Dissociative Awareness

This page is intended to house information about dissociation (and related disorders, especially Dissociative Identity Disorder). We will likely engage in some discourse and dish out a lot of opinions that should be taken with a grain of salt (opinions =/= fact). We are always learning and do not know everything.Remember to think for yourself(ves) and seek high-quality research and empirical data!We may also discuss our personal experiences with dissociation, trauma, and navigating the psych and medical system as a neuroatypical person. Some of this content may be triggering. If you see something that you would like tagged, please let us know. Feel free to ask questions, or submit info that may be helpful to the page.Obvious trolls will be obviously ignored. Please Note: We welcome systems who don't report trauma-history or identify as natural or endogenic! Please be aware that we follow the theory of structural dissociation (the existence of multiple self-states from birth) and consider DID/OSDD to be developmental disorders caused by trauma. We also recognize that everyone has trauma because trauma is any severe stressor that overwhelms a person's ability to cope. We view dissociation as a normal, physiological response to stressors like fight or flight - Dissociative Disorders are when these become intrusive, impairing, disordered, and/or distressing. Please remember that dissociation does not mean DID/OSDD-1. There are several dissociative disorders, the most common are Depersonalization & Derealization. Disclaimer: We are not a doctor nor a licensed psychologist and we cannot diagnose you. Any advice is given as peer-support only. If you are experiencing symptoms that are distressing or interfering with your life, we highly suggest talking to a psychologist.

[dissociationawareness]

TW: CSA/SA & Suicide... Lots of talk about sex, masturbation, orgasms... cus someone has to say this and I have NOTHING to lose. You can hate me, I don't care because I will never see it... but know that your judgment can hurt survivors that are afraid to say it. I KNOW I'm not the only one. None of us are totally alone with ANYTHING. There's always another person who understands. Please know that. You are not alone, you are not bad... it's ok that you think/fantasize about things that are taboo. I hope that you will see this and know for sure that you're not alone and it doesn't make you a bad person. You are not filthy. You have not been ruined for finding a way to cope, or because you experience this. --- kinks are super common and victimhood kinks are so fucking common it's ridiculous.... we're all just scared of being judged.

There's no need to out yourself. This is simply, hopefully, to help people understand... and to let you see someone say it publicly so you can simply know that it doesn't make you bad and that there are other people going through this shit, feeling ashamed of it, wishing they could not be like this... or whatever other negative things this may make you feel. YOU ARE OK. YOU DO NOT DESERVE TO BE HARMED. YOU ARE NOT A PREDATOR. YOU ARE NOT A BAD PERSON. WE ALL DEAL WITH SEXUAL TRAUMA IN DIFFERENT WAYS AND THAT'S OK... just some people have been so PROGRAMMED that they can't see they're wrong. Don't bother yourself with them - they don't understand and never will because they never found this as a way to cope... Which I cannot stress enough: IT'S EXTREMELY COMMON. My therapist has echoed how common this is amongst survivors and it has literally no connection to being an abuser. Sometimes brains do weird shit, especially for kids who have limited ability to cope and process things like sexual abuse that they literally cannot understand.

I'm so sorry.

I came back just to leave.

I owe you an explanation, maybe?

It shocks me that they're not saving me...

maybe they feel like I do.

Oliver keeps showing up and he's so sad... like the trauma from the gynecologist who hurt us brought the trauma of childhood rushing back. We haven't been hurt like that by a woman since we were his age (3).

I think we're too broken. Indeed, we can't be saved.

If you want the long explanation... I'd like to direct you to ghostsneverleave which is our main account.

I just need people to understand that we're not ignoring them should they send in an ask (I mean no one has, so I'm probably just being an asshole).

Don't we all want to tell our stories? Maybe I just want people to really recognize that women commit CSA and on "girls" (ie folks with vaginas) too.

And since I won't be here to deal with the backslash... and since I've taken to bring brave and saying controversial things to try to make people understand that a lot of folks are making assumptions about kink shit (and genuinely, fuck the kink community for being full of covert abusers and bigots --- genuinely, if you really want to do weird shit with people who actually consent and want to try it then good on you and I support you, no kink shaming here even if I don't like the kink... just bad people ruin it by using kink as a cover for abuse)...

As I said before, I was into kink as a literal child. The earliest I remember was probably around 3-4th grade... definitely 10yo. I have never been able to climax without thinking about non-con. I once had someone try to tell me I'm a pedo because some folks in the system like loli (drawn porn depicting what might as well be kids - though there are LITERAL adults who look like that --- if you are not triggered by this shit, look up "Kitty Jung" who is an actress who did porn for a short period of time, she started porn (I think?) at 21 but I think her last films made her pretty uncomfortable and she quit (good for her)). I have seen literal child porn once on a website and it was EXTREMELY triggering and I reported it directly to the FBI and never went back to that website. I reported a pedo once and broke about it (post about it earlier).

I am NOT a pedo... but I found sexuality through assault and I CANNOT separate that from sexuality in my brain. I have been assaulted multiple times as a child, teen, and an abusive marriage as an adult.

I try to be understanding, and I recognize sexuality isn't necessarily a thing people have any control over (if it was, I'd have sexual attraction to any of my many suitors). HOWEVER, pedophilia is inherently predatory and while I'm totally ok with people consuming FICTIONAL content that depicts that... I'd love to put a bullet into anyone's head who abuses kids.

I could be much MUCH healthier in the head of adults didn't abuse me as a child. I think even the assaults as a teen would have been easier if it didn't trigger all the shit from our childhood.

I once tried to talk about it but my problem is that I consume drawn content like that because it's still what my brain defaults to to climax... specifically being a victim.

I fucking hate it. I think about it when my husband and I have sex or else I literally can't. I get off on powerlessness because it's how I understood that as a child. I remember doing things to my body that a child who was never abused wouldn't ever think to do. I remember being into this at a very young age. It disgusted my mother because I became hypersexual (which is so ironic because I'm also sex-repulsed depending on how safe and triggered I feel).

I want people to understand that survivors consume this content. I want people to understand that abused kids do indeed fantasize about this shit.

It IS NOT because people want to be hurt like that - that's a common misunderstanding. It's NOT because people are pedophiles - survivors who deal with this often are so ashamed that they're driven to self-harm and suicide over it (I'm not even remotely the only one that's hurt themselves during or after because they're so ashamed that there can't experience physical pleasure without thinking about fucked up shit, possibly LITERALLY things they've been through and wish never happened... I've had little IRL convos with close friends who admitted they've gone to kink that mirrors their traumas... none of us really seem to get exactly why we do it, and pretty much all of us hide it from folks unless someone is brave enough to say it (and I admitted to fucked up kinks while drunk, which is what led me to finding out two friends had traumas that led to kinks because abuse fucked up their brains in exactly this way).

The thing is that the parts of the brain that process pleasure and fear are literally right up next to each other and this is probably why this shit happens.

I have never and will never be attracted to kids. The closest I've come to sexual attraction is my husband... and I've genuinely wanted to have sex with him ONCE... the rest of our sex life was about bonding but having a skin condition ruined that because the pain is so fucking triggering in the worst way.

I wish I could erase it... but I cannot remember a time that I didn't have a non-con kink.

I tried once to masturbate to the idea of consensual sex (literally, once... cus I realized it's totally fucked that victimhood is the only thing I can orgasm to - I think because sexual stuff is so shameful in my brain that non-con allows me to give in... but I've NEVER genuinely enjoyed being assaulted... it's so different doing consensual kink and actually being raped!)... and I had a total meltdown afterwards. And I never did again because ashamed (I guess) is better than crying for an hour?

Like... That sounds completely ridiculous to me and I don't even get it... I just know it is what it is.

Hate me all you want. By the time this posts, I am no longer here so you're words won't hurt me. Your judgment is doesn't matter.

You can make the choice to refuse to understand that some folks are like this and are neither pedophiles nor predators, that victimhood is a legitimate kink that's largely experienced by people who have been victims...

If you just want to hurt people thinking it will heal you... whatever... but it won't heal you. Hurting people and attacking people doesn't create healing... processing the shit and accepting that you're not bad because bad shit happened or because you cope in ways that are kinda fucked up is what creates healing.

We all need to love ourselves. We all need to know that if we aren't harming people (inc ourselves) whatever we do to heal is ok. Brains are weird and not all of how we cope and process is going to be something people are actually ok with... but they don't have to be.

It's about your healing. It absolutely is not about what other people think about it.

If you harm no one, you are fine. Sometimes we can even convince ourselves that we did when we didn't really, or we didn't do anything that actually scars someone (love opens us up to pain, you can't have one without the other --- we can do our best to not hurt anyone but everyone has feelings and none of us are perfect or pure --- what you do in private or in your head that literally involves no real, living person harms no one - YOU ARE OK, IT'S OK TO EXIST, IT'S OK TO COPE, IT'S OK TO FANTASIZE... THOUGHT CRIMES AREN'T REAL).

But whatever to the folks who just want an "enemy' they can hurt hoping it will heal them and give them back their power. You won't find that in hurting people who haven't hurt anyone and indeed are already hurting for the same reason you are.

All you'll find is more hurt.

We all need to try to understand each other more.

Trauma does weird shit to our brains and we are not bad for it, especially those of us who have been doing it since we were kids because the child brain simply couldn't find another way to cope.

Those who are ashamed and suffering because this is all they knew and as teens and adults couldn't erase it... I wish I could just hug you and tell you that you're ok.

I know it hurts so bad. I know that at times you think you're just as bad as the people who hurt you... like they poisoned you, like it's contagious and you're bad and going to make people worse. I know you suffer for it. I know you wish you could erase it. I know you are scared shitless because you can't.

But you are ok. You've done nothing wrong. You ARE NOT your abusers. You are just another person trying to survive through the shit that hurt you. Some folks might disagree but those of us who are in that pit with you, dealing with it like you are, hiding it like you are... we know that you are just another survivor that had no idea how else to cope and that it's exactly the opposite of willful.

You didn't hurt anyone. You are worthy of love, live, health, happiness, and respect.

The haters are just ignorant and desperately clutching their ignorance (ie they're bigots, cus that's literally what bigotry is - holding onto ignorance regardless of data to the contrary).

The only people who should be ashamed are the people who hurt you.

[dissociationawareness]

A New Model of Dissociative Identity Disorder by Paul F. Dell, PhD

For the first article that I submit to this page, I wanted it to be Paul F. Dell’s work on DID. Mostly because to date, he is my favorite research psychologist doing work on DID. I found his work to be rather thorough and really accurate comparatively to the DSM’s criteria and the current vision of DID that people seem to have.

This specific article outlines P. Dell’s suggestions for the DSM 5 (which is now out - and his research was completely ignored). Of course, his research proves pretty much the opposite of what we’ve been saying DID is for at least the last 40 years.

“Awareness of the presence of other personalities has been widely reported in the empirical literature on DID. Such awareness is a common occurrence in DID. Moreover, many patients who have DID hear or see what some personalities say or do when they are ‘‘out.’’ Many clinicians have incorrectly assumed that a person who has DID can never be aware of the activities of another personality.

[…]

With the exception of amnesia, dissociative individuals have contemporaneous, conscious awareness of all other dissociative intrusions (eg, depersonalization, derealization, voices, intrusive thoughts, ‘‘made’’ actions). Thus, with the exception of amnesia, all dissociative events are partially conscious. A major shortcoming of the DSM-IV is encountered here. DSM-IV’s classic picture of DID embraces full dissociation (ie, amnesia), but omits partial dissociation. This omission is a problem because incidents of partial dissociation are vastly more common than incidents of switching-accompanied-by-amnesia.”

Basically, what he’s saying is that most people with DID have some awareness of the actions of their alters - and that this has been proven time and time again — but the people who put together the DSM are purposely ignoring this fact, which results in people who would properly be diagnosed DID often ending up with a diagnosis of DDNOS. P. Dell found that most people with DID are rather partially dissociated (essentially just ‘zoned out’/disconnected) when they switch, rather than fully amnesic.

This is especially important to note, as the entire ideal of DID that has been put out by the media and popular culture is one of complete amnesia and a total lack of knowledge of being DID, which is not even remotely the truth - in fact is so not the truth, that it’s been proven time and time again that most multiples have some awareness of their others. (This of course does not mean that there’s never amnesia, obviously, or that all people with DID are fully aware of their others… but that this vision of always being amnesic and never being aware us so incredibly wrong and unfounded by empirical evidence.)

Furthermore, P. Dell suggested a complete overhaul of the diagnostic criteria of DID.

The subjective/phenomenological model of Dissociative Identity Disorder

General dissociative symptoms (4 of 6 required) Memory problems Depersonalization Derealization Posttraumatic flashbacks Somatoform symptoms Trance

Evidence of the partially dissociated intrusions of another self-state,as indicated by either 1 or 2: 1. Clinician observation of a self-state that claims (or appears) to be someone other than the person being interviewed, as indicated by the person’s Co-conscious awareness of the activities of the self-state; and Remembering what the self-state said and did Experiencing the self-state as ‘‘other.’’ 2. At least 6 of the following 11 symptoms of intrusion by a partially dissociated self-state: Child voices Internal struggle, conversation, or argument Persecutory voices that comment harshly, make threats, or command self-destructive acts Speech insertion (unintentional or disowned utterances) Thought insertion or withdrawal ‘‘Made’’ or intrusive feelings and emotions ‘‘Made’’ or intrusive impulses ‘‘Made’’ or intrusive actions Temporary loss of well-rehearsed knowledge or skills Disconcerting experiences of self-alteration Self-puzzlement

Evidence of the fully dissociated intrusions of another self-state(ie, amnesia), as indicated by either 1 or 2: 1. Clinician observation of a self-state that claims (or seems) to be someone other than the person being interviewed, followed by the person’s subsequent amnesia for the clinician’s encounter with the self-state. 2. Recurrent amnesia, as indicated by the person’s report of multiple incidents of at least two of the following: Time loss ‘‘Coming to’’ Fugues Being told of disremembered actions Finding objects among one’s possessions Finding evidence of one’s recent actions

The sad thing about this criteria is that P. Dell found it to be more accurate than the previous criteria for diagnosing DID… but the DSM 5 acknowledged none of his suggested changes - even though it was as accurate as the MID for diagnosing DID (the MID (Multidemensional Inventory of Dissociation) is list of questions intended to figure out where people fall on the dissociative scale). ((Note: The MID questions are available online, but they require a special Excel spreadsheet to score - which can only be obtained by psychologists by ordering it from the psychologist who created it. Sad day.))

In conclusion:

The sociocognitive model of DID is necessarily wed to the DSM-IV’s model of classic DID. Why? Because the general culture’s model of DID is classic DID. Classic DID is clearly reflected in Sybil. Classic DID has also been reflected in countless portrayals of DID in contemporary films and television programs. In short, the DSM-IV’s essential phenomena of classic DID (ie, multiple personalities + switching + amnesia) are very familiar to the general culture. Although not intended as such, the present findings refute the sociocognitive model of DID because 15 of the 23 subjective dissociative symptoms that were measured (the criterion A symptoms except for trance and the criterion B symptoms except for self-alteration) are invisible (ie, completely experiential), unknown to the media, unknown to the general public, and largely unknown to the mental health field. Nevertheless, these 15 subjective dissociative symptoms occurred in 83% to 95% of persons who had DID. The pervasive presence of these symptoms cannot be explained (away) by the sociocognitive model’s ‘‘usual suspects’’ - therapist cueing, media influences, and sociocultural expectations regarding the clinical features of DID. There can be no therapist cueing, media influences, or sociocultural expectations about dissociative symptoms that are invisible, unknown to the media, unknown to the culture, and largely unknown to the mental health field.

Basically what this is saying is that what we’ve been taught about DID is wrong - that it’s been modeled after Sybyl’s story (which, as we know, was highly inaccurate and exaggerated for entertainment value) - and that many of the symptoms P. Dell found to be common amongst people with DID can not be explained by social/media influence, or even caused by the therapist - as most people are COMPLETELY UNAWARE OF IT.

So basically, every time someone says “you’re DID because you have the internet” or “because you saw Sybyl”, they’re completely wrong - as the symptoms of DID, many of which are not noted in the DSM or in popular media are unknown to the general public, including psychologists.

I just wanted to list the most important parts of the article (or rather, what I thought was important for this page). As much of it is information from studies that Dell has done, the language of the article is a little clinical and dry. I really didn’t want to make anyone read that if they didn’t want to. You are welcome to read the actual article (it is here: http://www.copingwithdissociation.com/Dell_2006_ANewModelofDID1.pdf#bib1), and if you want to know more about Paul Dell, here is his website: http://understandingdissociation.com/

[m7m3l0d7]

This is really interesting, could someone explain the “made” thoughts and actions, etc? I understand the intrusive part im just a little confused about what exactly “made” is referring to, cause I’ve been dealing with depersonalization/derealization for years and have wondered if my experiences constitute DID or just DDNOS

[dissociationawareness]

Made thoughts and actions are thoughts or actions that the person feels disconnected from - like they didn’t “make” them (ie had no control over).

Basically these are part of co-con experiences, where more than one other is fronting. A person might hear their other internally as if they’re thinking inside the same brain. Conversely, they might watch their body do a thing without them feeling like they have control or even experiencing a sense of numbness or disconnect (ie “run away balloon” or viewing themselves from above kinda feelings).

I personally have OCD as well and all I can really say is that intrusive thoughts from OCD feel different from things others say inside. The best way I could explain it (and other people probably experience it differently) is that OCD intrusive thoughts feel like a gunshot, like they come into my brain really quick and really loud. Hearing my others internally is kinda smoother, like someone talking to me except with my own brain. Sharing memories also tends to pull me (a la, reliving) where as visual intrusive thoughts are still that kinda gunshot feeling like someone shoved a video in my face.

I have no idea if that makes sense. I’m sure that the distinction between how the two feel is less important (at least for the purposes of just taking stock rather than real-life diagnostics) than the feeling of not having control over the thoughts and actions, thus why the word “intrusive” is used along with “made”… since they’re both attempting to describe things that the person does not feel ownership or control over having done/thought.

I would note that concerning actions, an other taking control during co-con feels a hell of a lot like being possessed or having an alien hand (esp when someone decides to just use one part of the body… it’s really weird), where as (OCD) compulsive actions feel a lot more like breaking a seal (ie I want to do the thing, I can control whether I do the thing, so I gave in to the intense urge to do the thing)… which would maybe make others actions kinda a bit more like Tourette’s than OCD (albeit it’s not uncommon to have both Tourette’s and OCD… at which point parsing that from DID would probably need some of that internal/experiential/subjective data… a la “why not what”).

[m7m3l0d7]

Thank you, that makes sense! The distinction between intrusive thoughts from OCD vs DID was helpful because I do experience obsessions/compulsions and CPTSD so I know what you mean by the gunshot feeling. I don’t know how to describe it but I feel like I get lost in my head thinking about things and don’t really consciously know what I’m thinking about and then I’ll snap back into focus and realize I don’t remember the last 10 minutes of thinking or what I just did physically. I can usually remember or figure out what I was doing if I think about it but it feels like I’m telling myself more than remembering? I also struggle with memory in general, and can’t picture things so when I try to remember something it’s hard to tell if it’s real or just a script of what I’ve said happened before if that makes sense. Like I can remember describing something that happened more than I can remember it happening.

It’s like I can check out and still go about my day without being there fully. I’m always somewhat aware but when I speak I’m not saying what I’m thinking, often times I don’t know what I’m saying until I say it or other times I don’t know what I’m thinking while I’m talking? And sometimes when I relax I’ll stop being able to recognize my close friends and surroundings :/

[dissociationawareness]

I totally understand what you're talking about. Co-con is weird af at times. Sometimes it's also just like... floating.... like it feels so effortless and when stress is high it is such a relief. It can also be scary when one is attached to control (I totally am, maybe that's why I have OCD... and it can be terrifying feeling like your body is on automatic and not knowing what they'll do, worrying they'll do something you don't want them to do and feeling entirely powerless).

I feel you and I totally wish I didn't. Sometimes I get stressed out and it's like a flip switches and I'm just there in the body floating, but someone else is driving and I have no idea what "I" will do, what I'll say... sometimes I feel thoughtless, like blank, in the wave of them... and when it's ok and I want relief I really like it because I can't feel the effort or like... the way the muscles move... it's (forgive me) like being high, like really high as fuck because it's just... I'm not there anymore than just observing.

Frankly, the only dissociative symptom that scares me really IF I know who's at the wheel is the "run-away balloon" (feeling like you're just quickly floating out of the body, like a balloon someone let to of and you're just going into the sky but you can still see what's happening? Like literally no control kinda... it's almost like when they do those movie shots where it looks like the background is moving away but the subject is moving towards the camera??? Idek how to really explain that feeling).... It's SO disorienting and I'd feel like a POTS attack (aka lightheaded, about to faint) if it weren't so detached but also weirdly aware the body is OK.

Idek if the feeling is actually from anxiety (cus I've felt similar things from social anxiety) or JUST the dissociation... I just know that everytime I've felt like that I've been anxious and start feeling kinda an out-of-control detached.

Kinda wish I could put a singlet in my body when it happens so I could see how they feel about it...

but that's like having a chronic illness and wondering if it really hurts as bad as it does or if you're imagining it.

I have no doubt it's real and it's really like that... it's just so... like my brain knows it shouldn't be like that because it's just so odd that the only way I can really process it is within a concept of un-reality.

[the-indigo-symphony]

Might be edging close to syscourse with this post, but I find it rather unfortunate that feeling positive or just not feeling much of anything at all when it comes to gaining new headmates is seen as "unhealthy" at best and "fetishizing DID" at worst. Like, my dude, this is just my way of making my new system members feel welcome; I wouldn't say it's "unhealthy" of me to take steps and hold viewpoints that help me achieve functional multiplicity. And I think it's rather rude to say the way I accept my polyfragmented DID – and the fact that it comes with having/gaining lots of system members – is "fetishizing DID." What's next? You gonna tell me that because I've accepted my ADHD and the way I'm easily distracted/forgetful, I'm "fetishizing ADHD"? Must I publicly languish and declare my hatred for myself and my life every time I lose track of time for you to not see me as a faker?

It's just ridiculous, in my opinion. "Unhealthy" my ass – refusing to hate myself for parts of my life that aren't going away any time soon is the healthiest thing I've ever done.

[dissociationawareness]

A New Model of Dissociative Identity Disorder by Paul F. Dell, PhD

For the first article that I submit to this page, I wanted it to be Paul F. Dell’s work on DID. Mostly because to date, he is my favorite research psychologist doing work on DID. I found his work to be rather thorough and really accurate comparatively to the DSM’s criteria and the current vision of DID that people seem to have.

This specific article outlines P. Dell’s suggestions for the DSM 5 (which is now out - and his research was completely ignored). Of course, his research proves pretty much the opposite of what we’ve been saying DID is for at least the last 40 years.

“Awareness of the presence of other personalities has been widely reported in the empirical literature on DID. Such awareness is a common occurrence in DID. Moreover, many patients who have DID hear or see what some personalities say or do when they are ‘‘out.’’ Many clinicians have incorrectly assumed that a person who has DID can never be aware of the activities of another personality.

[…]

With the exception of amnesia, dissociative individuals have contemporaneous, conscious awareness of all other dissociative intrusions (eg, depersonalization, derealization, voices, intrusive thoughts, ‘‘made’’ actions). Thus, with the exception of amnesia, all dissociative events are partially conscious. A major shortcoming of the DSM-IV is encountered here. DSM-IV’s classic picture of DID embraces full dissociation (ie, amnesia), but omits partial dissociation. This omission is a problem because incidents of partial dissociation are vastly more common than incidents of switching-accompanied-by-amnesia.”

Basically, what he’s saying is that most people with DID have some awareness of the actions of their alters - and that this has been proven time and time again — but the people who put together the DSM are purposely ignoring this fact, which results in people who would properly be diagnosed DID often ending up with a diagnosis of DDNOS. P. Dell found that most people with DID are rather partially dissociated (essentially just ‘zoned out’/disconnected) when they switch, rather than fully amnesic.

This is especially important to note, as the entire ideal of DID that has been put out by the media and popular culture is one of complete amnesia and a total lack of knowledge of being DID, which is not even remotely the truth - in fact is so not the truth, that it’s been proven time and time again that most multiples have some awareness of their others. (This of course does not mean that there’s never amnesia, obviously, or that all people with DID are fully aware of their others… but that this vision of always being amnesic and never being aware us so incredibly wrong and unfounded by empirical evidence.)

Furthermore, P. Dell suggested a complete overhaul of the diagnostic criteria of DID.

The subjective/phenomenological model of Dissociative Identity Disorder

General dissociative symptoms (4 of 6 required) Memory problems Depersonalization Derealization Posttraumatic flashbacks Somatoform symptoms Trance

Evidence of the partially dissociated intrusions of another self-state,as indicated by either 1 or 2: 1. Clinician observation of a self-state that claims (or appears) to be someone other than the person being interviewed, as indicated by the person’s Co-conscious awareness of the activities of the self-state; and Remembering what the self-state said and did Experiencing the self-state as ‘‘other.’’ 2. At least 6 of the following 11 symptoms of intrusion by a partially dissociated self-state: Child voices Internal struggle, conversation, or argument Persecutory voices that comment harshly, make threats, or command self-destructive acts Speech insertion (unintentional or disowned utterances) Thought insertion or withdrawal ‘‘Made’’ or intrusive feelings and emotions ‘‘Made’’ or intrusive impulses ‘‘Made’’ or intrusive actions Temporary loss of well-rehearsed knowledge or skills Disconcerting experiences of self-alteration Self-puzzlement

Evidence of the fully dissociated intrusions of another self-state(ie, amnesia), as indicated by either 1 or 2: 1. Clinician observation of a self-state that claims (or seems) to be someone other than the person being interviewed, followed by the person’s subsequent amnesia for the clinician’s encounter with the self-state. 2. Recurrent amnesia, as indicated by the person’s report of multiple incidents of at least two of the following: Time loss ‘‘Coming to’’ Fugues Being told of disremembered actions Finding objects among one’s possessions Finding evidence of one’s recent actions

The sad thing about this criteria is that P. Dell found it to be more accurate than the previous criteria for diagnosing DID… but the DSM 5 acknowledged none of his suggested changes - even though it was as accurate as the MID for diagnosing DID (the MID (Multidemensional Inventory of Dissociation) is list of questions intended to figure out where people fall on the dissociative scale). ((Note: The MID questions are available online, but they require a special Excel spreadsheet to score - which can only be obtained by psychologists by ordering it from the psychologist who created it. Sad day.))

In conclusion:

The sociocognitive model of DID is necessarily wed to the DSM-IV’s model of classic DID. Why? Because the general culture’s model of DID is classic DID. Classic DID is clearly reflected in Sybil. Classic DID has also been reflected in countless portrayals of DID in contemporary films and television programs. In short, the DSM-IV’s essential phenomena of classic DID (ie, multiple personalities + switching + amnesia) are very familiar to the general culture. Although not intended as such, the present findings refute the sociocognitive model of DID because 15 of the 23 subjective dissociative symptoms that were measured (the criterion A symptoms except for trance and the criterion B symptoms except for self-alteration) are invisible (ie, completely experiential), unknown to the media, unknown to the general public, and largely unknown to the mental health field. Nevertheless, these 15 subjective dissociative symptoms occurred in 83% to 95% of persons who had DID. The pervasive presence of these symptoms cannot be explained (away) by the sociocognitive model’s ‘‘usual suspects’’ - therapist cueing, media influences, and sociocultural expectations regarding the clinical features of DID. There can be no therapist cueing, media influences, or sociocultural expectations about dissociative symptoms that are invisible, unknown to the media, unknown to the culture, and largely unknown to the mental health field.

Basically what this is saying is that what we’ve been taught about DID is wrong - that it’s been modeled after Sybyl’s story (which, as we know, was highly inaccurate and exaggerated for entertainment value) - and that many of the symptoms P. Dell found to be common amongst people with DID can not be explained by social/media influence, or even caused by the therapist - as most people are COMPLETELY UNAWARE OF IT.

So basically, every time someone says “you’re DID because you have the internet” or “because you saw Sybyl”, they’re completely wrong - as the symptoms of DID, many of which are not noted in the DSM or in popular media are unknown to the general public, including psychologists.

I just wanted to list the most important parts of the article (or rather, what I thought was important for this page). As much of it is information from studies that Dell has done, the language of the article is a little clinical and dry. I really didn’t want to make anyone read that if they didn’t want to. You are welcome to read the actual article (it is here: http://www.copingwithdissociation.com/Dell_2006_ANewModelofDID1.pdf#bib1), and if you want to know more about Paul Dell, here is his website: http://understandingdissociation.com/

[m7m3l0d7]

This is really interesting, could someone explain the “made” thoughts and actions, etc? I understand the intrusive part im just a little confused about what exactly “made” is referring to, cause I’ve been dealing with depersonalization/derealization for years and have wondered if my experiences constitute DID or just DDNOS

[dissociationawareness]

Made thoughts and actions are thoughts or actions that the person feels disconnected from - like they didn't "make" them (ie had no control over).

Basically these are part of co-con experiences, where more than one other is fronting. A person might hear their other internally as if they're thinking inside the same brain. Conversely, they might watch their body do a thing without them feeling like they have control or even experiencing a sense of numbness or disconnect (ie "run away balloon" or viewing themselves from above kinda feelings).

I personally have OCD as well and all I can really say is that intrusive thoughts from OCD feel different from things others say inside. The best way I could explain it (and other people probably experience it differently) is that OCD intrusive thoughts feel like a gunshot, like they come into my brain really quick and really loud. Hearing my others internally is kinda smoother, like someone talking to me except with my own brain. Sharing memories also tends to pull me (a la, reliving) where as visual intrusive thoughts are still that kinda gunshot feeling like someone shoved a video in my face.

I have no idea if that makes sense. I'm sure that the distinction between how the two feel is less important (at least for the purposes of just taking stock rather than real-life diagnostics) than the feeling of not having control over the thoughts and actions, thus why the word "intrusive" is used along with "made"... since they're both attempting to describe things that the person does not feel ownership or control over having done/thought.

I would note that concerning actions, an other taking control during co-con feels a hell of a lot like being possessed or having an alien hand (esp when someone decides to just use one part of the body... it's really weird), where as (OCD) compulsive actions feel a lot more like breaking a seal (ie I want to do the thing, I can control whether I do the thing, so I gave in to the intense urge to do the thing)... which would maybe make others actions kinda a bit more like Tourette's than OCD (albeit it's not uncommon to have both Tourette's and OCD... at which point parsing that from DID would probably need some of that internal/experiential/subjective data... a la "why not what").

[dissociationawareness]

The irony for me is that all throughout our childhood and teens we were written off as dramatic and attention seeking because we had outbursts of intense emotions, but since at least fourth grade I remember recognizing that I was stuffing my feelings and that resulted in them exploding.

The reality is that I repressed a lot, I ignored a lot, and I belittled myself a lot. When someone told me to calm down or that I was being dramatic, I did exactly what they wanted: I shut down. It never stopped the feelings, it pushed them out of view for their comfort.

Still to this day, people take my emotions as childish and over-the-top when they're negative, and still to this day I keep them out of view of people as much as possible... but they still creep out, and when they do they're nearly the sum of how much I've stuffed.

The irony of this is that I've found only one way to keep them under control: letting them out in controlled bursts, usually online where I get belittled for them, or in private where I increasingly feel isolated and alone.

See, the answer for people like me is to express ourselves, to feel heard and supported.

People may not like intense, negative emotions... and that includes ourselves! We don't like feeling them or putting them on display anymore than anyone likes seeing them.

See, emotions are vulnerability, and expressing them in front of someone feels unsafe.

My therapist has told me many times to open up, to talk to others about what I'm going through, to let my friends in. My experience, however, is that doing so opens me up for ridicule, which most people will take advantage of (and some of them well-intentioned).

The more I stuff, the more builds up... and it has to come out sometime... be that through me or another that lives in this body with me (cus let's be real, emotions sometimes spread through us like a virus, especially if we're co-con). Feelings don't tend to stay perfectly contained in their little boxes, they tend to grow and fester when repressed - sometimes it feels like that's the very nature of some of them and that's why some of them fit into the category of memory-keepers, and furthermore why those others tend to be considerably more emotional than the rest of us.

If I'm able to find outlets, I'm able to keep the outbursts under control. I cry on my way home, or in the bathroom, or in the dark by myself.

I'm still extremely emotional and sensitive, afterall... I haven't magically become a different person from who I was as a child. I'm still "immature" and "dramatic", but no one can call me attention-seeking when they don't see those things.

It seems that society still doesn't recognize that no one has control over their emotions - we can't control how we feel. All we control is our actions, in whatever way that's even possible, and how much of the feelings bleed out into our lives (and how ironic that it often does without our control).

It seems like most people are too stuck in their own experiences to remember that everyone's different - different feelings, different experiences, different coping mechanisms, different tolerances.

We also all have different ways of expressing things and different intensities of those expressions at different times.

If I could teach folks one thing it would be to find outlets, be that online or IRL, be that verbal, written, artistic... so long as they don't hurt yourself or others. Don't think of your emotions as ridiculous, recognize they exist for a reason (but also that they're not always a reflection of reality). Don't try to stop yourself from feeling unless it's unsafe for you to do so in that moment.

Let yourself feel. Let yourself be sad. Let yourself be scared. Let yourself be angry.

Allowing yourself to exist and feel is extremely healing... even anger can be extremely healing. The voice that tells you those feelings are unnecessary is the voice that the world has injected into your spirit and it has no place in healing.

So, no matter what anyone thinks about it, let those feelings out. You'll no doubt find that they're easier to deal with when they're not repeatedly stuffed in a box and let to fester.

And most of all: be kind to yourself, especially if no one else ever has... it's your job now to give yourself the understanding that you've been denied.

[justanothersyscourse]

Why did I never pay attention to their Twitter before this

The article

This is incredible

[luulapants]

My dad and I once had a disagreement over him using the adage "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger."

I said, "That's just not true. Sometimes what doesn't kill you leaves you brittle and injured or traumatized."

He stopped and thought about that for a while. He came back later, and said, "It's like wood glue."

He pointed to my bookshelf, which he helped me salvage a while ago. He said, "Do you remember how I explained that, once we used the wood glue on them, the shelves would actually be stronger than they were before they broke?"

I did.

"But before we used the wood glue, those shelves were broken. They couldn't hold up shit. If you had put books on them, they would have collapsed. And that wood glue had to set awhile. If we put anything on them too early, they would have collapsed just the same as if we'd never fixed them at all. You've got to give these things time to set."

It sounded like a pretty good metaphor to me, but one thing I did pick up on was that whatever broke those shelves, that's not the thing that made them stronger. That just broke them. It was being fixed that made them stronger. It was the glue.

So my dad and I agreed, what doesn't kill you doesn't actually make you stronger, but healing does. And if you feel like healing hasn't made you stronger than you were before, you're probably not done healing. You've got to give these things time to set.

[dissociationawareness]

Healing is this long, arduous process that's a lot like trudging through quicksand.

It's so shocking to look back though. I still don't understand how I went from being who I was as a child or teen to who I am now at 35.

If I take it year by year, not as much changes. If I start looking at the patterns throughout the years though, I can see the effect of every small little thing I've done to get better.

I still want to believe I'm better, like I don't need any help... but I still have a long way to go and I still need to work on my anxiety.

There's this weird cross-over in how my brain and body responds to intense anxiety that are still symptoms that I recognize as PTSD-related. Everytime I have a panic attack, I find myself dissociating and hallucinating and it's extremely disorienting.

And I don't know what I can do about that. It probably has something to do with my sleep that it's so over the top these days. But I try everything I can think of in the moment (controlled breathing, 5 senses, take a Klonopin, squeeze myself into a ball, pinch my arm, whatever stim comes to mind) but what I really need is to get out of the situation and that's not always possible.

My panic attacks seem to be growing again. The last bad one at work lasted half an hour and I got startled a few times by people who weren't really there. It's been awhile since I had those continuing waves, panic attack after panic attack... and it's not even that this job is especially triggering... but some things have snapped even as some things have been put together.

And maybe that's just the thing about healing... sometimes you have to break a bone to get it to heal properly, sometimes you get a new wound... sometimes you have to start the healing all over again, paying gentle attention to the bits of yourself that you neglected last time because you were too scared to deal with them.

This is all just another step.

We're all works in progress.

Be kind to yourself.

[traumasurvivors]

You're valid if you wish that the trauma you experienced was worse. It doesn't mean that you're bad or anything like that.

A feeling of "wishing it was worse" is likely because of trauma imposter syndrome (here's a blog post I wrote on that if you're interested). Feeling like what you went through wasn't bad enough could lead to feelings of wishing it were worse so that you could feel valid.

Even if it was "worse", it's likely you'd still feel the same way though. Trauma imposter syndrome is something a lot of people struggle with.

Trauma is very subjective. It doesn't have to be the worst possible situation to be severely hurt by it. This means that you don't need what you went through to be "worse" to be allowed to be affected by it. The bottom line is you never should have had to go through what you went through at all.

[hexpatient]

[miscellaneous--system-deactivat]

[ID: A screenshot of a Reddit post. The original poster's name is covered. The post has ten up-votes. The post reads, "ERP is bullshit for the most part. Certain forms of exposure therapy can be helpful for (italics) specific (end italics) fears and compulsions, but ERP is abusive, creates more fear, creates shame around the fear, and forces people and children into incredibly stressful situations that can literally harm them because of how much cortisol is being produced.

And what about people like me? ERP and CBT won't fix my body focused repetitive behaviors (a form of OCD). It won't make me stop picking at my skin and nails. And what about things like POCD, not Pure-O, but pedophile OCD, wherein somebody who is definitely not a pedophile (usually victims of childhood sexual abuse) has intrusive thoughts about potentially being one and constantly checks to make (italics) sure (end italics) that they don't have any bodily reactions when around children even though the last thing they want to do is hurt a child. What then? How exactly do they plan to do exposure therapy in that case? Having them interact with a child will make it worse and the compulsions are mental so they can't be policed. It's fucked up." End ID.]

[dissociationawareness]

POCD is generally a "Pure-O" variety of OCD.

Pure-O is a misnomer that suggested only Obsessions are present but not Compulsions... but realistically this is a variety of OCD that is heavy on internal (or thought based) Compulsions. POCD can, however, have some external compulsions, though these are generally more vague like avoidance or reassurance seeking, or are more secretive like self-harm.

This is a variety of OCD that I have unfortunately dealt with... and I literally cannot think of a way that ESR would actually be helpful even if it weren't so traumatizing.

Story time (warning for multiple triggers, esp CSA, casual mention of SH/SI and Sui).

About 10 years ago we did sex work through the internet and ended up reporting someone to the police for suspected child abuse. We did not catch this person and I spiralled about it.

It was legitimately one of the most triggering experiences of our adult life and it made the OCD (which we've had lifelong) latch onto CSA as an intrusive thought. When I wasn't having flashbacks or body memories, my brain was certain that a child was being harmed and it was my fault. I literally could not stop thinking about it.

Some months later a friend asked me to babysit her daughter who at the time was the age we were when we were first abused. I initially experienced what I assume is pretty normal first-time-babysitter anxieties of "I turned around for a moment and the child is gone" to "I have searched the whole house calling this child's name and this is the third time this month she's played this game on me and now I'm totally certain she's gone", much of which resulted in intense panic attacks... but at some point it started to change. I went from fearing that I was a bad babysitter, to fearing I was grossly negligent, to fearing I would hurt her somehow.

Maybe the change happened when she kept saying her hip hurt and I kept looking for a mark or a rash and ended up calling grandma from next door to take a look because I was certain I was missing something and I was too scared to look a third time. Maybe it was when I accidentally tripped her while we were out in the backyard and my brain realized I could hurt her on accident. Regardless, at some point my brain started bombarding me with visceral intrusive thoughts about her being abused.

I did everything I could think of to try to push those thoughts out of my mind. I would try to think about other things, I'd close my eyes hard or look away from her, I'd repeat things in my head (some of which I still do in response to my OCD despite the fact that my obsessions have long since changed), and at some point I began to hurt myself when I was alone and had those thoughts. I became so certain that I must be having those thoughts because I wanted them and that somehow this person that I had reported had identified me as kin and that's why he told me what he was doing.

I ended up where a lot of people with POCD do: on support forums for pedophiles. I told them in earnest that I had been having thoughts about kids but had always been attracted to people older than myself but never younger. They told me that this variety of attraction could be acquired in adulthood and I believed them, and I believed I had somehow become a pedophile and was fated to turn into my abusers (and suddenly started to believe that perhaps the abuse I went through is what made me this way... which... I actually do believe that the abuse is part of why I have OCD). The irony of this is that I'm actually Asexual, though I didn't know this at that time and considered myself Pansexual because I'm actually Panromantic.

After that, I started to drink more and I eventually quit babysitting.

I was so ashamed that I never told my therapist (though I thought I did, and casually referenced it last week in a session and she was totally dumbfounded). I was so disgusted with myself that I seriously considered committing suicide so that I couldn't hurt a child.

At some point some folks in the system pretty much usurped me and moved us across the country... which wasn't a great choice actually, cus everything I did that moved my OCD on could have just as easily been done at home and with less of someone triggering me and my others (some folks came out during that period that I haven't seen before or since and have no idea who they are).

The thing that got me out of that, mostly, was realizing that I have OCD. It was through learning about the disorder and how it picks obsessions that really got me to slowly release the idea that I was doomed to hurt a child.

I realized that OCD, especially of this variety, tends to pick the thing that a person is most afraid of. My brain was triggered by a fear that I was responsible for the suffering of a child in the worst way I could think of. The thing I was and still am the most afraid of and disgusted by is CSA. The most terrifying scenario my brain can come up with is becoming my abusers - it's a thing that's manifested in various ways throughout my teen and adult life. Not turning into the people I hate and not acting like the people who have hurt me has been a driving force for my behavior for such a long time that it's still a big piece of how I live my life and how I treat other people to this day.

It's obvious to me now that it's ludicrous that I truly believed I could do that. But that's also because I know why I had those thoughts in the first place... because it's the most morally reprehensible thing I can think of, the thing I hate most in the whole world.

I would have not gotten through that if I had been forced to continue babysitting.

I would have killed myself (or attempted and ended up in inpatient for the fifth time). And it would have been a shame to kill myself over something I'd never do.

[the-indigo-symphony]

(Probably Bad) Ways to Respond to "You're Not Acting Like Yourself"

A list for systems who aren't out yet

"Yeah, my theatre teacher gave out a pretty weird improv assignment this week."

"Wow, you humans are more perceptive than I thought! I'll have to tell the mothership of this."

"The self is a social construct."

"I sold my soul and this is my way of coping with the emptiness I now feel."

"So you know those soulmate AUs where you swap bodies with your soulmate?"

"I got my brain software updated; it included some patches to my personality."

"It's my horoscope."

"It's practice for when I go undercover on my next spy mission."

"Haha, yeah." *leans into watch* "They're onto me."

"I'm actually (name)'s long lost twin."

"Thanks for noticing!"

"I'm under a curse. Can you help me break it?"

"It's my rebellious phase."

"Shakespeare said, 'All the world's a stage,' and I've decided to take that literally."

"Don't worry, I'll be done possessing (name) soon, I just have to try (food) first."

Feel free to add your own!

[akindplace]

Sketchbook_jpeg on instagram

[19b-archive-deactivated20250525]

It's simple. If you require people to reveal their trauma so you can decide if they're traumatized enough for their mental illness to be real, you are the asshole. Under no circumstances will accusing people of faking their disorder actually help people with that disorder.

[antpuppy-archive-deactivated202]

Very simple yet helpful chart showing the theory of structural dissociation

-powder

[dissociationawareness]

I really want to come back to mod this blog like I used to... doing research and finding sources, adding something of benefit to the community.

But I'm gonna be real... it gets overwhelming and I haven't forgotten that. I want to spread high-quality information, but I also don't really like being seen as this high source of knowledge (frankly, good information comes from the joining of lots of different sources anyways... empirical evidence doesn't come from just a single study afterall).

I'm going through a lot of emotional shit right now and it's a lot of different stuff. I still often convince myself that I'm a liar, like I'm not really multiple, and it makes me uncomfortable even talking about the dissociation that I experience.

And I KNOW denial is part of this disorder. I'm not even remotely illusioned to believe that it's not. But it still gets me... often.

All of the stress has had me switching a lot more than I usually do and that makes me feel like I'm not even put together enough to run an informative blog... and that's laughable because when this blog was originally started we were knee deep in an alcohol addiction... like my brain is most certainly more together than it was back then... and maybe that's the thing - that I'm so much more aware of my deficits now than I was when we were still drinking and thwarting our own attempts at sobriety (it took so long to convince everyone it was the right choice and I think we mostly have that agreed upon at this point).

I spent the first half of the day somewhere else, and I'm so disconnected from them that I don't even know who.

And that doesn't even have anything to do with my guilt of starting back up this blog then neglecting it. They're just more comfortable processing the things we're going through right now I guess?

So... I'm sorry everyone that we're still being a bunch of ghosts. I guess that's what we've always done.

I don't know if I'll ever get it really fully back together. Life feels too busy with what might as well be two jobs. When I have time, I just find myself disappearing or trying to keep my brain so busy that I don't crumble into a thousand pieces.

I don't even know what else to say but that.

I hope you're all doing ok or coping ok.

You deserve to be ok.

[adviceforsystems]

Sometimes trauma isn't anyone's fault. You may not have had a clear-cut abuser or abusers; maybe the people around you were as supportive as they could have been, maybe you never experienced bullying, harassment or abuse but external circumstances (including but not at all limited to poverty, natural disasters, war, accidental emotional neglect, disability/illness, etc.) meant you still ended up traumatized.

This doesn't make your trauma any less important or valid. Trauma is trauma and you are still traumatized, no matter what caused it. You and your trauma still deserve to be respected.

[reimeichan]

Yknow what, fuck it. Teenage years are confusing as hell already and trying to understand what the fuck is going on in your brain is extremely difficult even as an adult, nevermind when you're young and trying to figure yourself out. It's okay if you thought you had alters and then came out of it realizing that wasn't your experience at all. It’s okay if you were convinced you were the only one in your head and later discovered your system years or even decades down the line. It's okay if you misunderstood your symptoms and experiences. What matters is trying to heal from your past and grow into a better version of yourself/yourselves.