I want to watch LA By Night again. 😢

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@night-filled-mountain
I want to watch LA By Night again. 😢
How old are you? When your mother was your age did she have you yet?
Yes
No
Don't like this poll
So many labels, and none quite seem to fit...
I will never understand why Widobrave isn't a massive ship. Is it really because Nott said she was like Caleb's mother once?? That was before they'd had time to fully develop the dynamic! It came from Sam's mouth, just like the times he talked about how attractive Nott found Caleb, and how she had a crush on him... Before I watched the campaign, I saw so much Molly/Caleb I thought they were canon. Imagine my surprise when I found out how little screentime Molly had, and how the most important dynamic in the group for Caleb was with Nott! I really feel like Nott only said she was the parent in their dynamic because she was tired of being infantilised and patronised by people her own age/even younger than her. Not because she actually felt like Caleb's mother! I saw a comment under fanart of Veth kissing Caleb on the mouth (a canon scene) complaining about how gross it was because Veth was Caleb's mom. A CANON SCENE. I cannot deal with this fandom, I swear.
Oh boy do I agree with your frustration. There are some more pieces to the whole thing going on, and the full context of the situation is like. so frustrating but also kind of academically interesting, so here goes.
The reason it's not a big ship is not predominantly because of the projected familial association. At least, not originally. The origin point for its unpopularity was people thinking Nott was a literal child. I am led to believe, by those I've spoken to who were contemporary, and also evidence I've seen in the wild on posts or in AO3 comments, that there was some contention on the topic of whether Sam meant Nott was an actual literal child or not. This was exacerbated by Sam not being clear about her age, because Nott, for now-obvious reasons, was uncertain how to calculate her age at all--she was 25 when she died, but that's the full lifespan of a goblin. So she just hedged around, and also once Sam made a 69 joke about it ("I'm full-grown. Between 6-9"). People took this as either she was a child or she was "child-aged." As in, even if 6-9 is full-grown for a goblin, it's still only ~7 years old, which makes her a child in human years, and is therefore gross. Yes, that is a real argument that was made and will show up in some old AO3 comments (shoutout to guest commenter "A Concerned Citizen" for bringing that one up).
I suspect episode 13 provided an easy alternate reason to deny any aspect of their dynamic that might read as romantic--she's his mom! she said so herself! (*narrator* that is not what she fucking said). But on the other hand, I don't want to deny that aspects of the way she interacted with Caleb were maternal--Sam says this himself on Talks Machina, but also emphasizes that the dynamic is hardly purely maternal and that it was subject to change since they were so early in the campaign when this happened. This is a perfectly reasonable statement that many people have never ever listened to, not even once.
I think there's a lot of real discomfort with the idea of either Nott or Veth being with Caleb or holding romantic feelings for him (and I separate them here because the reasons are somewhat distinct between her forms). Nott is immediately denied the ability to be viewed in a sexual or romantic light, and specifically denied that in relation to the fandom's hot sad white boy of the campaign (we can joke about her bouncing on the Sunbreaker, but god forbid we treat her romantic and sexual feelings seriously). This is not an accident. It's because she's short and a monster and has a croaky voice and describes herself as ugly. You can make a joke about someone like that, but you can't take them seriously. Broadly, people are not going to ship some ugly little weird person with their favorite The Character of the campaign. They want someone hotter and cooler and taller, and preferably their other available The Character of the campaign (generally: Molly). "Mom" was an easy box to stick Nott into that meant she could have an emotionally significant relationship to Caleb, but not gross them out by having to consider the possibility of the hot guy being with that ugly girl. That sounds a bit harsh, but it feels accurate to my experience in the campaign.
Veth is a whole other ballgame, too, isn't she? Once we introduce her backstory, we introduce another hurdle: The Husband. Not that most people needed another reason not to ship it--they'd already decided she was his mom--but this becomes another argument against it toward those who do ship it. She's married. It's cheating. And cheating is a terrible, terrible offense that we can't touch in fiction. When Veth gets her body back, we're met with some interesting other reasons, too: she's brown and she's fat. Still short, also. This is, again, not the kind of person that people are going to broadly want to ship with their hot white guy The Character. "Mom" is an easy pigeonhole to avoid considering it and "married" only makes it easier. "Mom" to an actual little boy? We're really cooked now, because people can't view her sexually or romantically outside the context of a joke. Again.
And the thing that makes me suspicious of the reaction as it pertains to her appearance specifically (whether that be as a goblin or as a halfling) is that the reaction is often one of disgust. You can especially see this on Twitter, if you wanted to take a wee jaunt down memory lane, most commentary about Veth's crush, and her playlist admitting to her feelings, was met with genuine disgust. "That's gross, she's his mom" sounds a lot better than "that's gross, I don't want to see someone like HER with someone like HIM," but the thing is she's not his mom and she never was. It's a lie, it's a false interpretation, and it's perpetuated often to make the person doing it feel more comfortable. "I don't like the idea of them being romantic--I prefer Nott being his mom." This begs the question: why? Because of the fake incest you just imagined because you didn't listen to a single sentence Veth said after episode 13? Because of the sanctity of Veth's marriage to a guy you don't care about? What is the real reason people feel disguised at the idea of Nott/Veth kissing Caleb on the mouth and meaning it? And it has always, always had unpleasant implications that people will hide behind an interpretation so long in the ground that it is nothing more than piece of poorly-imagined, widely proliferated fanon. I could give you a 100 page folder of evidence about Veth's romantic feelings for Caleb, how real they were, how significantly they impacted her story, I can show you Sam Riegel in-game and out saying that Veth has feelings for Caleb multiple times and people won't listen to it because it's too uncomfortable for them. Why?
Loved it. Seen it twice already. Made my husband and housemate watch it with me the second time after the kids went to bed.
It had all my best blorbos in one episode. I couldn't ask for more.
“Oh let’s see how well Your Turn to Roll fits with the M9 intro, I’m sure it can’t fit that well…”
Maggie Dietz, "November" [ID in alt text]
A comic for the end of summer 🍃🍂
The full, original version of this comic is available here on my Patreon $4 tier :) tinyurl.com/yyymsx2n
I think part of the appeal of widobrave too is that there are only really two rules of being a widobrave shipper: 1) we love and respect complicated woman, Veth Brenatto, and understand that while being a young wife and mother is a part of her character, it does not and should not define her entirely; and 2) we acknowledge there was something absolutely fuckin batshit insane going on in her dynamic with Caleb Widogast that transcends "oh, they're just friends because she's married with a kid. end of story." after that, really anything goes as to how you personally want to interpret it.
like do you like ships where a platonic relationship is framed as just as if not more narratively meaningful than romantic relationships? we got widobrave for you! do you like queerplatonic/romantic friendship ships that blur the lines between romantic and platonic feelings? we got widobrave for you! do you like the brenattos and shadowgast as endgame couples but want more ships where a large portion of the shippers are down for interpreting the relationship as polyamorous/non-monogamous? we got widobrave(/shadowgast/brenattos) for you! do you like traditional monogamous romances but have a soft spot for angsty "right person, wrong time" ships? we got widobrave for you! do you like ships that explore the various reasons a couple might want to get a divorce without needlessly villainizing either party? we got widobrave for you! do you just enjoy cheating storylines in your fictional ships from time to time and don't really care about the morality of that because they're fake people and think Veth deserves a hot wizard side piece as a treat? we got widobrave for you!
people don't know what it was like being a widobrave fan during the airing of the mighty nein. every 5 episodes unprompted they would pull each other aside for a heart to heart that would emotionally wreck you and be completely unnecessary in connection to the goings on. they would gaze at each other and have little hugs and kisses and affirm that they were each other's number one priority. nott would call caleb out for being a super genius but built like a noodle and he'd be like no you're right i am. and then they'd do it again five episodes later.
Holy shit, Thaisha and Vaelus's magical Moment gave me such chills.
please understand that this is morally neutral and im not about to make fun of yall. out of pure academic curiousity...
whats your employment status?
unemployed and fine with it
unemployed and anxious about it
unemployed and looking for a job
underemployed and looking for a new job
part-time and that works for me
part-time and looking for full-time
full-time and looking to cut back hours/find a part-time job
full-time and thats what i prefer/require
not applicable (student, caretaker, cant work, etc)
man, its real complicated. im bald or whatever
i cannot capture all the nuances of the human experience wrt labor in one poll with a max option limit. be nicies to me
this poll is gonna be naturally skewed towards people who can spend more time on tumblr, so employed people are less likely to see it. im scheduling this for random times in the hopes that people in other timezones might see it on their lunch break
Just realized that once again, in starting a new Critical Role campaign, I have fallen hard and fast for The Bonded Pair.
I don't think I really want to do the fandom thing this time around (even if I had time, which...HA!), but I will say that I'm watching C4 (for now) (we will see how long this lasts) (I have THREE TODDLERS), and I'm having sooo much fun, and my favorite is everyone, but also it's Tyranny.
LVMandM9onPrime via Twitter: “All stories have to start at the beginning. The Mighty Nein trailer debuts tomorrow at NYCC.”
Travis Willingham via Twitter: “ITS HAPPENING”
just for the fuck of it, pick a randomish ship after having watched ep 1. throw out logic we don't know her here
Wicander/Halandil
Thaisha/Julien
Teor/Azune
Halandil/Azune
Tyranny/Thaisha
Bolaire/Halandil
Thimble/Kattigan
Murray/Thaisha
Occtis/Azune
Vaelus/Bolaire
Vaelus/Thimble
Wicander/Tyranny
Had to stick with it this far for Thimble's death saves. Going to bed now because I need to get up with three toddlers tomorrow. Also need to re-watch because I had major focus problems at first, then found myself glued to the screen by the end. Dang. What have I done. I want to watch moooore.