Stephanie Brown, Spoiler, Robin, Batgirl

[fantastic-nonsense]

Hello! Do you know why Tim or Dick are not part of the “Dead Robins Club” which I understand is Jason, Stephanie, and Damian? Jason is obvious, but Stephanie’s death was retconned from what I checked. Damian shouldn’t count either since he was always meant to come back by DC writers. If it’s based on who was thought of as “dead” in universe wouldn’t Tim have been included since everyone mourned him too? The criteria for it sounds picky lmao so I would like to know why it is only those 3.

Short answer: Tim doesn't count regardless because he never died (his death was faked by Mr. Oz/Jor-El) and fans knew that the second it happened. Thus, he doesn't get a claim on the 'Dead Robins Club,' which in fandom terms only applies to characters who have actually died and been intended to be percieved that way by the narrative at some point.

Dick is the boundary walker because he didn't actually properly die; he flatlined and then was immediately resuscitated within about a minute in-universe and half an issue IRL. I don't personally consider him a member because he did not suffer medical death in-universe and was always meant to survive IRL. So for me Dick's fakeout near-death in Forever Evil doesn't count any more than Tim's fakeout near-death in Contagion does. If it's not a real death that is intended to be percieved by readers as a permanent state, I don't count it.

Meanwhile, Jason's, Steph's, and Damian's deaths were all intended to be both genuine and permanent and were written as such. Their deaths were shown on panel, and had both impact and fallout attached to them. Even if Steph's death was eventually retconned to say that she never died, we saw her die on panel and she was treated as legitimately dead by the narrative for four years (up to and including Tim and Cass seeing/interacting with her ghost on multiple occasions). That's why they're the three that count for the purposes of the fandom's Dead Robins Club.

For a longer answer, I once went over Dick's "death/non-death" controversy here; I also discussed Steph and Cass's deaths in that response.

[dork-knight-stephanie]

[dork-knight-stephanie]

Has Steph ever worn leather?

Some of the skins she wore as Katavi could have been tanned hides. But her suits are usually a flame retardant kevlar mix weave fiber. Except the first Spoiler suit and her first Robin suit, both of which she made in her bedroom.

She likes making costumes out of whatever is around.

So... short answer; maybe. Unlikely, but maybe.

[dork-knight-stephanie]

One break.

One singular break.

Please.

[dork-knight-stephanie]

War Games: killed by Black Mask

DCeased: killed by Black Manta

I have the fear that Tom Taylor is going to kill Steph again in Dark Knights of Steel.

And it'll be like, the Black Knight or something.

[dork-knight-stephanie]

It wasn't Tom Taylor and Black Knights I had to watch out for.

Big Rip.

Fucking CLUEMASTER of all people.

[dork-knight-stephanie]

Just one break would be nice

Please

I don't ask for much

[dork-knight-stephanie]

Hello? Umm... Spoiler rules?

Stephanie Brown best girl.

[drbatsponge]

[dork-knight-stephanie]

Screaming, crying

[celestialdevils]

DC massacred Barbara’s entire character and made their most iconic female disabled hero abled body just so they could market her to younger girls as this quirky and sarcastic #girlboss batgirl… all while Steph was RIGHT THERE.

Like I just can’t explain how stupid of a decision it was. Barbara was a grown 30 year old woman who was done with Batgirl before she became paralyzed. She wanted to grow up and get a degree. But DC now portrays her as an immature 19 year old who’s whole life was ruined by not being able to be Batgirl. BARBARA WAS DONE WITH BATGIRL BEFORE JOKER! HE TOOK NOTHING FROM HER!

Barbara as Oracle is the peak of her character. She’s a literal god of information, a one in a million. What’s she as Batgirl? Another person in Gotham who punches ok? She didn’t even want to be Batgirl. The name wasn’t her choice, and she had no emotional connection to it. To Stephanie, Batgirl is her peak. It’s the culmination of her acceptance of her new family and acceptance of herself. To Barbara, Batgirl is the childhood play pretend before she grew up and found her actual superhero calling.

Barbara had been Oracle for over a decade by the time they started clawing at the walls trying to reboot her as Batgirl. While they could have put all that effort into properly marketing Steph’s Batgirl run… cause Stephanie is the snarky teenager they want Barbara to be so bad! Make merch of HER on 10 year old’s backpacks and dolls! I don’t want to see T-Shirts of Barbara with random OCs or Gotham girls she’s never interacted with in canon with a slapped on “girl power” tagline! Give me Cass and Steph merch! You know! The actual batGIRLs. Barbara is a WOMAN!

[horchenhearken]

one day you will be your own bat

[dork-knight-stephanie]

😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭

[incoherentbabblings]

Stephanie knows how to piano and we LOVE. But there’s also one of another things she can do.

Ping pong.

Steph continuing to have a monstrous right hook and it comes out in odd and unusual ways. Her spike in volleyball is concussion inducing. Her smash in tennis is targeted always at the groin.

[dork-knight-stephanie]

[dork-knight-stephanie]

Ok, so the WFA issue was cute.

Steph wants her place.

Tim supporting.

Nice and all.

But are we just gonna ignore that it's the vigilantes of Gotham that gave her that inferiority complex and trauma to begin with?

[anniebuddy]

This makes me >:|.

Because in some ways it’s true,

But I also hate that it’s true.

For me, Steph’s underlying anger should be as much a defining part of her character as her never-say-die positivity.

Robin #16

Showcase ‘95 #5

Robin #107

Steph’s anger is born from the conditions she was raised under, and likely even some genetic inheritance from her father.

Robin #111

Anger like that doesn’t ever really become “cured”, in my experience. But that doesn’t mean it has to be a bad thing! It’s not as if Steph is constantly enraged at everyone and everything, for one. And I believe that Steph’s anger is part of what drives her forward. She’s ANGRY about the injustices levied against her. She’s ANGRY about the injustices levied against everyone.

Batgirl #53

She’s angry about living in a city where little girls can go through unimaginable trauma, like that which she’s experienced. And that’s a big reason as to why she took up the mask, and stuck with it. Heroics are a “thrill” for her, sure - but the reason they’re a thrill is because she feels like she’s taking control of her life, and her shitty experiences, and putting them towards something good. And her anger is what fuels her to keep going, even when insecurity and doubt tries to keep her down.

For better, or for worse.

Batgirl #54

FWIW, I don’t think every modern interpretation of Steph has forgone her angry side! I actually think there’s a lot of examples of series’ taking it into consideration.

Wayne Family Adventures #32 - All Seeing (Part 1)

Also responsible for carrying on the trademark Stephanie Brown Sass™.

Detective Comics (2016) #945

Okay, not a huge fan of how Tynion writes Steph, and her motivations in this run of Tec feel OOC as hell most of the time - but…she’s got a strong backbone again! So that’s something.

But I think starting somewhere around her Batgirl run (which I still love, don’t get me wrong), we’ve seen Steph be steadily “feminized” by her writers - with her insecurities and self-doubt being played way up, and her anger and feistiness being played way down.

[dork-knight-stephanie]

Angry girl needs to be able to rage against the machine

[our-happygirl500-fan]

To anyone who says that Steph & Cass should stay Spoiler & Orphan over being called Batgirl because those are their ‘original’ ‘unique’ identities that they ‘created for themselves’ I ask of you have they ever gotten a solo or ongoing under the names Spoiler & Orphan?

Unless you can show me a Spoiler or Orphan solo that I’ve somehow missed its Batgirl or bust for me

[dork-knight-stephanie]

I'd also like to add; babs didn't get her own ongoing until she was Oracle... sooooo

Maybe we should just let the superior batgirls... be superior. But what would I know.

[dailydccomics]

Batgirl’s Black Mercy hallucinations 

Batgirl vol 3 #24

[dork-knight-stephanie]

Our best girls dreams

[dailydccomics]

she has the most fun being Batgirl and I love that for her

Batgirl vol 3 #20-21

[dork-knight-stephanie]

She's a real pain in the ass like that