Wincest & J2 fan

Supernatural fan since 2011, came for the supernatural and thrills, stayed for the brothers and their undying love for each other, hardcore wincest fan, J2 fan, bottom!sam/Jared fan, a massive fan of Captain Swan(Emma/Hook) from Once Upon A Time, and Olake(Olivia/Jake) from Scandal

[lightofraye]

Jensen Ackles Photoshoot

[caio-silva]

Friendly reminder that Jensen was just the actor, not a writer or the showrunner. The actual writers of the show have confirmed and shown the exact opposite: yes, Dean did reciprocate.

There are multiple deliberate parallels between Dean and Cas and other couples on the show, which clearly confirm that their relationship was written romantically.

In the final season, the writers repeatedly used Sam and Eileen’s romantic relationship as a mirror for Dean and Cas’s. One example: when Eileen tells Sam she doesn’t know what’s real anymore because of Chuck, Sam kisses her and says “I know that was real.” This directly mirrors the scene earlier in the season where Dean tells Cas that nothing in their lives is real because of Chuck, and Cas replies, “You asked what about all of this is real? We are.”

Another clear parallel: Sam loses Eileen and Dean loses Cas literally in the same episode, 15x18. In fact, the entire episode where Castiel confesses was built around characters losing their love interests, starting with Charlie losing Stevie, specifically to set up and mirror Dean losing Cas at the end. The writers genuinely could not have made it any clearer.

On top of that, they introduced Adam and Serafina — a human and an angel who were deeply in love — literally one episode before Castiel’s confession. That was obviously not accidental. It was clear foreshadowing and an extremely direct parallel to Dean and Castiel. Everyone knows the biblical Adam and Eve story, but Supernatural deliberately changed the narrative specifically to mirror Dean and Cas — a human and an angel, just like Adam and Serafina.

They did the exact same thing with Cain. They didn’t even cast an actor to play Abel. Instead, they created an entirely new character, Colette, Cain’s great love, specifically so she could mirror Castiel in Dean’s life. Cain literally tells Dean, “You’re living my life in reverse,” and says that Dean will kill Cas first and then Sam. Since Cain killed his brother first and then his love interest, Dean living the story in reverse means Cas is his Colette (the love interest) and Sam is his Abel (the brother). That was extremely explicit. That is not subtext — that is text.

And finally, in episode 15x19, right after Cas’s confession and death, Lucifer impersonates Cas in order to manipulate Dean into letting him in. That is the ultimate confirmation that Dean reciprocated. The show had already established Lucifer’s consistent method: he always impersonates the person’s dead love interest in order to manipulate them into letting him in. He did it with Nick by impersonating his dead wife Sarah, with Sam by impersonating Jessica, his dead girlfriend, and with Vince Vicente by impersonating Jen, his dead lover. And he did it with Dean by impersonating Cas.

Therefore, Castiel is canonically Dean’s love interest. Destiel is canon. You cannot argue against these canon facts.

[arkvark2]

lol the script by Berens LITERALLY said Dean does not reciprocate. The rest of your "proof" is fanfiction. Colette was not mentioned for 1.5 seasons, the general audience does not remember her. The season Colette was mentioned, Sam literally told Dean to "stop", and Dean did. Cain said Sam's death will hurt Dean the most, not Cas.

[nancylou444]

🤣🤣 OP, those aren't "canon" facts. They're delusional "parallels" that mean nothing out of context.

Canon:

Canon:

Canon:

Therefore:

[bucketofme]

How are the words of irrelevant actor canon or even worth consideration when the actual canon never implied Destiel doesn't exist?

Yes Dean loves Sam same way Cain loves Abel and loves Cas same way he loves Collete, literally the script you posted show's that, Dean couldn't reciprocate because he wa stunned and confused, no where is it stated he doesn't reciprocate.

Where is Sam the most important to Dean, he literally offered to kill him it get Cas back,not to mention he seemed way higher on Dean's priorities both in Purgatory and not only.

Also random quotes an emotionally distressed character is giving are your proof? Dean also said he would rather Sam being dead over Charlie in s10, well I guess he cares for everyone more than Sam using your logic.

Anti destiels stop embarrassing yourself,go write your fanfiction on Ao3 and leave people talk about the canon romantic plotlines of the show alone

[wif-san]

Lol He’s not irrelevant because he played a huge part in crafting Dean in bringing him to life, and literally lived and breathed Dean Winchester for over 15 years.

Cass was never Collette, Dean barely tolerated him most of the time and I don’t think he ever once stopped for Cass, in the entirety of the series, except maybe if Cass threatened harm to him. If anyone was a Colette parallel it was Sam and Dean actually took back control of the mark and stopped when Sam called out to him to stop.

If Dean’s lack of reciprocation was purely due to being stunned it would have said “didn’t” or at least would have left it at “too stunned to respond” not “couldn’t” as “couldn’t” in this instance means “not capable”. The way it was worded is truly damming because: “could have, but didn’t because too stunned to say anything in that moment” vs “couldn’t, because sexuality not compatible” regardless of time constraints.

No, Sam and Dean offered to kill each other to get Chuck to bring EVERYONE including Cass back, with no indication that Dean had any intention to live on regardless of which scenario Chuck chose. Also, the only reason that Cass was specifically mentioned is because he wasn’t disappeared by Chuck like everyone else on earth, he was slurped away by the empty, so if they left it at “bring back everyone you disappeared” Chuck definitely wouldn’t have bothered with Cass, and as it was their friend, they had to at least ask.

Those quotes are proof because Dean meant them with his whole heart, and proved it too, as by Dean’s actions, certainly no individual person or being was ever more important to him than Sam.

The first time in purgatory he had no reason to think that Sam was in danger, so of course he was’t going to just abandon his friend without even trying. The second time however, when Dean knew for a fact that Sam was in danger from Chuck, he was literally going to abandon Cass in purgatory to run to Sam, and the only reason Cass made it out that time was because he got himself out of the mess he was in and back to Dean before Dean hopped out of the portal. Also, when he said that to Sam over Charlie, he had the Mark of Cain, was grieving Charlie and was being petty and hurtful over that, but not serious, as he’s never even considered sacrificing Sam for anyone, and would trade literally anyone for Sam (and has).

[bucketofme]

exactly he is so irrelevant despite playing him for 15 years never has gis thoughts and feelings considered for the finale, didn't even understood a vital part of the so such as Destiel.

Cas was always Collete as shown in the show and confirmed by the writer,the love of Dean's life, the man Dean couldn't survive without,his everything as he has called him. He only stopped bc if Cas, he didn't hurt Sam bc he remembered what he did to Sam, Dean's love for Cas saved Sam. He was pathetically head over heels for him even when Cas treated him badly

Dena has offered to kill Sam for Cas and Cas was so vital to Dean and Dean's survival Chuck refused to bring him back no matter what which ended up being the right call bc as proven Dean can't even live without Cas,he was crying and begging to be dead than live a life without him. Even if he cared for others Cas was always the main objective shown by the emphasis in the sentence, Cas is literally Dean's everything after all as stated by him in 13x01.

It's not even the first time Dean doesn't even care for Sam when it comes to Cas' safety, Purgatory both times, he basically didn't acre about him, in the trap especially Sam was being tortured by God and all Dean cared about was Cas , falling on his knees and begging for forgiveness (even though it was Cas who wronged him Dean didn't care Cas was vital to him). Getting Cas back from Lucifer too, Sam whining like a cry baby about how dangerous it is and Dean doesn't even care he only cares about Cas. He knows if the plan bacn tracked they would have all being killed but getting the love of his life back was what's most important not Sam.

As for Dean's reciprocation, I mean he was the one obviously in love even if he didn't know Cas felt the same and the script made it clear ,the script literally made it clear, Dean was never excepting it he was stunned and confused whe it happened,and despite that he literally told Cas not to do this,to not sacrifice himself so only he can live ,he preferred to die with him than live without him Cas had to push him away, and Dean even after doing everything to get him back he failed and chose death over a life without him,he literally begged to be dead than live with Sam or anyone that isn't Castiel after all Cas was his everything.

[wif-san]

No writer ever confirmed that, Dean has never called Cass that, nor said that about him. Genuinely, the only one Dean has actually said he can’t live without is Sam “I couldn’t live with you dead” and has demonstrated by being willing to do anything to get Sam back EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. SAM. DIED. Which is why Sam was his everything. For Cass, at most he asked for him to be brought back, but offered nothing for Cass and only Cass, because with Chuck at the end of s15 that was for everyone on earth, because Chuck poofed them away, and they threw in Cass because he was their friend and wasn’t automatically included, necessitating a specific mention to be included, because he was slurped away by the empty, not poofed away by Chuck.

He was taking a moment to say something to Cass before he left because he didn’t want to leave things with his friend on a bad note, since he was then going to get up leave purgatory and abandon Cass to run to Sam. If Dean really loved and needed Cass like that, he wouldn’t have been ready to and telling Cass that he was going to leave him in purgatory to run to Sam’s aid. Dean didn’t kill himself, his death was an accident and he only told Sam no deals or extreme measures because as Dean literally said to Sam, he was tired of running around in apocalyptic circles because deals come with consequences, but if Sam could have saved Dean without such consequences then Dean would have accepted it. Dean just didn’t see a way out without such consequences.

[nancylou444]

I think that this heller troll with their starter avatar is a heller that we have blocked, so this is their way to getting around that. This blog came into existence YESTERDAY.

Obviously, they are looking for a fight with that one brain cell that is crying for help.

[wrdlbrmpfd]

Oh that asshole is also on Twitter. Ran into them I while ago and they have the dumbest takes. And they like to troll. So I will block them here like blocked them on Twitter

[wif-san]

@nancylou444 That blog has only existed for a few days now? Wow, and they’ve already blocked me it seems 🤣 lol. I agree with wrdlbrmpfd, at this point it’s generous to say that they have even one brain cell, I mean, there’s outright lies being pushed now, not just removing important context, half-truths, and colorful reinterpretations.

[wif-san]

https://www.tumblr.com/wif-san/817884637073408000/lol-hes-not-irrelevant-because-he-played-a-huge?source=share

The audacity of @bucketforme to claim that Jensen is an irrelevant actor. I'm sorry, but he's the most relevant person there is to speak about Dean and the character's existence! Jensen's the only one who's spent more time with Dean than any other person. SPN had so much turnover with writers and showrunners to the point where writer's talked about only being required to watch a couple of episodes before they got to write one themselves.

That's not to mention how many fans think they know better than the character. I've mentioned this before, but let's look at numbers! Jensen and Jared worked on 327 episodes of SPN. Each episode takes about 8 days to film, typically working an average of 14 hour days. I'll be generous and say that J2 spent 6 of those 8 actually filming. In addition, they would have spent non-filming time studying the scripts, not just the words, but the actions and motivations of their characters. I'll give that three hours in a day (they have to sleep sometime!) So, that's 17 hours, 6 days a week for 327 episodes. That comes out to 33,354 hours of work put into creating SPN and living as Sam and Dean.

The total runtime of SPN is about 240 hours. Even if a superfan watched the entire show 10 times over (and again, that's being generous), that's only 2,400 hours, or only 7% of the total time Jared and Jensen spent with Sam and Dean.

To say that Jensen's words about Dean's thoughts and motivations are irrelevant as an actor is ridiculous and frankly, insulting. He's the only one who knows the character best and can speak on him, so when he says Destiel is not valid and that Dean only cared about Cass as a brother, then that's Dean's truth and no amount of explaining/hand-wringing/manifesting/harassing that hellers do is going to change that.

You’re absolutely right anon, Jensen is THE relevant person there is to speak about Dean, because he is THE expert on Dean. Between the sheer amount of time Jensen has spent molding and living Dean and the amount of writer turnover as you said. Like, especially when you look at the actual numbers, it’s not even close, even when we shave off some hours for the reduced work time and days for when J2 both scaled back their workload in later seasons somewhat, that would still come out to over 20,000 hours at least. So at a bare minimum Jensen spent 10x as many hours with Dean as a fan who watched the entire series 10 times over.

This isn’t news of course to any of us with an ounce of respect for Jensen, an ounce of common sense, and a lack of agenda, but the hellers’ strong suit has always been belligerence, entitlement, and everything that comes with it, including clinging to their shared delusion.

[caio-silva]

Friendly reminder that Jensen was just the actor, not a writer or the showrunner. The actual writers of the show have confirmed and shown the exact opposite: yes, Dean did reciprocate.

There are multiple deliberate parallels between Dean and Cas and other couples on the show, which clearly confirm that their relationship was written romantically.

In the final season, the writers repeatedly used Sam and Eileen’s romantic relationship as a mirror for Dean and Cas’s. One example: when Eileen tells Sam she doesn’t know what’s real anymore because of Chuck, Sam kisses her and says “I know that was real.” This directly mirrors the scene earlier in the season where Dean tells Cas that nothing in their lives is real because of Chuck, and Cas replies, “You asked what about all of this is real? We are.”

Another clear parallel: Sam loses Eileen and Dean loses Cas literally in the same episode, 15x18. In fact, the entire episode where Castiel confesses was built around characters losing their love interests, starting with Charlie losing Stevie, specifically to set up and mirror Dean losing Cas at the end. The writers genuinely could not have made it any clearer.

On top of that, they introduced Adam and Serafina — a human and an angel who were deeply in love — literally one episode before Castiel’s confession. That was obviously not accidental. It was clear foreshadowing and an extremely direct parallel to Dean and Castiel. Everyone knows the biblical Adam and Eve story, but Supernatural deliberately changed the narrative specifically to mirror Dean and Cas — a human and an angel, just like Adam and Serafina.

They did the exact same thing with Cain. They didn’t even cast an actor to play Abel. Instead, they created an entirely new character, Colette, Cain’s great love, specifically so she could mirror Castiel in Dean’s life. Cain literally tells Dean, “You’re living my life in reverse,” and says that Dean will kill Cas first and then Sam. Since Cain killed his brother first and then his love interest, Dean living the story in reverse means Cas is his Colette (the love interest) and Sam is his Abel (the brother). That was extremely explicit. That is not subtext — that is text.

And finally, in episode 15x19, right after Cas’s confession and death, Lucifer impersonates Cas in order to manipulate Dean into letting him in. That is the ultimate confirmation that Dean reciprocated. The show had already established Lucifer’s consistent method: he always impersonates the person’s dead love interest in order to manipulate them into letting him in. He did it with Nick by impersonating his dead wife Sarah, with Sam by impersonating Jessica, his dead girlfriend, and with Vince Vicente by impersonating Jen, his dead lover. And he did it with Dean by impersonating Cas.

Therefore, Castiel is canonically Dean’s love interest. Destiel is canon. You cannot argue against these canon facts.

[arkvark2]

lol the script by Berens LITERALLY said Dean does not reciprocate. The rest of your "proof" is fanfiction. Colette was not mentioned for 1.5 seasons, the general audience does not remember her. The season Colette was mentioned, Sam literally told Dean to "stop", and Dean did. Cain said Sam's death will hurt Dean the most, not Cas.

[nancylou444]

🤣🤣 OP, those aren't "canon" facts. They're delusional "parallels" that mean nothing out of context.

Canon:

Canon:

Canon:

Therefore:

[bucketofme]

How are the words of irrelevant actor canon or even worth consideration when the actual canon never implied Destiel doesn't exist?

Yes Dean loves Sam same way Cain loves Abel and loves Cas same way he loves Collete, literally the script you posted show's that, Dean couldn't reciprocate because he wa stunned and confused, no where is it stated he doesn't reciprocate.

Where is Sam the most important to Dean, he literally offered to kill him it get Cas back,not to mention he seemed way higher on Dean's priorities both in Purgatory and not only.

Also random quotes an emotionally distressed character is giving are your proof? Dean also said he would rather Sam being dead over Charlie in s10, well I guess he cares for everyone more than Sam using your logic.

Anti destiels stop embarrassing yourself,go write your fanfiction on Ao3 and leave people talk about the canon romantic plotlines of the show alone

[wif-san]

Lol He’s not irrelevant because he played a huge part in crafting Dean in bringing him to life, and literally lived and breathed Dean Winchester for over 15 years.

Cass was never Collette, Dean barely tolerated him most of the time and I don’t think he ever once stopped for Cass, in the entirety of the series, except maybe if Cass threatened harm to him. If anyone was a Colette parallel it was Sam and Dean actually took back control of the mark and stopped when Sam called out to him to stop.

If Dean’s lack of reciprocation was purely due to being stunned it would have said “didn’t” or at least would have left it at “too stunned to respond” not “couldn’t” as “couldn’t” in this instance means “not capable”. The way it was worded is truly damming because: “could have, but didn’t because too stunned to say anything in that moment” vs “couldn’t, because sexuality not compatible” regardless of time constraints.

No, Sam and Dean offered to kill each other to get Chuck to bring EVERYONE including Cass back, with no indication that Dean had any intention to live on regardless of which scenario Chuck chose. Also, the only reason that Cass was specifically mentioned is because he wasn’t disappeared by Chuck like everyone else on earth, he was slurped away by the empty, so if they left it at “bring back everyone you disappeared” Chuck definitely wouldn’t have bothered with Cass, and as it was their friend, they had to at least ask.

Those quotes are proof because Dean meant them with his whole heart, and proved it too, as by Dean’s actions, certainly no individual person or being was ever more important to him than Sam.

The first time in purgatory he had no reason to think that Sam was in danger, so of course he was’t going to just abandon his friend without even trying. The second time however, when Dean knew for a fact that Sam was in danger from Chuck, he was literally going to abandon Cass in purgatory to run to Sam, and the only reason Cass made it out that time was because he got himself out of the mess he was in and back to Dean before Dean hopped out of the portal. Also, when he said that to Sam over Charlie, he had the Mark of Cain, was grieving Charlie and was being petty and hurtful over that, but not serious, as he’s never even considered sacrificing Sam for anyone, and would trade literally anyone for Sam (and has).

[bucketofme]

exactly he is so irrelevant despite playing him for 15 years never has gis thoughts and feelings considered for the finale, didn't even understood a vital part of the so such as Destiel.

Cas was always Collete as shown in the show and confirmed by the writer,the love of Dean's life, the man Dean couldn't survive without,his everything as he has called him. He only stopped bc if Cas, he didn't hurt Sam bc he remembered what he did to Sam, Dean's love for Cas saved Sam. He was pathetically head over heels for him even when Cas treated him badly

Dena has offered to kill Sam for Cas and Cas was so vital to Dean and Dean's survival Chuck refused to bring him back no matter what which ended up being the right call bc as proven Dean can't even live without Cas,he was crying and begging to be dead than live a life without him. Even if he cared for others Cas was always the main objective shown by the emphasis in the sentence, Cas is literally Dean's everything after all as stated by him in 13x01.

It's not even the first time Dean doesn't even care for Sam when it comes to Cas' safety, Purgatory both times, he basically didn't acre about him, in the trap especially Sam was being tortured by God and all Dean cared about was Cas , falling on his knees and begging for forgiveness (even though it was Cas who wronged him Dean didn't care Cas was vital to him). Getting Cas back from Lucifer too, Sam whining like a cry baby about how dangerous it is and Dean doesn't even care he only cares about Cas. He knows if the plan bacn tracked they would have all being killed but getting the love of his life back was what's most important not Sam.

As for Dean's reciprocation, I mean he was the one obviously in love even if he didn't know Cas felt the same and the script made it clear ,the script literally made it clear, Dean was never excepting it he was stunned and confused whe it happened,and despite that he literally told Cas not to do this,to not sacrifice himself so only he can live ,he preferred to die with him than live without him Cas had to push him away, and Dean even after doing everything to get him back he failed and chose death over a life without him,he literally begged to be dead than live with Sam or anyone that isn't Castiel after all Cas was his everything.

[wif-san]

No writer ever confirmed that, Dean has never called Cass that, nor said that about him. Genuinely, the only one Dean has actually said he can’t live without is Sam “I couldn’t live with you dead” and has demonstrated by being willing to do anything to get Sam back EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. SAM. DIED. Which is why Sam was his everything. For Cass, at most he asked for him to be brought back, but offered nothing for Cass and only Cass, because with Chuck at the end of s15 that was for everyone on earth, because Chuck poofed them away, and they threw in Cass because he was their friend and wasn’t automatically included, necessitating a specific mention to be included, because he was slurped away by the empty, not poofed away by Chuck.

He was taking a moment to say something to Cass before he left because he didn’t want to leave things with his friend on a bad note, since he was then going to get up leave purgatory and abandon Cass to run to Sam. If Dean really loved and needed Cass like that, he wouldn’t have been ready to and telling Cass that he was going to leave him in purgatory to run to Sam’s aid. Dean didn’t kill himself, his death was an accident and he only told Sam no deals or extreme measures because as Dean literally said to Sam, he was tired of running around in apocalyptic circles because deals come with consequences, but if Sam could have saved Dean without such consequences then Dean would have accepted it. Dean just didn’t see a way out without such consequences.

[caio-silva]

Friendly reminder that Jensen was just the actor, not a writer or the showrunner. The actual writers of the show have confirmed and shown the exact opposite: yes, Dean did reciprocate.

There are multiple deliberate parallels between Dean and Cas and other couples on the show, which clearly confirm that their relationship was written romantically.

In the final season, the writers repeatedly used Sam and Eileen’s romantic relationship as a mirror for Dean and Cas’s. One example: when Eileen tells Sam she doesn’t know what’s real anymore because of Chuck, Sam kisses her and says “I know that was real.” This directly mirrors the scene earlier in the season where Dean tells Cas that nothing in their lives is real because of Chuck, and Cas replies, “You asked what about all of this is real? We are.”

Another clear parallel: Sam loses Eileen and Dean loses Cas literally in the same episode, 15x18. In fact, the entire episode where Castiel confesses was built around characters losing their love interests, starting with Charlie losing Stevie, specifically to set up and mirror Dean losing Cas at the end. The writers genuinely could not have made it any clearer.

On top of that, they introduced Adam and Serafina — a human and an angel who were deeply in love — literally one episode before Castiel’s confession. That was obviously not accidental. It was clear foreshadowing and an extremely direct parallel to Dean and Castiel. Everyone knows the biblical Adam and Eve story, but Supernatural deliberately changed the narrative specifically to mirror Dean and Cas — a human and an angel, just like Adam and Serafina.

They did the exact same thing with Cain. They didn’t even cast an actor to play Abel. Instead, they created an entirely new character, Colette, Cain’s great love, specifically so she could mirror Castiel in Dean’s life. Cain literally tells Dean, “You’re living my life in reverse,” and says that Dean will kill Cas first and then Sam. Since Cain killed his brother first and then his love interest, Dean living the story in reverse means Cas is his Colette (the love interest) and Sam is his Abel (the brother). That was extremely explicit. That is not subtext — that is text.

And finally, in episode 15x19, right after Cas’s confession and death, Lucifer impersonates Cas in order to manipulate Dean into letting him in. That is the ultimate confirmation that Dean reciprocated. The show had already established Lucifer’s consistent method: he always impersonates the person’s dead love interest in order to manipulate them into letting him in. He did it with Nick by impersonating his dead wife Sarah, with Sam by impersonating Jessica, his dead girlfriend, and with Vince Vicente by impersonating Jen, his dead lover. And he did it with Dean by impersonating Cas.

Therefore, Castiel is canonically Dean’s love interest. Destiel is canon. You cannot argue against these canon facts.

[arkvark2]

lol the script by Berens LITERALLY said Dean does not reciprocate. The rest of your "proof" is fanfiction. Colette was not mentioned for 1.5 seasons, the general audience does not remember her. The season Colette was mentioned, Sam literally told Dean to "stop", and Dean did. Cain said Sam's death will hurt Dean the most, not Cas.

[nancylou444]

🤣🤣 OP, those aren't "canon" facts. They're delusional "parallels" that mean nothing out of context.

Canon:

Canon:

Canon:

Therefore:

[bucketofme]

How are the words of irrelevant actor canon or even worth consideration when the actual canon never implied Destiel doesn't exist?

Yes Dean loves Sam same way Cain loves Abel and loves Cas same way he loves Collete, literally the script you posted show's that, Dean couldn't reciprocate because he wa stunned and confused, no where is it stated he doesn't reciprocate.

Where is Sam the most important to Dean, he literally offered to kill him it get Cas back,not to mention he seemed way higher on Dean's priorities both in Purgatory and not only.

Also random quotes an emotionally distressed character is giving are your proof? Dean also said he would rather Sam being dead over Charlie in s10, well I guess he cares for everyone more than Sam using your logic.

Anti destiels stop embarrassing yourself,go write your fanfiction on Ao3 and leave people talk about the canon romantic plotlines of the show alone

[wif-san]

Lol He’s not irrelevant because he played a huge part in crafting Dean in bringing him to life, and literally lived and breathed Dean Winchester for over 15 years.

Cass was never Collette, Dean barely tolerated him most of the time and I don’t think he ever once stopped for Cass, in the entirety of the series, except maybe if Cass threatened harm to him. If anyone was a Colette parallel it was Sam and Dean actually took back control of the mark and stopped when Sam called out to him to stop.

If Dean’s lack of reciprocation was purely due to being stunned it would have said “didn’t” or at least would have left it at “too stunned to respond” not “couldn’t” as “couldn’t” in this instance means “not capable”. The way it was worded is truly damming because: “could have, but didn’t because too stunned to say anything in that moment” vs “couldn’t, because sexuality not compatible” regardless of time constraints.

No, Sam and Dean offered to kill each other to get Chuck to bring EVERYONE including Cass back, with no indication that Dean had any intention to live on regardless of which scenario Chuck chose. Also, the only reason that Cass was specifically mentioned is because he wasn’t disappeared by Chuck like everyone else on earth, he was slurped away by the empty, so if they left it at “bring back everyone you disappeared” Chuck definitely wouldn’t have bothered with Cass, and as it was their friend, they had to at least ask.

Those quotes are proof because Dean meant them with his whole heart, and proved it too, as by Dean’s actions, certainly no individual person or being was ever more important to him than Sam.

The first time in purgatory he had no reason to think that Sam was in danger, so of course he was’t going to just abandon his friend without even trying. The second time however, when Dean knew for a fact that Sam was in danger from Chuck, he was literally going to abandon Cass in purgatory to run to Sam, and the only reason Cass made it out that time was because he got himself out of the mess he was in and back to Dean before Dean hopped out of the portal. Also, when he said that to Sam over Charlie, he had the Mark of Cain, was grieving Charlie and was being petty and hurtful over that, but not serious, as he’s never even considered sacrificing Sam for anyone, and would trade literally anyone for Sam (and has).

[walkergirlsposts]

Watched the episode and here’s the gist. Jared and Misha’s characters were not a couple. SB and Mr. Marathon actually like each other and they even get a moment where they do drugs together and pal around while Misha’s character is in a different part of the room with other people 😆

And when Mr. Marathon shares an embarrassing story about Homelander, and Homelander hears it/gets pissed off, SB tries to defend Mr. Marathon by telling Homelander “can’t you take a fucking joke?” Unfortunately, the bonding stops when Misha’s character knocks out Homelander and everyone at the house reveals that they want Homelander dead.

SB reluctantly decides to defend his son. SB’s first kill is Misha’s character lol SB angrily crushes his neck. But Misha’s character isn’t actually the one who explodes, it’s the other people at Mr. Marathon’s house. SB uses them as human shields and THEY are the ones who explode.

SB does trick Mr. Marathon into breaking one of his legs so he can’t use his super speed anymore, then breaks Mr. Marathon’s other leg himself when he won’t give out information on someone. But once he gets that information out of him, it actually looks like SB is gonna spare him, but then Homelander unexpectedly shows up and kills Mr. Marathon himself. SB was even a little surprised

So those were false leaks, I saw then. I'm never going to believe another one. But Misha dying first we were all right about. Lol

[wif-san]

I saw the episode too, and am reblogging to add a small correction and a tidbit that anon neglected to mention.

Small correction: Soldier Boy tricked Mr. Marathon into slipping and falling on his ass and then stomped on one leg (breaking it) to prevent him from running anymore then broke the other leg when Mr. Marathon refused to talk.

Tidbit anon didn’t mention: Mooshy’s character’s super power is gas, yes, gas, I shit you not. He literally breathes his super gas into Homelander’s face to knock him out. So, you could say Malchemical (mooshy’s character) has super halitosis and probably (this wasn’t shown onscreen, but makes sense with his power being gas) super farts. 😂🤣😂🤣

[aborddelimpala]

The Boys S05E02 - Soldier Boy reaction gifs

[starsandsalvation]

I try to stay out of the fandom beef but I saw a tweet that Dean would choose Cas over Sam and I fear that some of you don't watch scenes that Cas isn't in. Dean literally tells Sam there's nothing that he would put in front of Sam and he is SPECIFICALLY responding to Sam thinking Dean would choose Cas or Benny over him.

That's not subtext, it's text.

[samisadeangirl]

It's also text that Dean has in fact chosen SAM over Castiel on multiple occasions:

4.22 Lucifer Rising: Dean leaves Cas to face an archangel's wrath alone at Chuck's house so he can go to SAM

5.22 Swan Song: Dean doesn't react when Lucifer kills Cas and instead remains focused on trying to get through to SAM

7.17 The Born-Again Identity: Dean lets Cas take SAM's debilitating Cage trauma to save SAM and then leaves the catatonic angel in the asylum under the dubious care of a demon he barely trusts to be with SAM

8.07 A Little Slice of Kevin: Dean leaves Cas in Purgatory when the angel insists on staying there as penance to get back to SAM and, while he does feel guilty, makes no attempt to rescue him--but he kills his real best friend Benny in 8.19 Taxi Driver to save SAM when he's trapped there

9.01 I Think I'm Gonna Like It Here: When Dean prays to Cas and later speaks to him on the phone, his focus is entirely on saving SAM, not what happened to the angel as a result of Metatron's spell

9.03 I'm No Angel: Dean kicks Cas out of the Bunker to keep SAM safe, despite the angel being virtually defenseless without his grace, and makes no attempt to help him while he's on his own

11.10 The Devil in the Details: Dean lets Cas fight Lucifer alone initially so he can check on SAM

15.09 The Trap: When Cas goes missing in Purgatory, Dean makes no attempt to find him and instead prepares to leave without the angel so he can save SAM

Meanwhile, there is not a single instance in canon of Dean choosing Castiel over SAM. In fact, Dean has never gone to any extraordinary measures to save the angel or bring him back from death--unlike the extreme lengths Dean always goes to when SAM is in serious trouble or dead. Again, this isn't subtext, it's text.

Like OP says in the tags, you're welcome to headcanon whatever you want and ship whatever you want, but don't pretend your fanon ideas are anything more than that. Canon is what it is, and no amount of headcanons will change that.

[wif-san]

All of this, also, it’s sad that these days this:

Like OP says in the tags, you're welcome to headcanon whatever you want and ship whatever you want, but don't pretend your fanon ideas are anything more than that. Canon is what it is, and no amount of headcanons will change that.

cannot be emphasized strongly enough.

[wrdlbrmpfd]

Hello I just saw a TikTok comment about how Jared said Castiel and Colette were paralleled. Do you know anything it? Cuz when I watched the show I saw no parallels at all

I'm pretty sure this was a cut together to fit hellers' narratives (they like to do shit like this) bc I can't remember Jared talking about this parallel. And as much as hellers twist and turn it, Sam was Dean's Collette, not tue winged rat.

[nancylou444]

Seattle Con 2015

[eisforeidolon]

No, it wasn't something they pieced together, but it is pointedly ignoring the context Jared clearly had no fucking clue what supposed parallel was being asked about. After going on a long, off-topic tangent with Jensen, he gave a vague answer about the writing of the show before saying sure, it was a thing if they saw a parallel - obviously assuming good faith of the question that was entirely undeserved.

Also, am I crazy, or did they try to bring it up again at a later convention and Jared didn't even know/remember Cain's wife's name was Colette and he thought they were talking about clown college Colette?

Anyway, this is a quick and dirty transcript of the answer that they're referring to from the video above, starting at ~31:28:

Question: I was just wondering if in The Executioner's Song, if the Castiel and Colette parallel was a big part of the plot? Or was just something that happened?

Jared: Which one was that episode again?

Question: The one where Dean killed Cain.

Jared: Oh! Is that what it was called? Executioner's Song? I didn't realize that, that's a great book!

Jensen: It was a good episode. I stabbed you in the thigh.

Jared: Yes, yeah it still hurts. Um, oh, I wonder if that'll make the gag reel? Yeah I guess -

Jensen: No, 'cause you didn't react.

Jared: Oh yeah.

Jensen: Because you have no feelings.

Jared: Inside I do.

Jensen: You're dead inside.

Jared: Yeah dude, I got to go to hell, I came out soulless.

Jensen: For those of you who don't know, he went to catch me after I-Dean killed Cain, and I had a very large, rather pointy knife in my hand that went right into his thigh. And he didn't even react, he just grabbed me and finished the scene and he was like, 'Ow.' And I'm like, yeah, [mimes pulling out a knife with suction sound and holding it up] this was in your leg.

Jared: It was, so, for the, let's show them. [both get up] So he comes down, he came down the stairs, right? And Cass and Sam were waiting [pointing to Jensen's mic] that's his knife, that's Cain's knife, he's holding Cain's knife and he's coming down, yeah, and Sam comes out and he's about to fall so, I go to catch him [demonstrates], and that [grabbing mic] went [jabs mic into his thigh]. [Makes low-key pain noise] And they're like, 'Cut!'. Yanked it out, and I was like - he goes, 'Dude, I gotcha' and I was like, yeah I think he got me. There was a hole in the pants and a dark spot -

Jensen: And it was dripping with blood.

Jared: Yeah. Dark spot was spreading. I had to get like a – well, luckily I had had a tetanus booster, I guess, but yeah, I still have a hole in my leg.

Jensen: Our knives are clean.

Jared: And then they wrapped up, and then we had to shoot more, but there was still blood coming out and so they had to wrap it with gauze, but all that did was make the – so now blood was coming out like right here [gestures at leg] and right there? It was like, well -

Jensen: It wasn't a good wrap job.

Jared: No, the hole in my leg is fine, but outside of the gauze is still bleeding-

Jensen: I'd say it was almost a half inch into your -

Jared: Yeah, it got [?].

Jensen: quad there, it was, that was a good one. Anyway!

Jared: That was your question, right?

Jensen: That was our highlight of that episode.

Jared: What were you asking about? [audience laughs] Sorry.

Question: If the Castiel and Colette parallel was part of the plot or if it just kind of happened?

Jared [to Jensen]: I'll let you take this one.

Jensen [to Jared]: I think she really wanted to hear from you.

Jared: Um, I think that ... the parallel was on purpose, I think that one of the things our writers do very well, is play opposites and parallels? Perpendiculars and parallels, for you mathletes out there? And we see it a lot, we see it often with Sam and Dean. Like we saw Sam, for instance, in season 4, going through this change because he was becoming more powerful than he really knew how to take hold of. We kind of see that with Dean right now, we see the other brother - so we – they play a lot with how different characters will react in similar situations, so I think you noticing a parallel is a kudos to you, because I think it was done on purpose.

[wif-san]

There’s also the part where the fan asking the question (as shown in the transcript above) asks about the parallel SPECIFICALLY in the episode The Executioners Song, wherein Dean gives the First Blade to Cass TO HIDE. So, it’s only any kind of parallel if you really, super duper stretch it, and in reality it’s just common sense and logic.

After Dean killed Cain, he didn’t have to be begged to give up the first blade, he just up and handed it over to Cass because he wanted it to be hidden, so he couldn’t use it again. Cass makes the most sense as the one to hide the blade in this case, because as an angel, he can basically teleport wherever he wants, ergo he can travel as far away as possible WAY faster than Sam and Dean ever could, he can go places that they can’t, and they trusted him more than they trusted Crowley, hence Castiel was the most logical choice for who should hide the blade. It had nothing to do with feelings, or a parallel to Colette.

[novahazard24]

get your medals everyone

[spnpolls]

Do you think Dean was in love with Castiel ?

Yes

No

It’s complicated

Voting ended onMar 19

[samisadeangirl]

Reblogging because this clearly needs to circulate outside of the Destiel bubble more, given the current answers.

Yes, Dean likely loved Castiel as a close friend, even family--though it's arguable IMO how much that was by choice vs. not having other options because nearly all of his other loved ones died (and is it merely coincidence that Dean seemed to stop caring about the angel after Chuck was defeated?).

Dean however was never "in love" with Castiel because Dean is straight, isn't attracted to non-humans, rarely spends time with Cas outside of when one needs the other's help, doesn't react any differently to losing Cas than he does to other friends' deaths, and frankly treats him like crap most of the time (as Cas does to him). It's hard to take the idea of Dean being in love with Cas seriously when it's abundantly clear that not only does SAM always come first but also that the angel falls behind John, Mary, Bobby, and even Baby in Dean's priorities.

[wif-san]

Reblogging because I feel the need to add that Dean “loving” Cass as a friend and/or family was at least 90% lip service, AT LEAST. Like, that “friendship” was WAY more about TALKING about how they were friends, than either of them actually ACTING like friends. And I do mean friends, not allies, friends. In fact, now that I think about it, I’d call Dean and Castiel’s “friendship” a “lip-service friendship”.

[the-analytical-bostie]

still hating destiel???? in the big 2026????

I mean y’all are still forcing it on Jensen and hating on Jared for every little thing you can come up with in 2026, so yep, indeed we are!

[nancylou444]

Just like hellers are still hating on wincest in the year 2026.

[eisforeidolon]

Exactly this.

The problem has never been the ship, it's always been the shippers.

When hellers stop screaming that anyone who doesn't ship their ship is a homophobe...

When hellers stop being antis in the traditional sense and insisting not only is shipping wincest the grossest, most terrible fictional thing EVER but actually indicative of moral bankruptcy IRL (or Dean and Amara or Castiel and Meg or or or)...

When hellers stop insisting the literal only thing anyone could like about SPN or reason anyone could want a revival is because of their ship that actually existed in the canon and not just in their colorful context-free "interpretations" (it's canon but they need a revival to make it canon!!!)...

When hellers stop making bizarre, cult-y declarations about how D/C is/would be some groundbreaking, super important cause that would be such important good representation for all LGBT+ people, teach the world about love, change the tv landscape forever, etc. (despite, you know, the actual canon relationship)...

When hellers stop trying to ask Jensen the same fucking question via the fiftieth fucking new phrasing, desperately insisting he agrees with them if they could only find the magic question/situation to make him say so...

When hellers stop shoving porn in Jensen's face and weird demands to act out their RPF fetishes onto his social media or the social media of any project he's involved with, saying whacked shit about his father, and otherwise just generally being invasive fetishistic creeps with zero boundaries or respect for Jensen as an actual human person...

When hellers stop attacking Jared for literally existing because the show was actually about Sam and Dean and not Castiel and Dean, including literally wishing he would be injured or die just in the hopes of Jensen having to spend more time with Misha...

That's when I'll have no more problems with D/C than any other ship I don't ship. Ship and let ship, but stop trying to sink every other fucking boat on the ocean because you're obsessed creepy weirdos with the entitlement of a spoiled toddler.

[30-to-50-plastic-spiders]

I do feel that the first half of S8 really fumbles Sam’s character, not because of his hostility to Benny (though I do think it was woefully underutilised and under-explored) but because of the sheer lack of Sam warcrimes during Dean’s absence.

Whenever Dean is gone Sam goes completely batshit: we see this during Mystery Spot, following Dean’s death at the end of S3, and when Dean’s off having his ‘Summer of Crowley’. He would rather risk ending the world and die by Dean’s hand than live without his brother at the end of S10. And you’re telling me Dean gets whisked away at the end of S7 and Sam goes ‘well fuck time to settle down with my sexy lamp girlfriend/fiancée’

I want him doing blood magic in order to ouija board a vampire for info on Dean. I want him uncovering secrets forgotten by God himself to bring Dean back. I want him drunk dialling Crowley to find out where Dean went. I want him to kill at least a few people. Wtf.

[28confusedthoughts]

Respectfully, I disagree. All of these deaths or near deaths you're comparing dean's disappearance at the end of s7 to are under very different circumstances and therefore it makes perfect sense that sam would react to them differently.

In Mystery Spot, sam was a) convinced (or at the very least hopeful) that dean didn't actually die and it was just another trick from the trickster, so he had to hunt him down to make things right and b) dean's death was 'his fault' as in sam was the reason dean was not only going to die, but spend eternity in hell. And then dean 'died' prematurely, he didn't even get to live out his full year. So he not only believed/ hoped that dean didn't die permanently, he also couldn't live with the knowledge that dean was going to suffer till the end of times because he sold his soul for him. That's not a pretty thing to have on one's conscience. It makes sense for sam to try to turn off his emotions and focus all his energy on finding the trickster.

Same with end of s3, sam blamed himself for the death of dean, and he was also aware of the fact that dean was being tortured indefinitely in hell. So it makes sense that he broke down, i mean how can you even begin to deal with that emotionally? Sam was left alone in a world crawling with demons murdering people left and right after they failed to stop azazel from opening the gates of hell, his brother was downside being tortured after he met a very tragic and violent death, and all of this is sam's fault (in his mind). He is riddled with guilt and grieving, so when ruby offers him a way so save people, use his powers for good and at the same time hunt down lilith, possibly get dean out of hell but at the very least take revenge, it makes sense for sam to hold onto this last shred of hope and sense of control, after a whole year of helplessness.

At the end of s9 dean not only dies, he turns into a demon (a monster, the very thing dean despises the most), still roaming the earth, committing crimes and possibly murdering innocent people. Sam didn't have the opportunity to grieve dean and move on, because dean wasn't gone. It was not only his job to hunt down monsters, it was also something the real dean would've rather died than turn into. Sam knew of a way to save dean and also stop a demon from hurting people, so it made perfect sense that he would find dean even if that was the last thing he did.

(I wouldn't describe either of these reactions as 'sam goes completely batshit' but i digress)

But at the end of s7, dean just disappeared in an explosion. For all sam knew, he was dead and in heaven. He had no reason to think otherwise. It wasn't sam's fault dean died. He wasn't in hell, being tortured and then turned into a demon, but in heaven among his happiest memories. So while sam was miserable and grieving, but dean's death didn't warrant any action. One doesn't have to be 'saved' from heaven, where sam believed dean to be. They also learned the hard way, that bringing each otger back from the dead always resulted in some catastrophic consequences. So it makes perfect sense for him to —while simultaneously grieving his brother— try to move on with his life.

[wif-san]

Here’s the problem, Dean didn’t disappear in a chemical, mechanical, or any kind of explosion with actual combustion in it; he disappeared in an explosion of black Leviathan goo, which hadn’t at any point been proven to be harmful to humans. Hell, Bobby got splashed with some when he was experimenting on one to figure out what can hurt them, and he was fine. Secondly, there were no remains of any kind, thus no proof that Dean was dead, ergo Sam had actual reason to hold onto hope that Dean was alive, especially since Sam of all people knows that in that world disappeared doesn’t automatically mean dead.

So, in light of all of that, Sam really should have been trying to track Dean’s whereabouts down, even if only for the bare minimum of confirming where he was, because Sam didn’t actually know what happened to Dean, at best he had an ASSUMPTION (and an incorrect one at that). Also, in regards to your first 2 tags, no, Sam had already stopped wanting out of the hunting life by season 4 or 5, so yes, it was OOC for him to take that opportunity at that time, especially since he didn’t have any proof (or confirmation) what-so-ever that Dean was dead. Also, I’ve been racking by brain, and I can’t think of a single other time “presumed dead” has been good enough for either Winchester brother when it comes to each other.

[30-to-50-plastic-spiders]

I do feel that the first half of S8 really fumbles Sam’s character, not because of his hostility to Benny (though I do think it was woefully underutilised and under-explored) but because of the sheer lack of Sam warcrimes during Dean’s absence.

Whenever Dean is gone Sam goes completely batshit: we see this during Mystery Spot, following Dean’s death at the end of S3, and when Dean’s off having his ‘Summer of Crowley’. He would rather risk ending the world and die by Dean’s hand than live without his brother at the end of S10. And you’re telling me Dean gets whisked away at the end of S7 and Sam goes ‘well fuck time to settle down with my sexy lamp girlfriend/fiancée’

I want him doing blood magic in order to ouija board a vampire for info on Dean. I want him uncovering secrets forgotten by God himself to bring Dean back. I want him drunk dialling Crowley to find out where Dean went. I want him to kill at least a few people. Wtf.

[spntea]

I’m on the final episode of S5 with my husband. One thing that always annoyed me was the insistence of trying to make Dean and Lisa a thing. He had zero interest in having a ‘normal apple pie life,’ as Sam puts it. He would never have stopped trying to bring Sam back. It was OOC for them to have him agreeing to not trying and settling down with Lisa.

Whilst I do think the series went on for way too long, I’m so glad the whole thing didn’t end with Sam in the pit and Dean and Lisa settling down.

[bean4od-deactivated20260305]

I absolutely hated that, too. Dean and Lisa were an absolute snooze fest. Including in season 6.

I actually have the unpopular opinion that Swan Song is overrated. I think it’s fine as a season finale, but not the best one (that would be Sacrifice in my book). As a series finale it would have sucked ass, imho.

[spntea]

Swan Song is hugely overrated. I don’t know how it can have 9.7 on IMDb, it isn’t anywhere close to being the best season finale. It is honestly quite dull, and for a massive all out battle between Lucifer and Michael it just fell flat. I get it was supposed to end like that but…eh. I am happier not rewatching it tbh.

[nancylou444]

Actually, IF the show hadn't gotten renewed for a season 6, Swan Song would have ended differently.

Micheal would have possessed Dean (instead of Adam). Sam and/or Dean would have regained control of their bodies then BOTH would have jumped/fell into the cage.

Dean's "ending" with Lisa was only because it got renewed, along with including Adam.

[wif-san]

Also, while it isn’t portrayed in the end of Swan Song, in like episode 1 or 2 of season 6, after Sam saves Dean and Dean finds out that Sam is actually alive, while they’re talking, after Sam asks about Dean keeping his promises to him, Dean says “of course I didn’t stop looking for a way to get you out”. Now it wasn’t a 24/7 thing of course, but Dean didn’t actually give up on getting Sam out of the cage.

I also agree, the more I think about it, the less sense it makes to throw them together like a love story, when they were just a random one-night-stand for each other, especially since she has a kid to consider by the time they see each other again.

[graceintheplace]

I’m still kinda new 2 tumblr but is there any1 on this app who loves supernatural but doesn’t really bother with the shipping side of things? If so, can we please be friends?

I feel like a lot of people on this platform focus on romance and fanon ideas, which is totally fine, I just feel there’s so so much more to this show that isn’t talked about enough, and that romance was never really supposed to be the main subject.

Little side note: I promise I don’t hate shippers! (Except Wincesties — u guys are weird). It’s just not particularly my thing, but you’re still all really cool and I totally respect your opinions!

[nancylou444]

I don't hate shoppers Except wincesties

Oh yes, the SHIP AND LET SHIP bullshit that always has the disclaimer EXCEPT WINCESTIES.

Little girl, I have clothes older than you.

supernatural#sam winchester#dean winchester#castiel#spnfandom#hot take? Yeah, quite telling that you include Castiel.

[graceintheplace]

Well excuse me for not supporting LITERAL INSEST, which need I remind you is illegal in pretty much every country? Shouldn’t that maybe tell you something about the general population’s opinion on it?

I mean come on, you’re probably a forty-something year old woman, and you’re arguing with a random fifteen-year-old online about ships in a fictional show? Get a grip!

And imagine if your family found out this was what you did online. How would they react? How do you think your siblings, if you have them, (which I really hope you don’t) would react to hearing you support the shipping of 2 brothers? I imagine they’d be disgusted.

Also the fact you felt the need to call me a ‘little girl’ and resort to name-calling tells me you’re not the big mature adult you seem to think you are.

I hope this was the wake up call you needed to knock some sense into you.

[nancylou444]

Oh my dear child, this is going to be very entertaining for me.

Well excuse me for not supporting LITERAL INSEST, which need I remind you is illegal in pretty much every country? What exactly is 'insest'?

Shouldn’t that maybe tell you something about the general population’s opinion on it? We are talking about FICTION, child. And Supernatural is NOT the first show/book to have INCEST in it.

I mean come on, you’re probably a forty-something year old woman, and you’re arguing with a random fifteen-year-old online about ships in a fictional show? Get a grip! Maybe you need to mind your manners, child and show some respect to your elders. A 'random fifteen year old' who puts their ship hate in the general tags is looking for a fight from fans who have been watching the show since it originally aired, which is before YOU were even born.

And imagine if your family found out this was what you did online. How would they react? Once again, because you are that stupid. IT'S FICTION. Why the hell would my family care?

How do you think your siblings, if you have them, (which I really hope you don’t) would react to hearing you support the shipping of 2 brothers? I imagine they’d be disgusted. I have two younger sisters and again IT'S FICTION, you jackass.

Also the fact you felt the need to call me a ‘little girl’ and resort to name-calling tells me you’re not the big mature adult you seem to think you are. Calling you 'little girl' is name calling? Wow, you are a pampered little princess, aren't ya. This big mature adult is ending this nonsense right now by blocking you.

[wif-san]

Lol I always wonder if people like OP are intentionally obtuse, or actually that media illiterate. Like, it’s right there in the show, to the point that even non-Wincest-shipping bibros understand where wincest shippers are coming from, even the ones that are icked-out by even fictional incest pairings. This leads into the point that at least the overwhelming majority of Wincest shippers don’t ship it because it’s incest, but IN SPITE of that fact, as most had no intention of shipping an incestuous pairing, certainly in Spn, but canon continuously slapped us in the face with it, so here we are.

While I think everyone should just mind their own business when it comes to people’s fictional interests, if the sensitive babies and asshole with an agenda really must blame someone over Wincest, they should blame the writers and TPTB, not the fans, as it was the writers and TPTB that wrote Sam and Dean as absolutely batshit insane over each other such as:

Dean literally slapping Sam on the ass and calling him “honey”, being that Dean didn’t need to go that far, and they could have easily gone with a shot that didn’t have Jensen slapping Jared’s ass, and yet they went with the ass-slap shot. (S1 Ep8 Bugs)

Dean saying (in a roundabout way) that he couldn’t live without Sam. (S2 finale)

Sam going nuts trying to keep Dean from Dying in Mystery Spot, and then turning into robo-Sam during the 6 month stretch that Dean is dead near the end of the episode. (3x11 Mystery Spot)

Dean’s siren, by it’s own admission, being a little brother intent on replacing Sam. (4x14 Sex and Violence)

Dean using the words “Deep, abiding love for each other” to describe his and Sam’s relationship in 8x1 We Need to Talk About Kevin, which sure is not inherently romantic, but is usually used to describe romantic relationships.

Dean declares (to Sam) that Sam is the most important person to him, above all others. (S8 finale)

Sam and Dean’s Bromeo and Juliet episode. (11x17 Red Meat)

And these are just the tip of the iceberg, to illustrate my point that the fans didn’t come up with Wincest. The writers effectively wrote emotional incest into the actual show, and some of us just decided to have some fictional fun with it, that’s it.

[graceintheplace]

You’re taking the piss, right?

I am so sick of all you wincest shippers using the fact that it’s fiction to excuse your behaviour. I don’t care if it’s fiction, it’s still wrong.

I understand that fiction and reality are different things, but I also know how big of an influence fiction can have on reality too.

If you start off just reading fiction about incest and gradually start consuming more and more, it may seem harmless, but overtime you’ll become desensitised to it.

It works in the same way as violence in the media. The more violence you see in TV shows and films (in which there has been a massive increase over the past couple of decades), the less of an impact it starts to have on you, leading to less of an emotional response. Overtime, you may get bored of the same content and start watching things with more extreme violence to get that emotional response.

This leads to the normalisation of aggressive behaviours, as if you repeatedly see people getting into fights and punching each other, for example, your brain starts to register that as an acceptable thing to do, which influences how you behave in real life.

This process of desensitisation can also be sped up and escalated if the people you surround yourself with have similar beliefs, even if they’re just people you’ve met online.

For example, in politics, you can start out as having centre right wing beliefs, but if you go online and start liking posts of people who share similar views to you, it begins to create an echo chamber, where you’re only exposed to voices, opinions and information that matches what you believe in.

Overtime the algorithm will start gradually exposing you to people who share slightly more extreme views, until eventually, without even realising it, you’re now surrounded by people who share far right wing ideologies, and because you have no other input from different perspectives, you see this as the norm.

It’s the exact same concept that applies to you and other Wincest shippers. The more you read, the more desensitised to it you become, and as you surround yourself with other people online who think the same way, it becomes the norm for you.

If you believe something is normal and acceptable in society, the chances of you engaging in it in real life becomes higher. (Now I’m not saying that everyone who reads Wincest is going to go out and marry their sibling, I’m just saying they’re more susceptible to thinking that’s okay than someone who doesn’t read it).

So yes, I am completely aware that fiction and reality are different things, but what you and a lot of others don’t seem to understand is just how big of an impact one can have on the other.

And as for the writers? I kind of agree that some of what they put in that show is dodgy and could be interpreted differently, but they were wrong for that, and for the most part, any mention of incest was intended as a joke and was poked fun at.

That’s made especially obvious in 4x18 ‘the monsters at the end of this book’, when Sam and Dean physically grimace at finding out people ship them online, and state “they do know we’re brothers, right?” reinforcing the belief that they too, believe Wincest is wrong.

As for the way Sam and Dean can’t seem to function without each other? That’s just a representation of their insanely unhealthy physiological codependency on each other, not romantic feelings. They grew up with an absent father and nobody else to rely on but each other. Their messed up dependency on each other is a direct consequence of that.

There are also many other examples of codependent relationships in TV where the relationship isn’t romantic. E.g. in Gilmore girls, Rory and Lorelai are heavily codependent on each other, and they’re mother and daughter.

By the way, why does every Wincest shipper I’ve encountered insist on highlighting my age? It doesn’t matter if I’m 15 or 50, my opinions on Wincest aren’t going to change. Find a different way to try and belittle me, or better yet? Don’t belittle me at all. You should be mature enough to engage in a discussion without using insults.

Now if you read this and decide I’m right, that’s great. Good for you. But realistically I know the chances of that happening are very slim.

If it turns out that you read through all this and still hold your original opinions, that’s fine too. I know I can’t change the way you think. I just wanted to give you a different perspective and share my thoughts.

If it is the case of you still support Wincest (which I imagine it is) I don’t want a reply from you. If you decide you think my opinion is wrong, just block me. It’s easier that way, and I don’t want to get into an argument if it’s not going to go anywhere.

[wif-san]

Ok, I’ll keep this short, and I’d first like to clarify that I (as are all wincesties) am fully aware that Sam and Dean were 100% platonic the entire series, and definitely had no sexual interest in each other. The only other thing I’ll mention is that while there is a discussion to be had about the effects of fiction on reality and vice versa, it’s not as simple as you’ve put it, as people can continually engage in dark pieces of media and maintain the knowledge of what is and isn’t acceptable in society, and anyone who doesn’t because of fiction should genuinely seek psychiatric help. As a quick example to wrap this up, I love thriller movies, movies with action, suspense and adrenaline, so much so that I’ve gotten into horror movies, and yet I am still viscerally aware of how horrible murder is in real life, and how unacceptable it is in society.

[graceintheplace]

I’m still kinda new 2 tumblr but is there any1 on this app who loves supernatural but doesn’t really bother with the shipping side of things? If so, can we please be friends?

I feel like a lot of people on this platform focus on romance and fanon ideas, which is totally fine, I just feel there’s so so much more to this show that isn’t talked about enough, and that romance was never really supposed to be the main subject.

Little side note: I promise I don’t hate shippers! (Except Wincesties — u guys are weird). It’s just not particularly my thing, but you’re still all really cool and I totally respect your opinions!

[nancylou444]

I don't hate shoppers Except wincesties

Oh yes, the SHIP AND LET SHIP bullshit that always has the disclaimer EXCEPT WINCESTIES.

Little girl, I have clothes older than you.

supernatural#sam winchester#dean winchester#castiel#spnfandom#hot take? Yeah, quite telling that you include Castiel.

[graceintheplace]

Well excuse me for not supporting LITERAL INSEST, which need I remind you is illegal in pretty much every country? Shouldn’t that maybe tell you something about the general population’s opinion on it?

I mean come on, you’re probably a forty-something year old woman, and you’re arguing with a random fifteen-year-old online about ships in a fictional show? Get a grip!

And imagine if your family found out this was what you did online. How would they react? How do you think your siblings, if you have them, (which I really hope you don’t) would react to hearing you support the shipping of 2 brothers? I imagine they’d be disgusted.

Also the fact you felt the need to call me a ‘little girl’ and resort to name-calling tells me you’re not the big mature adult you seem to think you are.

I hope this was the wake up call you needed to knock some sense into you.

[nancylou444]

Oh my dear child, this is going to be very entertaining for me.

Well excuse me for not supporting LITERAL INSEST, which need I remind you is illegal in pretty much every country? What exactly is 'insest'?

Shouldn’t that maybe tell you something about the general population’s opinion on it? We are talking about FICTION, child. And Supernatural is NOT the first show/book to have INCEST in it.

I mean come on, you’re probably a forty-something year old woman, and you’re arguing with a random fifteen-year-old online about ships in a fictional show? Get a grip! Maybe you need to mind your manners, child and show some respect to your elders. A 'random fifteen year old' who puts their ship hate in the general tags is looking for a fight from fans who have been watching the show since it originally aired, which is before YOU were even born.

And imagine if your family found out this was what you did online. How would they react? Once again, because you are that stupid. IT'S FICTION. Why the hell would my family care?

How do you think your siblings, if you have them, (which I really hope you don’t) would react to hearing you support the shipping of 2 brothers? I imagine they’d be disgusted. I have two younger sisters and again IT'S FICTION, you jackass.

Also the fact you felt the need to call me a ‘little girl’ and resort to name-calling tells me you’re not the big mature adult you seem to think you are. Calling you 'little girl' is name calling? Wow, you are a pampered little princess, aren't ya. This big mature adult is ending this nonsense right now by blocking you.

[wif-san]

Lol I always wonder if people like OP are intentionally obtuse, or actually that media illiterate. Like, it’s right there in the show, to the point that even non-Wincest-shipping bibros understand where wincest shippers are coming from, even the ones that are icked-out by even fictional incest pairings. This leads into the point that at least the overwhelming majority of Wincest shippers don’t ship it because it’s incest, but IN SPITE of that fact, as most had no intention of shipping an incestuous pairing, certainly in Spn, but canon continuously slapped us in the face with it, so here we are.

While I think everyone should just mind their own business when it comes to people’s fictional interests, if the sensitive babies and asshole with an agenda really must blame someone over Wincest, they should blame the writers and TPTB, not the fans, as it was the writers and TPTB that wrote Sam and Dean as absolutely batshit insane over each other such as:

Dean literally slapping Sam on the ass and calling him “honey”, being that Dean didn’t need to go that far, and they could have easily gone with a shot that didn’t have Jensen slapping Jared’s ass, and yet they went with the ass-slap shot. (S1 Ep8 Bugs)

Dean saying (in a roundabout way) that he couldn’t live without Sam. (S2 finale)

Sam going nuts trying to keep Dean from Dying in Mystery Spot, and then turning into robo-Sam during the 6 month stretch that Dean is dead near the end of the episode. (3x11 Mystery Spot)

Dean’s siren, by it’s own admission, being a little brother intent on replacing Sam. (4x14 Sex and Violence)

Dean using the words “Deep, abiding love for each other” to describe his and Sam’s relationship in 8x1 We Need to Talk About Kevin, which sure is not inherently romantic, but is usually used to describe romantic relationships.

Dean declares (to Sam) that Sam is the most important person to him, above all others. (S8 finale)

Sam and Dean’s Bromeo and Juliet episode. (11x17 Red Meat)

And these are just the tip of the iceberg, to illustrate my point that the fans didn’t come up with Wincest. The writers effectively wrote emotional incest into the actual show, and some of us just decided to have some fictional fun with it, that’s it.