ThanhThanh

[obitoslover]

Kishimoto basically wrote Obito saying "if the system is flawed, then I'll destroy it" and proceeded to never touch on this topic again, only focusing on the first part of his speech

It's interesting to think he said that this early, was it meant as foreshadowing to his villain arc?

It's also worthy saying it's never stated in Kakashi Gaiden he desired to be Hokage at all, only in chapter 607, which can be interpreted as Kishimoto not planning it to Obito's character

Of course both concepts work together, as a kid wanting to be Hokage (apparently to get attention, just like Naruto) and eventually learns the system's flaws, but I doubt that was the original intention

Makes me think how Kishimoto made both Naruto (at the end of Land of Waves Arc, chapter 33) challenging the shinobi system after seeing how harsh shinobi life is and chapters later (Kakashi Gaiden ranges from ch. 239 to ch. 244) makes Obito, who parallels the protagonist, also criticizing the shinobi system

But then Kishimoto ends up making criticizing the system as a bad thing, yikes

[thanhthanhluv]

I do think Kishi planned to make Obito a villain quite early on but I also view that his speech here was meant to parrallel Naruto's speech in chapter 237 (especially when this chapter is right before Kakashi Gaiden). Notice that in the first few pages Kakashi asked Obito what he would say to him:

Later, when Jiraiya came to visit Naruto in the hospital:

To sum up, Naruto and young Obito both thought the same way: if everybody in the world calls me trash/fool for living the way I do, then they can get fucked. They both have that kind of determination but it turned out differently for them.

[mosthomoeroticenemies]

Daredevil and the Punisher (Marvel) vs Captain America and the Winter Soldier (Marvel)

Daredevil and the Punisher

Stucky

Voting ended onJun 8, 2023

[luulapants]

FIRST OF ALL I would like to declare my extreme distress at MY ship getting pitted against this INSANE powerhouse. SECOND OF ALL I would like to protest characterizing cap & bucky as ENEMIES in any way!! Yes they fought once when bucky was BRAINWASHED and didn't know who he was!! not enemies!! homoerotic yes but enemies no!! MEANWHILE our boy frank HOMOEROTICALLY CHAINED MATT TO A CHIMNEY

HE WOUND THE CHAINS BETWEEN HIS LEGS!! WHY DID HE DO THAT!! FOR GAY REASONS, THAT'S WHY!!

THIS IS A MISCARRIAGE OF JUSTICE! THE TYRANNY OF THE MAJORITY IN ACTION! THIS CANNOT STAND!!

[traincat]

I think the part of what frustrates me about spideypairs is how peter's written. He's ridiculously strong and that gets underwritten. He's got superior instincts from his spidersense and that gets underwritten. His relationship with his Aunt May is underwritten. The shit he goes through, emotional and physical, is a overwritten that the scale just tips to "poor peter parker needs protection 24/7/eternity". Like... i get that u wanna protect/spoil ur fave character, but where's the balance??

Co-signed on every single account, anonymous. Imho it’s pretty frustrating – I’m not sure if Peter!whumpfic isn’t my thing because Johnny’s my fave (I am, uh, here for Johnny whumpfic, but I feel Johnny as a character lends himself better to it), or because I feel because Peter as a character makes whump difficult. His whole thing is responsibility – at the core of his character Peter wants to be the one taking care, however he interprets that instinct, not the one being taken care of. He’s also ridiculously overpowered, and for me that’s part of the charm? This normal-looking dude who can lift a truck over his head, no sweat, and who knows moments before it happens that there’s a threat in the room. Peter, as a character, so rarely has to be afraid. (Which just makes the moment he is afraid more powerful.) To each their own, but personally I’m not here for wilting flower!Peter, especially since his response to threats, either against him or others, tends to be getting angry, then getting physical. He can more than hold his own.

I think there’s a couple reasons Peter tends to get woobified – people who are familiar with Peter primarily through fanon osmosis might not realize just how strong he is. Civil War did a pretty good job of spelling it out (Tony’s exposition of Peter’s SUV catching antics + Steve dropping the jet bridge on Peter and Peter pointedly not being crushed) but, not to get comics canon gargoyle on everybody, it’s worth repeating: Peter is capable of lifting at least 10 tons, and under extreme stress almost definitely more. He is also very, very stubborn, to the point where it may as well be a super-power. There’s also fandom’s (and non-616 Marvel media’s) preoccupation with him as a teenager: 616 Peter spends relatively little time in high school. He’s in college long before issue 50. Not to say there aren’t stories to be told with Peter as a teen (I’m writing two separate fics right now at the very beginning of his canon, and I’m a big fan of Ultimate Spider-Man and also of Hannah Blumenreich’s Spider-Man comics), but that it’s disproportionately the focus, and I think it’s how a lot of people tend to think of him.

The erasure of May Parker’s influence on him is, without any other commentary, an issue. I get that people want Peter to interact more with [insert favorite adult superhero here], but May makes Peter who he is, and erasing her effectively renders him a different character (… Which he basically is in some of these fics, so maybe that’s the intent. Or maybe I’m looking too hard for an explanation. May is great! Let her be great! Let her be a guiding influence in his life!)

It’s especially glaring contrasted against Johnny Storm, Professional Fainter. (60s F4 drinking game: do a shot every time Johnny collapses gracefully.)

[traincat]

ragefilledmonkey replied to your post “I’ve seen a post saying that the Tom Holland spoilers are staged and I…”

I wish Tom Holland would spoil why the fuck they put in that stupid friend who knows his secret identity and is just annoying as fuck for the whole movie.

Basically any quick search into MCU Spider-Man critical spaces will tell you this, but it’s explicitly because the filmmakers wanted to use key elements of Miles Morales’ story, including his best friend who knows he’s Spider-Man, in their movie:

I mean, parts of these scenes from Ultimate Comics Spider-Man v2 #2 and #3 are reproduced almost exactly in Homecoming, except they replace Miles with a white guy. I’ve said this before, but MCU Ned Leeds bears no resemblance to 616 Ned Leeds, who was a reporter at the Daily Bugle while Peter was in high school and the rival for the affections of Peter’s then-girlfriend, Betty Brant, later turned Betty’s abusive husband and supervillain Hobgoblin (hypnotized into that part in a retcon, but the marriage is canonically bad before that incident). He’s also a tall gaunt white guy. This isn’t to say adaptations can’t make changes to the original source characters or necessarily that they shouldn’t – but there’s a difference between making changes and taking characters from other Spider-Men’s rosters and sticking the names of other characters on them. The MCU being so heavily Ultimate Marvel based, I suspect it was partly done to mimic Ultimate Peter’s only best friend dynamic – but in that case the honor should have gone to Mary Jane, which would’ve given the film’s MJ a much bigger role in the initial movie. But for some reason, they really, really wanted to nab Ganke and stick another name on him. 

We figured that one out, dude. Tom Holland is just an actor, as annoying as spoiler gimmick might be to me personally, and far be it from him to go against his very huge paycheck and MCU directives, so the blame here falls on the top, but we very much do know parts of why they did these things: in making their much-touted “first Peter Parker” movie, what they did was just make a watered down white Miles Morales movie, one that complicated things so much they couldn’t use Ganke as heavily as planned in Into the Spider-Verse because of concerns audiences would criticize them for ripping of “Ned Leeds”:

Also, given Ned Leeds dies in Germany during the events of Spider-Man vs Wolverine in 616 canon, the announcement of this book was very confusing for me:

Wholesome vacation fun.

[daredevilandspidey]

Hello! Do you happen to know of a list or have any good recommendations for story arcs/issues where these two interact? Whether it's issues of Spider-man with DD cameos or vice-versa, or a team book with cameos. Thanks!

Great question! I don’t know of any existing lists, so I sat down with what I have and put something together. These aren’t necessarily just the “good” recommendations but a list of a bunch of DD/Spidey team-ups that I know of. I figured this might be better since, for example, I have a special place in my heart for Silver Age Daredevil comics because they are kind of ridiculous and DD likes to insult his villains by calling them things like “handsome” and “angel.” They aren’t necessarily good, but I like them. So this is more of a comprehensive list as a reference for the blog.

I am first and foremost a Daredevil fan, so this is a little DD heavy, I think. If anyone has any opinions or additions, let me know or write something up and I’ll reblog it to the comm. Also, I’ve linked to Amazon or Wikipedia when appropriate.

Ok, here goes:

Daredevil and Spider-Man first meet in Amazing Spider-Man #16 and are suitably impressed with one another.

They then develop this bizarre love/hate relationship where they do nothing but argue and fight when they bump into each other, but then inner monologue about how noble and strong the other is. It takes awhile, but they eventually start acting less like territorial males protecting their turf and start teaming up when convenient. (Here’s some posts about early DD/Spidey comics over at scans_daily: One, Two).You can find Spidey cameos in Daredevil vol 1 (Volume 1 encompasses Silver, Bronze, and Modern Age Daredevil til the late 90’s where it was ended with issue #380 and revived under the Marvel Knights imprint in what would be volume 2):#16, 17, (16 and 17 are also collected in Daredevil Special: Enter…Spider-Man!), 27, 54, 77, 103, 270, 305, 306, “What If: The World Knew Daredevil Was Blind”, “What If: Daredevil Killed the Kingpin,” and “Atlantis Attacks, Chapter 7: Daredevil.”In Amazing Spider-Man vol 1, Daredevil appears in issues #16, 277, 287, 288, 396. #277 is a Daredevil: Born Again tie-in where Matt calls Peter when Matt has hit rock bottom and is a good one to read if you’re invested in the Matt/Peter relationship.DD also shows up in Spectacular Spider-Man #26, 27, 28, and 219. 27-28 is a story where Peter goes blind and Matt has to keep him from falling off of rooftops. I think this story is great (and hilarious). Peter goes off the deep end but Daredevil sticks with him through all of it and Spidey learns that he can save the day regardless.Daredevil is also in Kraven’s First Hunt, but I haven’t read that one.There’s more, I’m sure, but that’s what I was able to find after looking through the issues that I have. As for trades, you can probably find these reprinted in the Marvel Masterworks and Essentials (not in color) editions. I personally own The Greatest Spider-Man and Daredevil Team-ups, which has some of these stories.——————————Then, there are the two stories by Kevin Smith. While I think that neither of these are particularly GOOD, they do have some great Peter/Matt moments.Guardian Devil spans Daredevil vol 2 #1-8. Spidey shows up in issue #8 and helps Matt deal with some of the issues he’s going through following Karen’s death. I really like the art, though it probably doesn’t appeal to everybody.Spider-Man and the Black Cat: The Evil That Men Do was a limited 6 issue series. Matt shows up in issues #4-6 at Peter’s request to defend Felicia Hardy against murder charges. The Spider-Man/Daredevil team-up is really great but the story as a whole is…well, it has some good parts mixed in with a whole lotta bad. Really read at your own risk. And if you can’t or don’t want to read about rape then stay away.——————————Still in Daredevil vol 2, we have Brian Michael Bendis’ run, which I love. (I own it in the Ultimate Collection trades vol 1, vol 2, vol 3. There’s probably an omnibus, too). It’s darker, the art by Alex Maleev is amazing, the supporting characters are great (especially Foggy, though I really wasn’t into the Matt/Milla romance) and I just highly recommend this run for anyone who wants to read some Daredevil.Spider-Man is wonderful and shows up in issues #34, 35, 56, 59, 60, 65, and 69 (sort of). He defends Matt at the Bugle, provides some comic relief, and attempts to be comforting with little success.Vol 3 of the Ultimate Collection also has issues 7 and 8 of Ultimate Marvel Team-Up with Punisher, Spider-Man, and Daredevil, but nobody is on good terms with anyone else in this.——————————Powerless - a six issue comic that I only include here because the cover makes you think that Matt and Peter are going to interact, but their paths never actually cross. It’s an interesting comic, though, and good for Matt/Frank Castle fans.——————————Deadpool - Suicide Kings: A five issue limited series. Deadpool is always good for a laugh and Daredevil, Spidey, and Punisher all make appearances. I like how Matt is usually able to handle Peter’s style with the quips and joking, but add Deadpool to the mix and he has to go his separate way.——————————Marvel Knights - Daredevil/Spider-Man written by Paul Jenkins. Four issue series. Has some good Spidey/DD interaction, but overall is just kind of meh. I do love how Peter hangs out in Matt’s apartment until he gets home from patrolling and Matt just acts like “whatever, it’s Peter.”——————————Secret War: I actually liked Secret War. The Peter/Matt moments are great, they’re friends and they just seem to gravitate to one another. And they are looking pretty fiiiine in this, which is always a plus.——————————There’s also the Shadowland event, but I haven’t read it yet, so I can’t give an opinion.——————————This brings us to the present. Daredevil and Spidey had a crossover between Amazing Spider-Man #677 and Daredevil #8 called “The Devil and the Details.” I liked 677 but hated 8. Worth reading if you haven’t already.The most recent was The Omega Effect event between Avenging Spider-Man #6, Punisher #10, and Daredevil #11. Now this was a good crossover with great art by Marco Checchetto. DD and Spidey have lots of time together and Spider-Man makes liberal use of his new nickname for Daredevil, “Magoo,” and, again, is worth picking up if you haven’t already read it.

Daredevil is also a member of the New Avengers and has joined in with the Avengers vs. X-Men fight, so you frequently see DD and Spidey, like, standing near each other. Even if they don’t interact that much, it’s just kind of natural to have them in the same panel, I guess.

Ok, that’s all I’ve got!

[thanhthanhluv]

"I know 'cus you smell like Matt Murdock". Ah yes, the fanfic moment when a friend told the couple they smelt like each other after their steamy sex 🐧.

[The Pulse (2004) issue 4]

[thanhthanhluv]

[From Spider-Man: Made Men]

Maybe I'm over excited now but this-right-here is top notch writing to me. 'Cus it's just so real and raw. I think the Daily Bugle side of Spider-Man stories deserves more love. When will we get an adaptation that really cares about the Daily Bugle people instead of just making JJJ a caricature figure? When?

[thelittlestspider]

i need comics matt/peter fics where they hang out in civvies. please, i beg.

[thanhthanhluv]

Deadpool V Gambit (2016) issue 1

These 2 hanging out for 1 panel while Deadpool and Gambit wear their costumes and make a mess 😂.

Secret War (2004) issue 2

Actually they're on a mission here but it has them in casual clothes together.

Spider-Man and the Black Cat: The evil that men do issue 4

I'd recommend you to read the whole book if you haven't. (TW: mention of rape)

[xycuro-illuminati]

How do I convince my mcu fan friends that himbo kings is a thing and I'm not just going bonkers

You don't bc himbo kings isn't actually a thing in canon. It's just an idea of these three interacting and not liking each other for shitpost sakes. There is no canon interaction with all three present. And it's best not to tell them anything about it knowing how m/cu fans love to make anything and everything found family.

[thanhthanhluv]

Imagine being so scared of MCU fans that you're willing to gaslight your fellow enjoyers 💀. You almost got me there bruh.

[60793855770-ty-deactivated20240]

I found out Daredevil and Moon Knight are besties and I love it

[din-skywalker]

Can you recommend some comic to me where Miguel and MJ interact? I read "Spider-Man 2099 meets Spider-Man" and damn they have besties potential 😂.

there aren't really any other comics i've read yet that have them interacting, but the game "edge of time" has them interacting and it is quite amusing lmao

both are very snarky so they're hilarious together

[thanhthanhluv]

Thanks. I have already watched the full gameplay of that game as well. Considering the time it came out, I guess it's safe to say MJ's potrayal here is heavily influenced by Raimi's version, aka the helpless screaming crying woman, which...I'm not sure I'm a big fan of 😂. The thing I adore though, is Miguel and Peter's nerd banter.

[amazing-spiderling]

Oh what a night.

[thanhthanhluv]

Didn't know one day I would hop on this trend 😂

[thanhthanhluv]

Man Peter sounds terribly like a man talking about his secret love affair 🐧

From Daredevil (1998) #65

[thanhthanhluv]

I came across this panel of Peter Parker while a Daredevil comic. Note that the year it came out was 2004. Andrew Garfield was destinied to play Spider-Man after all huh?

From Daredevil (1998) #56

[thanhthanhluv]

So this is their meet-cute, your honors.

From Annihilation: Conquest - Starlord (2007) #1

[thanhthanhluv]

MCU give us Peter calling his raccoon bfriend Rocky now 😭

From Guardians of the Galaxy (2008) #5 #10 #13 #25

[thanhthanhluv]

Please stop Peter Quill, your teammates don't need to here you dirty talking with your raccoon in the middle of a mission 🙄