the issue.
TL:DR; I can’t fully identify if I’m Sp/Sx, Sx/Sp, Sx/So, or some other variant entirely. I relate a lot to 4 and a lot to 8, but can’t figure out which one is my core type. I’d appreciate any input you can give me. Thank you for your patience if you actually read this whole mess.
