[oatlystrawberryicecream]

do you dislike jason todd because his existence calls into question the sincerity and efficacy of batman’s cause and that is difficult or frustrating for you or because his character gets to have high stakes emotional moments that connect with readers to an extent that your fave can’t dream of and you are jealous?

[oatlystrawberryicecream]

you know i have always loved an underdog. a team that hasn’t won in fifty years and is a long shot to make the playoffs but they have a couple of players who are endearingly hard working and scrappy and loyal. the type of players who brush up against success and put their head down and go three times as hard to try and grasp it. and as a fan you watch and yearn and hope that one day they get it. you tell yourself that they can’t possibly be bad forever, i mean the cubs managed to break a hundred year curse and your team isn’t doing that bad. year after year through training camps and season openings and all star breaks and tear stained post season press conferences and lackluster drafts you tell yourself that it is a matter of time. you stay as they cycle through coaches and general managers and executives and maybe even owners. the players who taught you how to love the sport retire ringless, prospects fail to blossom and are sent to the minors, rookies become vets and request trades and decades later you still can’t help but curse at the tv when refs miss a call. winning will be worth it. if they win it once you will be able to hold those memories in your heart forever and nothing will be able to touch it. you will be able to talk about the meagre years with pride because you kept the hope alive through it all. but the real truth is that even if they never do it you can’t bring yourself to love them less just as long as they keep trying like hell, you might hate them for the ordeal they put you through but you are a sick freak who is so broken you couldn’t stop loving them if your life depended on it. so of course i ended up a jason todd fan and of course it is gonna stay that way. commiserating and ranting and making cracks about god hating my faves in particular is second nature and i can and will out stubborn those hacks at detective comics. you want jason to die a meaningless two second death to tie up a stupid plotline? you want him to become as bad as his murderer? gonna wash away all his notable personality traits? ignore all his motivations to use him as a prop to make batman seem reasonable? i watched claude giroux score a hat trick in the final game of the regular season to secure a playoff spot and still lose the mvp vote to a decent taylor hall year, i can name all eight goalies they used in the record setting nightmare season, i saw richards and carter leave and finally win, i remember when the vinny lecavalier contract was so bad putting a hit out on him would have been good cap management, and i saw the head coach compare one of his players to a toilet seat TO THE MEDIA. you can kick jason down the bad writing stairs as many times as you want and i will still be here trying to pick him back up.

[oatlystrawberryicecream]

love is a verb and jason needs to know that theres substance and action behind the sentiment his family says they have for him

which is why to me the very most important part of building any type of relationship with him is for the other party to go out of their way to protect jason’s heart. to center his emotional well being and take action for his sake, solely because it is in jason’s interest to do so, to show how important he is without needing a monologue about it. it is blatant and shameless wish fulfillment while at the same time it is the most vital and interesting way of progressing his character and demonstrating trustworthiness imo

[oatlystrawberryicecream]

ever since the batarang bruce has gotten intrusive thoughts about hurting jason

ok like, he’ll just be at dinner and all of a sudden he can’t help but picture his hands choking jason out following him down to the floor and keeping him there while the rest of the family looks on in stunned horror

or jason’s in the cave getting checked for a concussion, bruce’s hands running through his hair checking for cuts and bumps, and out of nowhere he pictures how easy it would be to snap his son’s neck right then and how no one else is close enough to stop it

[oatlystrawberryicecream]

Unpopular opinion. Jason shouldn't use the bat logo. It honestly feels like a humiliation rituals at this point. Free my boy from the shackles of that billionaire.

i kinda agree but dc needs a logo to put on the merch and it can’t be the full face helmet bc it looks too close to deadpool and spiderman

i will say tho im just glad jason has something that tim hasn’t gotten his greedy hands on yet that’s just his

[oatlystrawberryicecream]

Do you have any good jay-centric fics that doesn't involve bruce wayne appearing physically (and if possible, no mentioned or appearance of tim drake too) because i had enough

tbh despair has been eating me alive the past few months and i have not been following the fandom closely at all so i dont have any recs for you :/

[girlwonderous]

the thing about other characters victim blaming Jason’s memory is that I don’t understand why the major fandom reaction to that is to have to prove that jaybin was a good enough kid to mourn and not to make clear that, for a bunch of so-called heroes, talking shit about a brutally murdered child is disgusting and repulsive and awful in and of itself.

[oatlystrawberryicecream]

*holding dick grayson at gunpoint forcing him to watch the iron claw*

[valtsv]

anyone mind if i get a little bicurious on this suicide mission

[oatlystrawberryicecream]

if you’re gonna call jason a murderer make sure you put unrepentant in front of it

[thievingchameleon]

Jason Todd's physical appearance in comics: Its fluctuation and importance towards characterization.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Establishing the rule.

(A Death in the Family, originally published in 1988)

First three panels are Jason Todd, make an important note of how his facial features are drawn, as well as his physicality. Bruce Wayne is the bottom right image. Reconcile all this with the fact that Jason is around 15-16 years old at this time.

(assorted Detective Comics, I believe Batman 1940 for the bottom right? either way, these are pre-1988, around 1986 to 1987 maybe)

Mind you he's 13-15 here, and most likely only a year or two younger than his appearance in ADtiF. Got some wonderful side by sides with Bruce too. Compare with the panels above. My oh my, how much this logistically wasted and stunted--because he lived in abject poverty for all his life pre-adoption--boy grows in two years. 😑😑

110% this was done to make his death less tragic, because a grown ass adult dying is more palatable then yk. an itty bitty who was all cape. Additionally, people are more prone to giving children leeway when they make mistakes. If a toddler broke your favourite mug by throwing it against a wall, you'd be more likely to forgive them than a teenager, because maturity tends to come with age.

Not only does Jason looking like an adult, or at the very least an 18 year old soften the blow of his death, it also allows for less blame to be placed on Batman. Subconsciously, you may start to agree with the idea that Jason was reckless, impulsive, but most of all: how he should have known better.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Following the rule.

its titans tower time (Teen Titans 2005)

hey sexy lady 😻😻

Sorry. Now, this one gets a lil tricky because Jason got dipped in the pit, and common headcanon/fandom thoughts that just try to make dc stuff make sense have his malnourishment-stunted growth fixed there. So his size isn't too off for his age/situation. Jason is 18-19 here though, and Tim's like 16. But you don't see that, because Jason's physical appearance is close to Bruce's. Reference the first image here with the Bruce panel above from ADitF. Your honour, its the same picture.

I would say obviously the physical difference between Jason and Tim was to make this event more dramatic and shocking. Which is fine, its a comic. I mean if Jason actually looked 18, this would literally be the equivalent of a high school jumping. Less "Man this is terrible for Tim, I hope he doesn't die" and more "omfg get up 💀💀"

I know DC isn't exactly known for its continuity, but consider:

Under the Red Hood, 2005-2006

This is like the only side by side I could find of Jason and Dick from this point in time.

Now a Tim and Dick side by side.

left is from Robin, 1994 i believe, and the right is Titan/Young Justice: Graduation Day, 2003.

Tim's not as tall as Dick, but its not a 4ft vs 6ft kind of height difference.

Jason often matches Dick's height in comic appearances, and is usually close in muscle mass as well. (im not caring about what their height is said to be rn, we're focusing on the art) Mainly because Dick is DC's favourite, second only to like Batman and Superman. (never wonder woman oh my love how they hate you there. i miss your promised games and how you were never just the girl member of the trinity) And because DC can't let Jason have shit, whenever they fight or collaborate, he and Dick are very very similar in stature.

So why in the flippety frackety fuck is Jason an absolute giant in the 2005 titans? Because the comic wants you to be sympathetic towards Tim. He's the one getting attacked, he's the one getting hurt, he's the victim and Jason's the perp. But we should all know damn well its not that concrete/black and white. Hell, Batman's entire Rogues Gallery has their sympathetic moments.

However, Jason's physical appearance undermines the nuance of the situation, because it makes him look entirely unreasonable. It doesn't look like it could be an even match, or a fight where one person has a slight advantage over the other, it looks like an adult attacking a child. It serves to make Jason appear overly violent and villainous, when in terms of age, its the equivalent of a high school senior punching a sophomore because they took their umbrella when the senior left it at the library table to go to the bathroom. Unreasonable? Sure, depending on your perspective. Murderous? Not so much.

The Titans Tower incident was a fight, where Tim got hit hard. Not an entirely unbalanced assault, and not a murder attempt. Why's it often forgotten that Tim gave as good as he got? Because it looks so unfair, if you don't remember the entire issue panel by panel, you may subconsciously assume it was more violent than it actually was. You remember reading Tim - Jason - fight, and you remember seeing kid - adult - fight. Your big beautiful brain puts together what you remember seeing, and connects it to other similar situations, combining both into a new narrative.

Various "ugly" Jason panels

These weren't even the worst ones and it pained me to do this.

But why is this important? You all know the halo effect. This is the opposite. You may associate poor people to be lazy, and the homeless to be addicts. People who have facial scars are associated with evil/danger. "Ugly" people also bear the horn effect. You judge books by their covers, and that's okay so long as you realize and accept you are doing so. In this case, Jason's physical appearance may reinforce the idea that he is brutish, stupid, aggressive, etc.

And once again, this isn't even true to his character considering how many times he's said to look like Dick, who's said to look like Bruce, who are both considered extremely attractive. I wouldn't give a flying fuck what Jason looked like in comics if it didn't affect other peoples perceptions of his character.

Various "ugly" Tim, Dick, Bruce panels

But Jason's the only ugly one? Right, right.

I'd argue the halo effect's in reverse for this. DC frequently writes/implies Bruce, Tim, and Dick as being smart, capable, and prudent, so we all assume they also must be good looking.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Exception to the rule?

Green Arrow, 2009

whoops sorry, wrong panel.

case 230 of not being able to find a good side by side.

Regardless, Mia and Jason actually have a somewhat similar height and build. Fitting since they're the same age. They match each other decently well in the fight, although Mia does lose (?). But prior to this fight, the comic sets up that Jason is a lot like Green Arrow's villain, Brick.

This run makes you draw parallels between Mia and Jason, and forcibly, Brick and Jason. Now, his physical appearance here matches Mia's (good), and his characterization parallel drawn between Brick is mostly because they're both respectively rogues of Green Arrow and Batman (at this point in time).

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Shifting Into the Conclusion:

I'm going to break my own rules and talk a little about the writing here. It's basically given to you that Brick is faster than he looks. Why wouldn't you assume he's fast? Well, he's built like a brick shithouse (ha), high muscle mass, and durable, you'd assume he goes for blunt force impact a lot of the time. Brute force.

*cracks knuckles* (ha) lets talk about the implications behind that word.

When you say brute force, you mean merely physical. But once again, your big beautiful brain draws connections because its like that. It's important to recognize that even without consciously drawing conclusions, you may associate the adjective with the noun.

Jason is generally characterized as the brawler of the family, next to Bruce. Despite Cassandra and Dick both displaying incredible feats of physical strength, with Dick's weapons literally being baton tasers, they are often characterized as being agile, fast, less blunt, never brutish. Do you see where I'm going yet? Despite often having a similar build to Nightwing, you'd characterize Jason as someone who fights with blunt force because it makes sense for his build and his character. Why?

break in the serious talk to ask why we cant call the escrima sticks Batons. as in like. bat-ons. get it. because bat.

When the story requires him to be more reckless, more angry, more violent, Jason appears more muscular, bigger, older as a byproduct, and overall tankier. Like a brick shithouse. And the story often needs him to be the reckless one, because that is the narrative, and has been the narrative for about *checks watch* a short 37 years.

But why is it a narrative, and not the characterization? Jason has consistently displayed high degrees of planning and intelligence in his exploits, see Green Arrow 2001, #69-72 as one example. (Don't even fight me on this, he ran laps around all three of them.) Same with UTRH. His fighting style mainly involves guns and swords, hand to hand when neither are an option. It's not exactly go-to blunt force with him, same as how Deathstroke and Deadpool have tanky builds but use swords and guns. Hell, Deathstroke's plans get foiled too, and he doesn't get called reckless/stupid to the extent that Jason is. But by biased association, Jason when compared to the rest of the batfamily, is seen as such.

Is it reckless if you don't succeed? Is it bad if you're angry?

Jason is highly paradoxical with how much he plans, wins, runs laps around the batfam on occasion, and is believed to be the most stupid Robin. He's damn near seen as more villainous and more hated than actual villains. He dies protecting his mother, but not a hero. We're simultaneously supposed to believe that he wants nothing more than to sell drugs for his own monetary gain to one-up Batman, and that he came in guns blazing in UTRH because he believed Batman's mode of justice was wrong, that victims need more help than what Batman can offer. The reason why one take is more true to his character than the other, is because of the critical events that define his history.

If Jason cared more about hating Batman, then it wouldn't make sense for him to care so much about the victims like Gloria Stanson, enough for it to drive a rift between him and Bruce, eventually leading to ADitF. If he was stupidly reckless, why wouldn't he risk Sheila's life/safety and fight back against the Joker? If Jason is so blindingly angry, why hasn't he once tried to, and follow through on killing a member of the batfamily?

Because of the way comics are made, your brain isn't just taking in the words on the page. The art affects how you take in the message. Don't believe me? Believe history.

but like mainly the first one. The words are effective and the art draws attention to them. It will be, and forever is, that deep.

The way Jason is drawn specifically feeds into the narrative DC wants you to believe. So DC, if for some reason you cannot physically write an issue where he is capable and wins, stop drawing him ugly when I KNOW its not an artstyle problem. I'm fighting for my life in this fandom, and trying to single handedly beat the "Jason Todd is reckless" narrative by depending on writing is starting to kill me bit by bit. I'm simultaneously getting waterboarded because why can't I be a girl and like Jason Todd "just because I think he's hot" if he's also ugly? Why do I have to be a paradoxical fan liking a paradoxical character? Can I live?

[arcade-confetti]

Let's have our fate hidden from others and discoved on the batcomputer with papa

[pjackk]

I dontr think im fit to be around anymore i just want to JO 1 last time and sleep forever more

[diamondnokouzai]

Batman #683 / Catherine Lacey, Cut / gotham knights 43-44) / Jihyun Yun, from Some Are Always Hungry; “The Leaving Season” / under the red hood #13 / Yves Olade, Bloodsport / batman 138 / "i get so jealous of euthanized dogs" by June Gehringer / under the red hood / batman annual #25 / Ada Limón, “The Good Fight” / Batman #683 / sophokles, elektra / under the red hood #1 / unicorn, angela carter / red hood and the outlaws rebirth, #25 / amatullah bourdon, "and my father's love was nothing next to god's will" / detective comics #571

[koriandred]

the way arkham knight jason todd is dressed in catboy armour and nobody cares

[batmanisagatewaydrug]

I only know about Batman/DC through general pop culture osmosis + your blog, so until your post about Joker in WFA I was under the impression that WFA/wayne family adventures was just the term for an extensive fanon universe full of incorrect quotes posts

no you were correct

[mikakuna]

serving cunt since childhood