#jwd

[watchmefall42]

One thing I’ve noticed is that Josh has only posted Felix by herself on his stories since she was born. He posted her at Christmas and a few other times, always just her without showing her face. Meanwhile, almost all of the baby-related content Debby posts includes Josh. Most of the photos and videos she’s shared of Felix are either of Josh with the baby, videos of the two of them together, or pictures she took of Josh holding her.

What’s interesting is that Josh doesn’t really seem to do the same thing in reverse. He hasn’t posted videos of himself filming Debby with Felix, cute little moments between the two of them, or things like that. Years ago, he’d randomly post Debby on his stories or repost pictures she took of him, but now when it comes to the baby, he doesn’t share that kind of content.

No big deal , but I do find it interesting that he’s never posted a sweet video of Debby with Felix the way Debby is constantly posting him with her. He doesn’t even repost the photos and videos Debby shares of him and the baby. Whenever Debby posted something of him on her stories, he’d repost it on his own story.

yeah, it's sort of an odd, slow shift. i don't really have anything comprehensible to say about it, but it does feel,,,, notable.

[watchmefall42]

Tyler is always emphasizing that Josh is the nicest guy he’s ever met. Sometimes I wonder if that’s because so many of the people he grew up around were actually kind of mean or judgmental. Which is ironic, considering his entire social circle was basically made up of church people, and even his school was Christian. It makes me wonder if the people he was surrounded by were difficult enough that meeting someone like Josh genuinely stood out to him. He talks about Josh’s kindness so often that it feels like it made a huge impression on him.

He also once said that if they had met back in high school, they probably wouldn’t have liked each other because Tyler was the “popular basketball player jerk” type. So I wouldn’t be surprised if Tyler himself spent a lot of his younger years trying really hard to fit in and perform a version of himself that seemed acceptable to everyone else. Especially considering the pressure he has talked about from his mom. As the oldest child, I could see him being the one who felt the most pressure to set an example, do the right thing, and be “normal.” That kind of expectation can make someone spend years trying to become the person everyone else wants them to be rather than figuring out who they actually are

oh absolutely fucking heartbreaking point. i can imagine that after being raised around mostly judgemental, difficult people, meeting someone who is just, genuinely kind would be, kind of earthshaking in a way, and would absolutely leave a stark impression

[watchmefall42]

I never thought about reframing Drum Show as having a view through their current life. But it does make some sense with Josh's solo line of "I've been this way. I want to change." and Josh being more vocal on stage. Like they went out of their way to rework Drag Path so Josh could sing with Tyler at the AMAs.

-🐐

yeah, josh's lines being present tense definitely imply that it is, still a thing, though one that is, yknow. being worked on

whether that's more relevant to the anxiety itself or the actual relationship, well,,,

[watchmefall42]

“Like obviously it has huge implications in terms of Josh’s marriage and home life maybe not being as rosy and perfect as Debby and the anti-joshler crowd like to claim.”

I’ve always thought about it this way too, and I’ve never seen anyone bring it up. Which makes sense, because people are obviously not eager to theorize about Josh’s personal life when so many fans idolize that relationship and treat him and Debby as couple goals. But it is really interesting that Tyler writes about a feeling Josh had in the past and frames it as if that feeling is still present in the future. So what, he still takes the long way home? If the implication is that he didn’t feel that comfortable being at home back then and wanted to avoid going back, does that mean he still feels that way now? That he still does everything he can to delay getting home? My god.

And the wild part is that Josh never really admits those kinds of things out loud. He tends to keep a lot to himself, yet Tyler seems aware of it anyway. Based on the lyrics, it almost seems like he and Debby don’t have that kind of deep relationship where they feel comfortable talking about absolutely everything. But with Tyler, it feels completely different. Their connection seems so strong that Tyler already knows what Josh is feeling. He’s aware of how Josh operates, how he tends to keep things to himself and avoid admitting what he’s really feeling. Tyler knows Josh well enough to write something like that in the first place.

It’s such an insane line, and I’m honestly surprised more people don’t talk about it. What’s even more bizarre is how many people treat both marriages like fairy tales and act as if anyone who suggests otherwise must be completely delusional. The same thing happens whenever someone suggests that the line in Rawfear could be Tyler referring to him and Jenna yelling at each other. For some reason, a lot of people seem convinced that these couples are exactly like they appear on Instagram—perfectly happy all the time, never arguing, never struggling, never having conflicts.

SO many people seem to think that the curated instagram "perfection" is reality, even though like. all of social media is a performance, inherently, and especially when you're a public figure.

drum show has so many implications from so many different vectors, drives me insane

[watchmefall42]

Can we talk about Drum Show please?

Like obviously it has huge implications in terms of Josh’s marriage and home life maybe not being as rosy and perfect as Debby and the anti-joshler crowd like to claim. And seriously, the fact they get so offended by anyone daring to insinuate that the song literally about avoiding to go home could in any way suggest that there might be something to idk… avoid??at home?? instead of just admitting that even happy relationships can sometimes face hardship is very telling. It’s like they are trying so hard to protect the image of these perfect marriages because it’s the only solid argument against Joshler they have and even the slightest hint of trouble makes them feel threatened, but i digress…

So aside from that, I think Tyler writing a song like this pretty much proves that he too can relate to those feelings in some way. There’s no way Mr “I could never write something that’s just about someone else’s show” didn’t tap into his personal struggles when writing a song about his band mate not wanting to go home to his wife. If he just wanted to give Josh a voice he could have easily gone for a more vague allusion to feelings of anxiety they both share, but choosing this specific thing as well as him pushing for it to be on the album makes it seem like maybe Tyler just wanted a way to communicate those emotions without having to directly admit they’re his own.

It allows him to go on a stage and scream about feeling trapped in his marriage while having the plausible deniability of saying “no no not me it’s for a friend” (different song, i know, but I just couldn’t resist)

honestly? preach.

[watchmefall42]

Josh and Halsey had very strong bi4bi energy, not Josh and Debby. She took him to a gay bar, and I wouldn’t be surprised if that side of Josh was something they connected over. He may have been doing a lot of self-exploration at the time, and since whatever they had didn’t seem particularly serious, I can imagine them having a lot of fun together in LA. He probably talked to her quite a bit about those kinds of topics too, since she’s openly bisexual.

Tyler, on the other hand, never really seemed to have someone in his life who could relate to those experiences and make him feel less alone or less unusual. When I’m online or around certain friends, i forget that homophobic people even exist because I’m surrounded by a really positive bubble. But Tyler’s situation is like the opposite. He seems to have spent most of his life in a much more conservative environment, and it feels like he forgets there’s a whole different world outside of that. Tyler barely seems to have close friends as it is 😭😭 Imagine having someone you could actually talk to about those things.

Josh even went to a Pride event to watch a friend perform. Just to give you an idea, I honestly don’t think Tyler would have had the confidence to do something like that.

it definitely seems like halsey probably helped josh come to terms with that part of his identity, pulling him into the community they're both part of (though i'm pretty sure they never actually dated and were just good friends)

yeah, never getting out of columbus really limited the ways tyler can connect with this stuff, especially because he was still so entrenched with his family up until recently. i wish he's taken the chance to, get out for even just a few years, it really would have done him a lot of good,,,

[watchmefall42]

if i’m being honest i think debby gives off more the vibes of a straight girl that you think is bisexual for the longest time because of like how she dresses or something and then she turns out to just be straight 😭

josh i definitely think is bi. he seems to have figured himself out after he moved to LA and become comfortable in that part of himself. he was at the gay bar with halsey, he’s been to pride, and i think(?) there was a photo of him wearing a rainbow bracelet too? if i’m not mistaken. i think it exists somewhere. anyway, he’s done these things that definitely make him seem like he is a lot more comfortable with that part of himself. and also just gives of Massive bisexual energy can i just say

but i really don’t get the sense that debby is, too. she seems like the type to say she wishes she liked women too but is woefully straight or something lmao. just my thoughts on it, though it is interesting to hear what others have to say on it

<- @landlocked-lovers

that is, actually kind of exactly the energy she gives off tbh, like she really maybe could be bi, but just. isn't. at the end of the day

forever bi josh truther 'til i die. there is So Much evidence of bisexuality

[watchmefall42]

Josh and Debby give bi4bi energy (maybe im delusional and think there both very attractive and want to imagine I'd ever have a chance) and we have the few photos of Josh in queer spaces so even if he isn't out publicly he seems to have been more open and accepting of the whole maybe not being straight thing. Like, I can't picture Tyler photo bombing a pic at a gay club.

yeah, josh definitely seems more willing to be seen in queer spaces, and i think that's enough of a decent sign that he's ended up relatively comfortable with that part of himself, in a way i don't think tyler has (yet)