when stan has his first sexuality crisis at age 10 he writes a letter to john elway going
“dear john elway,
i think i might be gay. i don’t know what to do. please help?
love,
stan”
and he has absolutely zero memory of doing this until like a few years later he gets a signed photo of elway in the mail that’s just a picture of him throwing a football that says “follow your heart!” on it and stan is like “yeah……yeah i’ll follow my heart…………..” even though he doesn’t have a damn clue what the context of it was
actually, can you imagine if dave was raised by B1 roxy?
i wanna get into this actually
(ok i had to spend a few hours rewriting this because IT DIDNT FUCKING SAVE AFTER FIVE HOURS OF WRITING WHEN MY COMPUTER UPDATED WHILE I WAS AFK so it would mean a lot to show this post some appreciation. i LOVEEE hearing what other people have to say)
even though these things mom does are presented in an extravagant, kitsch, jokey way, her intentions always came from a place of sincerity. she is simply Funnie
but rose reads too far into it and assumes things that aren't there, that her mother is passive-aggressively feigning interest in rose's interests simply because the things she does are so extra. "why do all of this if not to mock me"
im telling you right now if dave lived in this household he wouldn't assume antagonism, he'd go,
don’t forget who LITERALLY patented tangible jpeg artifacts as their post-scratch adult self and scattered shitty scummed up statue of liberties all over the planet. theres no way some of that overboard artful shit wasnt post-ironic / circling back around to genuine funny sincerity
dave's natural state is funny sincerity like roxy. he's had the natural capacity for this type of humor from the start and this is the direction he goes towards when he grows out of his brother's shadow by the end of the comic. dave and roxy share an earnest “so bad its good” type of humor
(lots more under the cut; the length of this meta analysis just got unwieldly with all the pictures and whatnot)
despite the alcoholism, roxy is a supportive mother. she's not the ideal guardian but hells of a lot more supportive of her kid than bro is. if she knew dave's interests she would totally indulge in them with some over the top silly goofy haha shit as a genuine gesture simply because she loves him
rose isn't too keen on it though. but she is more similar to dirk in her natural state of thinking of overthinking shit and assuming the worst, like the tags said
and yes dave got the sweet cuddly yet sometimes backhanded ouppy gene from roxy, probably even moreso lol
roxy's even said rose "sounds like girl dirk"
side tangent here, but this is something i wanna talk about.
i dont think bro should ever be in custody of children ever but if theres anyone who would be up to the task it's rose probably. i know she'd be able to keep up with him. not only does she have a defined personality (dave is more malleable and absorbs his environment like a sponge), if anyone can pick apart B1 dirk's batshit brain and probably be right on the money it's her. lil cal has been pumping patriarchal nonsense into bro's head and rose would be able to bring the fucking facts to the table without losing her own and being a living example of a badass little girl. i also don't think bro would try to force masculine roles onto rose like he did with dave, seeing as she is a girl, so she would actually have more of a leg up and get some passes that dave was never afforded. and rose wouldn't stand idly and accept any bullshit; she is no doormat. and i think this would earn bro's respect
but anyway, from this, couldn't we conclude roxy "sounds like girl dave"?
yeah okay. we havent even gotten into their penchant for funny typos or misspeaks, deliberate or otherwise
so, dave's environment
the sentiment "god you hope you can be as good as your bro at this some day" might have been genuine at the time when he idolized bro but of course he's not able to express that in any sort of sincere fashion because he's in dirk's fucking household. and this level 10 irony shit isnt doing dave any favors
his role models were the Internet and a vague idea of what Bro was like. So he built up his facade based on irony–not the literary definition of irony, as Rose might be quick to point out, but a popular concept of irony based on the idea that things that didn’t make sense actually made sense in some roundabout way. As a master of irony, Dave probably reasoned, he could see in a way other people couldn’t why a world that was scary and didn’t make sense really did make sense, and could therefore convince those people that he was superior to them. And he would wield his knowledge to maintain the appearance of superiority by calling everything ironic and pretending he didn’t care about things that didn’t make sense, and he would use walls of vaguely rhyming words to keep everyone at arm’s length so they wouldn’t discover his insecurities
(source)
roxy's style is the embodiment of post-irony. being raised by mom lalonde would be like being raised by joel vinesauce ok
what can i say ….. (getting meta about this actually, hussie got these jpeg wizard wallpapers from a spyware website. link takes some time to load because internet archive)
rose is quick to read post-irony as actually being a joke/insincere, which in bro's case would be true. but i believe dave's natural instinct, outside of the influence of bro, is to read post-irony as genuine, which is exactly how mom serves it. we see this as early as act 3 from him; he understands her motives better than rose does herself:
and in act 6 intermission 2 i think it's pretty clear
but the thing is, it's always genuine from her. dave wouldn't have to second guess it because he's not one to naturally second guess someone's sincerity; that was learned due to his bro being virtually unassailable
there two types of ironies at play here:
seems like a joke, is actually genuine (roxy)
doesnt seem like a joke, is actually a joke (dirk)
you can make the argument that the second is is more psychologically destructive because it makes you question the reality of what is genuine sentiment and what isn't. dave never knew what was genuine and what was irony so he just sort of existed in this sincerity-ironic limbo and always did the opposite of what he genuinely felt on principle even if it always did originate from a genuine place.
"it just a joke bro i was just being ironic i dont actually x" is so much more trust-breaking and psychologically damaging than "wait are you being serious" / "i am being so fucking fr rn davy gravy" / "ok thats actually pretty fucking awesome. giant ass wizard statue" / "RIGHT"
how much about dave would change do you think? his character arc would be completely different for one thing, i think he'd have it good aside from mom's alcohol issues. he'd be left with the sweet and funny parts of him that we see at the end of the comic. the fake coolguy stuff is out, but this remains. this is dave in his element and we see it as early as act 1
he'd probably have no shades growing up in the lalonde residence* either cause those were given to him by bro straight out of the crater as an extension of his own cool image. and john gave dave ben stiller’s aviators for his 13th birthday to replace them so he could “spread his wings”
dave said he was wearing them for the ironies but i kind of doubt it. maybe post-irony but there was some reacharound to it being genuine because dave never put those pointy anime shades on his face again.
*though... it’s kind of hard to imagine him without his shades at all? B2 dave still got stiller’s shades from stiller himself so maybe getting them is a universal constant. i can imagine mom getting him them as a birthday gift cause shes pretty wealthy and probably could buy it out in an auction. but also itd be cool if john still gave him it as a gift
dave is actually a lot more genuine and easy to read than he lets on even when grappling with his upbringing with B1 dirk (again, see this post). this can be seen all throughout he comic but a good example is the evolution of thoughts about his interest in the preserved dead things in his room:
if B1 roxy was dave's guardian he probably WOULD have pursued paleontology because she wouldve indulged him in it and probably find it cool and worthwhile to pursue, instead of allowing dave to flounder under ironic detachment, being poisoned by irony to the point of gaslighting himself into believing he doesnt actually believe he thinks this shit is cool.
even if it was indulged in this such a way; a superficially kitsch and ironic appearing presentation, it comes from a genuine place and inspires genuine interest. just read the comments.
basically, i think if B1 roxy raised dave, their relationship would have a surface level appearance of being bizarre or over-the-top but they’d have an unsaid mutual understanding that it’s completely in earnest and just build on each other's funny and absurd gestures of affection. rather than seeing it as one-upping each other, it'd more like collaboration of some silly bullshit that you take a step back and look at full and just say, "fucking incredible"
speaking of paleontology, mom had the proto-ectobiology lab. maybe they'd be able to use the equipment to appearify paradox ghost imprints of the dead shit to create paradox clones of things from the cambrian era??? sounds like a fun mother son bonding activity. and theyd actually put the sciencey shit in the household to use
oh god i know exactly the kinds of music shed listen too also growing up as a teen in the 80s. she on that (post)-punk/art rock/new wave/new romantic mtv stuff. XTC shit fr. this is a B-52S HOUSEHOLD. maybe the associates for the campy melodramatic flair. so he gets to keep the record on his shirt cause he is an enjoyer of the shit in her vinyl collection. dave would still gravitate towards musical expression and music itself but of more variety outside of just rap, with an 80s-90s, even 70s flavor due to mom’s influence. see this for perhaps a glimpse. she probably visited new york city a lot for business trips and because the music scene was cool as hell around that time, imports came straight from jfk airport, she probably got in on that a bit and have remnants in the form of vinyls and cassettes. in this way she could be distributing void to dave (influencing him with forgotten / presently irrelevant music). now he can REALLY rave about bands none of his friends have heard of. “hey davy grvay watcha listenin to” (he holds up vinyl cover) “omg snakefinger”
im not exaggerating when this is one of the best additions ive gotten on any post, EVER, in my over 10+ years of being on this site
#Dave Lalonde would know what conditioner is and bathe regularly therefore unlocking The Curl
#meanwhile Rose Strider would go full daddy's little princess #she would straight up kill that clown at her 5th birthday and then at her next one Bro would get 6 clowns and set up a fencing tournament #fully by the book the clowns are wearing full plain white fencing uniforms with red noses badly safety clipped to the face guards. #otherwise unidentifiable as clowns #but she knows. #the bloodlust remains.
#rather than a pallet of cinderblocks Bro would deck out her room with a knockoff disney princess theme #like Mom Lalonde's secret bedroom in the ectobiology lab #but worse #the giant princess doll would still be gifted but it's lovingly handstitched and has emo makeup #as a joke that he knows she would want to Fix it but look he knows that so now she Cant so she has to figure out what would be a creative #yet ironic response #she of course is given unrestricted credit card access for their gift giving battles
#in response to the fridge being filled with swords she gets an umbrella storage rack and puts that in the fridge #in steal of course #so they don't fall out at unsuspecting snackers #Bro adds some katana handled umbrellas and hooks a convenience store display of rain ponchos to the side #(meanwhile its still in the fridge) #so Rose makes a detailed 1950s style gelatin mold salad #she sets it on the counter next to the fridge under an oversized silver serving dish with a note about how she expects feedback #on her attempt to confirm to traditional femininity #the mold isnt set #its just a pile of sticky room tempature hard boiled eggs and cocktail sausages covered in lime jello #Bro diligently writes a review with pictures and posts in on a website he created and populated with comment bots for when this happens #the sites titled something like Puppet Princess's Piquant Plates and his reviews are in character as smuppet parodies of historical figures #rose buys 2 pairs of traditional Yellow rainboots and places them by the door #Bro is courteous and moves the fridge katana stand to by the boots. #he then perfects the salad recipe before Rose gets a chance and writes a terrible review of it in the voice of smuppet Tutankhamun #Rose is losing the irony battle but now the fridge has food in it again.
LOVE the people who havnt seen saw and think it’s about haunted puppet murders like no that’s billy he’s just a little fella <3 the real killer is grampa cunt and his gang of evil milfs
Alright kitten listen up cause mommy needs your help here okay. Pause the game, ok-PAUSE the game for mommy okay I need your eyes up here, kitten. I'm putting these onions in this pan okay and im gonna walk out the door yes, that's right mommy's gotta go right now mommy's gotta go for 8 hours but she needs these onions caramelized by the time she gets bac-STOP LOOKING AT THE COMPUTER mommy needs you to caramelized these onions for her okay kitten mommy needs all 5 pounds perfectly caramelized and cooked down till they're all evenly brown and sweet and YES it does need to take the whole 8 hours mommy needs you to babysit these fucking carmies okay kitten I SAID TURN THE FUCKING GAME OFF
meteorstuck, 14 yr old Rose tells Dave Kanaya is buff as fuck and when she shows him, it’s just that her arms are a little bulkier than usual like how a bunch of 12 year old middle school girls will sigh at the skinny sickly emo kid
