Stan Jason Todd or suffer the Daddy Spank!
My agendas
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@justadcgirl
Stan Jason Todd or suffer the Daddy Spank!
My agendas
List of my favorite Jason agendas:
1. Bruce didn't adopt Jason cause he thought he would be a criminal
2. Robin Jason deserves to have his big cape
3. Jason should kill rapists more often
4. Jason is not white (But raya its not canon 🥺. SHHHHHHH. Dont care. Its canon to me)
5. Jason should be queer
6. ALL BLADES COMEBACK!!!!!
I'm back 😈
I'll never forget what they took from us
I'm sorry I just love them so much 🤧🤧🤧
Everyone talks about batman making robin eat bats in all star b&r when a) that's not main canon and b) Robin never even ate the rat, yet I've not seen one post about tom kings ww eating the rat she was having a conversation with* in her cell and then being comforted by his grieving rat widow
* bc wonder woman can talk to animals you see
@nonbinaryhectorhall @erikaogrady I know you did not doubt me, but I need to clarify I am being so serious i could die. I did misremember some details, she didn't have a conversation with the first rat, she was talking to it but it was ignoring her. However she did talk to the second rat and get comforted by the grieving rat widow.
Now, it would be reasonable to believe that this is all part of the stories in Wonder Woman's head, in an ambiguously real zone, as Steve here is a construct in her head she is using to process her imprisonment.
However, when we get to the real world:
Wonder Woman #10
...what...
I come back to tumblr and dc. And this is the shit I see.
MXTX said to woobie and spoil WWX as much as I see fit post-canon with LWJ and I damn well will as much as sickeningly possible especially because it angers so many of you that it's canon that she likes to woobie her favs (Luo Binghe, Wei Wuxian, and Xie Lian)
Saw a post about Jason not listening to Taylor Swift and I raise you.
Jason todd listens to classical music (because they go hard as fuck). And he listens to r&b. Plus jazz- Good jazz.
I really think he would like something instrument heavy.
i see your classical music and i raise you jason todd listens to 2010s white girl pop.
you get it so much. im kissing you on the mouth btw. if you even care.
Saw a post about Jason not listening to Taylor Swift and I raise you.
Jason todd listens to classical music (because they go hard as fuck). And he listens to r&b. Plus jazz- Good jazz.
I really think he would like something instrument heavy.
i see your classical music and i raise you jason todd listens to 2010s white girl pop.
No but I HATE it when fanfics/canon/rhato (🤢) make Black Mask Jason's archenemy or someone reaaaaally dangerous he has to deal with. What the fuck. Did you even read utrh??
Saw a post about Jason not listening to Taylor Swift and I raise you.
Jason todd listens to classical music (because they go hard as fuck). And he listens to r&b. Plus jazz- Good jazz.
I really think he would like something instrument heavy.
read boywonder and exploded died (in a bad way)
talia... what have they done to you... what do they always do to you... ‘there is no honour in assassin’s work’ talia... where are u... the apple of my eye, i adore her sm very close to sending pipebombs to GM everyday waow...
watching people talk about how good this was for talia feels like chewing glass. boy wonder was clearly written by someone who has not read anything involving talia prior to grant morrison and doesn't care about her outside of whatever can justify her becoming an abusive backstory for damian.
boy wonder completely disrespects her struggle during the time when she was so conflicted because she wanted to be loyal to her father but wasn't sure if she believed in him entirely anymore. the struggle existed because talia knew she would not abide by nor aid him if she did not agree with him. because talia has her own moral compass and beliefs that she follows. juni ba disregards this very important part of her journey to instead make her an entirely different character apparently did not disagree with ra's at any point before her own son was threatened (going as far as making her uncaring towards damian's former caretaker to show us how twisted her way of thinking is. mind you, this is supposedly the same talia who cried the first time she accidentally killed someone and has risked her life to help strangers, the JLA, jason todd, etc). she has to be turned into a different person just because boy wonder needs her to be framed as a somewhat sympathetic villain who gets what she deserves by having her son leave her for a better family. her "happy ending" is knowing that damian's other family is making him happy, which she never could because the story deems her incapable of that.
along these lines is another thing i found insulting: juni ba insinuating that talia's love for bruce may have been caused by talia wanting to please her father, who wanted bruce as an heir. when in reality, ra's only took notice of bruce after talia fell in love with bruce. it was because talia was outspoken enough in front of her father to bring up bruce that ra's cared about him at all. it was because talia had been off in cairo studying medicine that she had been caught up in a scheme that took her to bruce. all of those were her own choices, and juni ba wants us to question whether any of it was real because he doesn't believe talia has ever had agency. all because he himself clearly has never read talia outside of recent comics.
related to the above: juni ba insists talia wanted to be the heir to the league of assassins. pre-GM talia has never expressed this. she's never even implied it. from everything we've seen, it's pretty clear she would never want to nor would she able to stomach so much death. because it's canon that talia's heart hurts for everyone she sees killed. but, again, juni ba does not care about this whatsoever because his story is about damian and the bats. talia's characterization is always acceptable collateral damage when it comes to damian and the bats.
the more I think about it, the more I hate juni ba's misinterpretation of her. people so readily accept things like boy wonder and WFA when it comes to talia because they know so little about the most foundational parts of her character and it's really upsetting that big projects will continue to give such ooc stories as the best case scenario for talia. this is equivalent to someone writing a story where bruce decided to not take in dick or jason because the mission's more important than one kid. that would make bruce a different and less compelling character, right? that's exactly what happened to talia here (and in wfa and in everything GM wrote and in pretty much every story written since then). these are very integral parts of her character. if boy wonder as a story can't function without talia being so thoroughly destroyed? it was never a story worth telling (and it really isn't. because it's truly not a good story at all, which makes talia being wrecked for it even worse).
it makes me so angry because things like this are exactly why people don't see talia the same way they see selina or bruce or any other character ever! she continues to be pushed into the role of the harmful past who can only atone for her mistakes by now becoming an obsolete observer.
im soooo tired of batman comics from the 90s onwards screaming "jason todd wasn't dick grayson and that's what got him killed" at us when batman himself told dick that jason was too much like him.
batman #410
they both devoted themselves so heavily to his mission that they defy his orders to save people. it was what made him say jason was just like dick back in jason's first post crisis story as robin, it makes sense if that's also what made him say it the first time dick confronted him about jason's death.
New Titans #55
The Batarang-Incident with Jason and Bruce honestly shows just how much DC writers hold shock value over proper characterization.
You mean to tell me that an experienced vigilante would choose to disarm a person with a gun by injuring them (and thus risking the chance of them pulling the trigger due to shock), instead of getting the gun away from them in the first place?
And you mean to tell me that this experienced vigilante (who has also been shown using his Batarangs to disarm gunmen by destroying their guns multiple times before) would take one look at the person who he considered a son — despite all of their recent fights — and risk a possibly fatal wound ?
Yeah, it's not adding up.
I made a post about this in the past, and same.
The throat is such a delicate area, you don't need to cut deep to kill someone. There is NO WAY someone like Bruce, who is against killing andis known for his compassion for criminals (the man stood by his parents' killer' deathbed so he would not be alone), would target his SON'S THROAT. Even if it wasn't Jason, it's too risky, he would not do that. (Reminds me of this panel where Jason tells Bruce he never hit the Joker as hard as he hit Jason. What kind of bs is that??? Hello DC, wtf???)
But also, I was corrected when I made that post that Bruce's batarang ricocheted and hit Jason's throat, so he didn't actually targeted it. But like, nobody remembers that and still, bad idea writers.
I totally agree!
However, going over the panels a few more times — Jason was positioned in a way that Bruce only had sight of the upper half of his face whilst everything below (including his neck) was either partially or fully covered. It looks like Bruce deliberately ricocheted the batarang against the wall behind Jason to hit his neck from the back. This is why the whole Batarang-in-the-neck thing doesn't make sense to me. Why would he target his neck in such a complicated roundabout way despite having clear line of sight of his arm holding the gun, which he could've used the batarang on instead of potentially fatally wounding him?
So, if anything, the correction makes this gesture seem even more out of character for Bruce and it's honestly somewhat confusing why people would defend the writers setting the scene up like this — it does nothing but serve as shock value over proper characterization.
I want to add what I believe is the actual way it's meant to be read here, which is that Bruce was going for the gun, and hitting the neck was an accident.
This is the page in question:
Looking at Jason's positioning, it's pretty easy to see why he thinks he's only given Bruce a headshot, and put him in the position of either allowing Joker to die, or killing Jason himself. His back is maybe a foot from a wall, he has Joker in a relatively secure hold, and there's no obvious way to knock the gun away from Joker's head with Jason's shoulder and head behind it.
Even if Bruce hits either of his arms (or hand), or the part of his chest that's exposed, it's not only possible but I'd argue likely that Jason still has time to pull the trigger, even if it's with an involuntary spasm of his hand. End result, dead Joker. Maybe Bruce could disable the gun in some way by hitting it directly, but a head-on hit to the gun will not knock it away from Joker's head, so if he can't completely disable the gun on impact, dead Joker. Even if he can get it to misfire, misfiring that close to both their heads there's still a decent chance one or both of them is maimed, at least. It's great positioning from Jason, honestly.
When Bruce throws the batarang here, it is absolutely an emotionally desperate moment. He chooses the only option he seems to believe he has, and by all appearances one he probably wouldn't have done in a less desperate moment, or he would have done it way before halfway through the third count out of three.
The one potential angle to knock that gun away from Joker's head is exactly what Bruce does. He throws the batarang to ricochet off the pipe behind Jason's head, at a downwards angle (thereby getting past the raised shoulder behind it), to hit the barrel of the gun. And, to his credit, it does exactly what it needed to. The gun is knocked away from Joker's head. He lives, and Bruce gets around the ultimatum.
It also hits Jason's throat. In my opinion, I don't think that was ever the intention. It's a very narrow, precise angle to try and hit the gun wothout hitting Jason, with the wildness of a ricochet on top of that, and I don't think it's a shot that Bruce would have ever tried to make if he was in any less desperate of a situation. (Remember that in the panels of Jason counting, the side of his neck is only a couple inches over from the grip of the gun. There's room there, but it's a very narrow margin for error.)
The last panel is unfortunately drawn in a way that doesn't really make the sequence of events or the impact of the batarang clear. Taking the panel strictly at face value, it looks like the Joker lunged away and broke free before the batarang was even thrown, and then Jason was hit by the ricochet after he was already out of position. Obviously, that's not supposed to be what happened.
The actual sequence would be: Bruce throws the batarang, it hits the pipe and ricochets, it cuts the side of Jason's throat and hits the back of the gun, the gun and Jason's arm are knocked forward, and then Joker breaks free and dives away towards the same side the gun was on.
My conclusion is that hitting Jason's throat was an accident. Bruce throws the batarang in an emotional moment, taking a very risky shot, because the alternative is either killing his son or watching his son commit murder (or hurting him and still likely failing to stop him from committing murder). It's a bad option, but Jason very purposefully only gave him bad options so it's hard to blame him.
that is a very valid point you bring up when you look at the scene like that ! Honestly, it is very hard to analyze this scene properly just because of how many factors you need to count in so whenever someone disagrees with me, I honestly can't even blame them.
Despite this, I've been researching quite a bit as I was interested to recreate this scene in writing as well and wanted to look up potential ways to switch it up.
If we go with my point of the fact that the choice Bruce makes is incredibly reckless and while supposed to be a last, desperate attempt — it only is that because the writers didn't care to actually stop and think about what Bruce would do in any situation like this. There's been multiple situations just as stressful as this where he's been able to make sure to always take the safest route.
There's multiple ways he could disarm Jason in this scene without doing all that.
The most obvious one is to go for the arm holding the gun. There's several spots and nerves he can hit in his arm that would temporarily paralyze his fingers to prevent him firing the gun off. This is something a person like Bruce should be aware of because as a vigilante he needs to know each and every spot on the human body that allows him to incapacitate someone safely. Of course depending on how hard/what angle he hits these nerves at, it could either temporarily or permanently paralyze Jason's use of his arms — but let's be honest that is a way better outcome than bleeding to death from a neck wound your father brought upon you, no?
But again! I do realize that this is a very over-the-top analysis of the situation, so we can agree to disagree <3
Okay, look. Obviously you can think whatever you want at the end of the day, but what it looks like to me from both this answer and what you've said in replies is that all you really care about is Bruce being, in a word, infallible. And if all you want is Bruce the logical man who always makes the perfect call and always has a way out of every situation and does the perfect thing every single time, honestly this comic isn't for you. And yes, the UtRH movie is 'better.' For what you seem to want.
'He could just paralyze his arm' is a very weird refusal to engage with the context and point of this comic, imo. If that had been true, god, how boring and lame would that ending have been? Jason just gets defanged and lol, okay guess both those speeches just mean nothing and we're either back to fighting or we're done.
The UtRH movie actually, almost accidentally, points out pretty much the exact reason why something like this doesn't work as a narrative. In the movie, Bruce throws a batarang into the muzzle of the gun, it misfires, and Jason is crippled enough to lose his grip on Joker. Bruce 'wins,' sure. The plan works out great. That plan requires:
Bruce to turn his back on the entire situation, meaning that he has to completely believe that:
Jason will abandon the entire point of his speech, and the whole reason he's set this entire showdown up, to point the gun at Bruce instead so:
Bruce can throw the batarang into the gun, blocking the firing channel, which only works if:
Jason actually pulls the trigger, entirely planning on shooting Bruce.
Bruce wins. Yay. But to get there you have to believe that Jason has zero commitment to his own plan, zero follow through, and is so angry at Bruce not killing him(?) that he elects to kill Bruce instead. Because Bruce turning away is, by Jason's own speech, a decision. Bruce turning away should have resulted in Jason shooting Joker.
It's a good movie, I like it, but the ending to that scene is a step down from the comics, as far as I'm concerned.
Jason says 'you'll have to kill me to stop me', and we're meant to take that as fact. Believing anything else also requires believing that Jason has so massively underestimated Bruce that he doesn't see the huge flaw of 'just throw a straight shot batarang no big'. If you want to completely sacrifice Jason's competency and characterization to get an outcome of 'Bruce would never make a mistake' you can but like. At that point I have to assume you just think Jason's kind of stupid, honestly.
Joker himself literally says, "You found a way to win, and everybody still loses." That's the point of the comic. Everybody loses. A character being written as making a mistake isn't lazy writing for shock value. It's a tragedy because being a tragedy is the point of the story.
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this fucking quiz just told me i have a beige aura do i kill myself now or what
took another one and got CREAM???
@gayofficial quiz that makes you beige
Pre-Robin Jason Was Amazing
It’s no wonder Bruce wanted him for Robin. Check this shit out.
Now, we all know by now that Jason stole Batman’s tires… which takes some guts, come on.
Look at this ballsy little shit hit Batman with the tire iron.
But then, B sends him to this school in Crime Alley - Ma Gunn’s School for Boys (which is really just a front to train young criminals.)
Look at baby Jay kick some ass!
They have to get more boys to put him down!
But Jason doesn’t want to be a criminal. He only wants to survive, so he runs away from the school after hearing about their plan to steal from a museum.
Batman is not happy.
Check this out - Jason pulls Batman’s disappearing trick on him! I think that might be when Bruce decides he’s gonna adopt, really.
Then Jason saves his ass in the museum.
And seriously, after this next panel, how could he not adopt?
“…somebody had to stop it.”
And he freaking came in through the skylight? A kid after Bruce’s own heart.
Jason just wants to leave. He’s done what he thought was right.
But Bruce has another idea.
What a way to offer a kid a home, Bruce. I’m sure Alfred is thrilled.
In conclusion, Jason Todd was a badass well before he became Robin.