"We use abolish instead of reform because the system we envision is so different from what we currently have that it's essentially a completely different thing"
Understandable, but I need you to understand that if you say "abolish prisons", absolutely nobody is going to assume you mean "switch to a model of imprisonment focused on rehabilitation and reparative rather than punitive justice". They are just gonna assume you mean what you said, which is that you want to abolish prisons.
"Well it should be obvious because of course no one is actually suggesting that we just let criminals roam around freely raping and murdering people"
There are people are in my notes right now advocating for exactly that
"I do want to abolish prisons and replace them with therapy instead"
Feels like abolishing prisons to be replaced with involuntary commitment to a psych ward until you can reprogram someone sounds like it's gonna come with a new but very similar set of problems tbh
"I didn't say it had to be involuntary commitment but increasing community support, mental health treatment, and eradicating poverty will do far more to reduce crime than prisons ever will".
I agree with you! Does not in the slightest answer the question about what we should do with people who hurt others.
"Reform is too slow and not enough, we just need to tear it all down and start fresh".
Yeah that all sounds good until you realize that you're talking about people's actual lives and not, like, a woodworking project that got away from you. Societal systems are insanely complex and designing and implementing a brand new system is not like clicking "new save file" on a video game - it's going to take just as much time and effort as reform will and you're going to encounter very similar problems along the way.
"The police won't let us reform them and that's why we need abolition instead"
Absolutely fascinated by the idea that the police won't let us reform them but they WILL let us abolish them. I'm also excited to find out what we're replacing them with that isn't a police force but also isn't just vigilantism.
"Nobody is suggesting replacing the police with roaming squads of vigilantes, you're obviously just constructing a bad strawman".
I mean they're not CALLING it that, but we've tried the whole "let communities police themselves" thing and it resulted in a shit ton of people being lynched or murdered for being the wrong skin tone or religion or ethnicity, or for being neurodivergent or disabled or queer, or just for having bad vibes. A formal justice system doesn't erase those biases, but I'd sure as hell rather have a trial with a judge and standards of evidence and the possibility of appeal rather than relying on my neighbors who fly the confederate flag in NY to vouch for me.
